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Re: I concede that the rank and file likely don't meet in large groups DomA Send a noteboard - 15/10/2012 02:28:45 PM
The passage I was thinking of was actually in reference to the SC not the general BA.

But the even being in a room with a hooded SC group is telling. Let's say Katerine is called in to meet with the SC ... they are all hooded. Do you think she would miss Galina in that group? As far as we know there are maybe a dozen or so women in her Strength category or above. At the very least Katerine knows one of those few women is BA. From there it wouldn't take much to figure out which one ... especially if she starts getting instruction to push Galina forward for a new role or some such.

Verin didn't need to be SC for her to have managed the feat she did... she just needed to figure out ways around her new Oaths.


Verin didn't need to be a member of the SC to work to identify sisters, but she's pretty old and given her other goals (of learning as much as she could of the DO's plans, from the Forsaken etc.), it's a position she would have made everything she could to obtain, and given how many times she was involved without raising suspicion (from Alviarin), I suspect she was very high ranking indeed. Next to Galina in rank is certainly a possibility, she seemed to know Alviarin was the leader of the SC. Alviarin brought her to Fal Dara where she's the BA who got close to Siuan/Moiraine there, she was the one who disappeared to tail Rand, who brought back the Horn to the WT, who let the BA know about Siuan's hunt, she was let again be in Rand's entourage (and decided at a crucial point she had to disappear, it speaks of her being known to the Forsaken and their spy etc.). That she was Alviarin's most trusted agent and one of the two women she could speak to openly as leader of the SC would make a lot of sense. More sense than if Verin is only a rank-and-file who gets written orders but seems to meddle of her own initiative a whole lot. In her scene with Egwene, Verin alludes to a debate about letting her or not give notes to Egwene about the 13 BA who went to Tear, and deciding she had no choice. I'm pretty sure the SC doesn't debate things with rank-and-file, that this was a debate among the SC Verin was part of.

I think we've seen the SC in action on screen only once in the series (well that and their capture of Tamra, but for this we know only Galina was involved, and the Tower Coup where we saw mostly Alviarin/Sheriam/Galina), and it's in the debate about dwindling that went on for years - the top dividing debate among AS - where they appeared to work in coordination.... three women we know were involved personally where Alviarin, Verin and Sheriam.. and unknown Reds with whom Sheriam was nearly coming to shouting matches. The whole ploy would have been far easier to organize among SC members than by messages sent by rank-and-file.

For Sheriam it's an implication she made in her POV that she strived for a high rank by ambition. Her strength, her key position, the fact she remained mostly in the WT, had the trust and friendship of the Amyrlin and the fact she was a very high ranking Blue would make her a likely candidate to enter the council. In the Tower Coup, Sheriam played a key role, pretending to fight, and organizing the escape of many novices and most of the Accepted. She was likely still a junior member, but I think she's one of those BA who knew a lot of the actual plans (most of the rank-and-file BA don't seem to have known much about what truly happened with the Tower Coup).

As for the meetings, I don't debate the fact they could narrow down and puzzle out who the members were based on strength, I just find it fairly obvious RJ would not have overlooked this and maniacal about such details as he was, he no doubt conceived of a trick they used. It would be more profitable to discuss how they possibly did that then debate whether this was a huge mistake by RJ (which seems to be your point).

Brandon pretty much deprived us of whatever "BA resolution" RJ had in mind to offer by failing to continue Alviarin's storyline. For a few books, RJ was starting to reveal internal details about the BA, knowing their downfall was coming and how. At the end, Alviarin was on to Talene and the hunters, and getting close to Egwene. She appeared in a chapter written or outlined by RJ, then nothing. We'll probably have to wait for the Encyclopedia to discover many of the details concerning the organization that RJ could have used in Alviarin's last pre-purge POVs. RJ'S method to start with the core then work outward by adding layers seems to have disserved us with Egwene's storyline, especially with the BA hunt. We got the core more or less intact, without the missing layers (counter POV and so on) RJ would have worked on at a later stage.
This message last edited by DomA on 15/10/2012 at 02:32:36 PM
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Misc observations from my latest re-read - 14/10/2012 08:26:37 PM 2830 Views
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Re: Again, my point isn't about motivations for Elaida or Gitara ... that is clear - 15/10/2012 03:15:18 AM 1036 Views
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Re: Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 18/10/2012 01:23:48 AM 1020 Views
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Was Sheriam ranking? Would many of them have met her? Not everyone even gets to meet the SC. - 15/10/2012 03:23:16 AM 991 Views
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Re: Was Sheriam ranking? Would many of them have met her? Not everyone even gets to meet the SC. - 15/10/2012 03:52:39 AM 997 Views
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Re: She is not dissimilar to Sheriam when she made her rise IMO - 18/10/2012 08:10:58 PM 998 Views
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Re: No others meet as well - 14/10/2012 11:36:50 PM 1009 Views
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Re: Yet rank and file BA have methods of communicating - 15/10/2012 03:26:59 AM 954 Views
I concede that the rank and file likely don't meet in large groups - 15/10/2012 04:54:04 AM 921 Views
Re: I concede that the rank and file likely don't meet in large groups - 15/10/2012 02:28:45 PM 1036 Views
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Re: I agree that RJ probably had some thing up his sleeve - 15/10/2012 05:57:04 PM 1139 Views
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Re: Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 04:59:25 PM 1053 Views
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Don't put words in my mouth that I never said - 19/10/2012 04:08:22 AM 892 Views
double post *NM* - 19/10/2012 04:08:22 AM 586 Views
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Re: Is there a Dark Friend WO? - 17/10/2012 08:33:27 PM 1122 Views
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Re: Galad and Gaywn ... Channlers? - 14/10/2012 11:36:25 PM 1098 Views

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