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You raise an interesting possibility guttering flame Send a noteboard - 03/12/2010 06:44:18 AM
All right, that would be reasonable. But Wolf souls die for good in the Dreamworld because that's where dead wolves go. Aside from Heroes of the Horn, dead humans don't go to the Dreamworld, do they?


RJ said there's an afterworld where souls go to await rebirth. If it's TAR for humans too, it's not in the same dimension of TAR.
Hopper had no idea where humans go.

My hunch is that wolfbrothers become wolves in TAR after they die however, so perhaps Hopper's warning is true enough for Perrin. It may also be true if you die in TAR while there in the flesh. Perhaps your soul then becomes "lost", unable to reach the "soul pool".

Hopper may be quite wrong too, even about the wolves. Perhaps the wolves that die in TAR simply stop being reincarnated as wolves to rejoin the soul pool, and that's why the wolves believe these souls have died the final death (perhaps the souls of those wolves that died in TAR when they are reborn as human become wolfbrothers?). As RJ pointed out, souls are immortal - not even balefire can destroy them. It's very curious that dying in TAR while not incarnated (or even when incarnated) would destroy your soul. I suspect only Shai'tan can destroy souls.

Depending if Rand literally "dies" or not, I guess we might learn more about the afterlife in the last book.


But both the wolves and the Heroes of the Horns say how final death in TAR is for them.

If they're both wrong than I'm wrong but if they're right I should be right about the human dreamers as well. TAR seems to have a lot of subsections. A part that reflects the real world, a part that houses the Heroes of the Horn, a part that looks like the eternal hunting grounds, parts reflecting other worlds and so forth. Soul-pool should be a part of it as well. Non-heroic humans shouldn't be a unique phenomenon among all other living beings.

Also, if the wolves Slyaer killed became wolf-brothers would there now be hundreds of brother-babies and toddlers? The new age is looking to be a technological age, not a mythical one so that wouldn't fit in. I had a thought that one of the Dragon's tasks is to right all the wrongs the DO wrought, chief among them restoring all the souls he destroyed, swallowed, twisted, killed and used.
This message last edited by guttering flame on 03/12/2010 at 06:48:51 AM
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Egwene and the WIse Ones don't know the most basic thing about Teleranriod guttering flame - 02/12/2010 10:43:16 PM 1960 Views
IIRC Nicola was killed by a Black Ajah Sister and Egwene had tried to save her. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/12/2010 10:52:01 PM 1161 Views
Yes, I meant allowing her near the battle in the first place guttering flame - 03/12/2010 06:28:45 AM 765 Views
And who would enforce those rules? j-whitt987 - 03/12/2010 12:42:33 PM 883 Views
Also, I'm not sure how you could expect the Wise Ones to know that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/12/2010 02:51:43 PM 758 Views
How do you figure? Fanatic-Templar - 02/12/2010 10:55:15 PM 964 Views
Re: How do you figure? malekithe - 02/12/2010 11:06:29 PM 1053 Views
may, being the operative word. LadyLorraine - 02/12/2010 11:12:49 PM 878 Views
except for the part of the soul that stays in the sleeping body, like they've explained many times. *NM* nigelgoboom - 02/12/2010 11:16:43 PM 420 Views
mmm fair point. maybe if you were there "too strongly"? LadyLorraine - 02/12/2010 11:18:50 PM 882 Views
right. but i dont think 'too strongly' ever means completely. maybe in the flesh or something *NM* nigelgoboom - 03/12/2010 01:24:38 AM 446 Views
This doesn't make a lot of sense guttering flame - 03/12/2010 06:37:02 AM 819 Views
They also told Perrin that about... j-whitt987 - 03/12/2010 12:55:57 AM 964 Views
yes, that is another confounding factor LadyLorraine - 03/12/2010 09:14:35 AM 821 Views
Oh, I see. Fanatic-Templar - 02/12/2010 11:45:37 PM 924 Views
Re: Oh, I see. DomA - 03/12/2010 02:29:30 AM 931 Views
Re: Oh, I see. Fanatic-Templar - 03/12/2010 02:45:59 AM 858 Views
He isn't a wolfbrother Timthetrolloc - 03/12/2010 05:43:06 AM 895 Views
Maybe he hadn't discovered it yet. Fanatic-Templar - 03/12/2010 06:21:22 AM 800 Views
He'd be a shadowbrother-brother guttering flame - 03/12/2010 06:51:59 AM 731 Views
You raise an interesting possibility guttering flame - 03/12/2010 06:44:18 AM 995 Views
Wolfbrothers are going to be part of the next age. Fanatic-Templar - 03/12/2010 07:05:30 AM 756 Views
I thought they were just a transitional thing guttering flame - 03/12/2010 07:13:17 AM 842 Views
I doubt it, that Age is ours. Fanatic-Templar - 03/12/2010 09:33:03 PM 756 Views
Uhm, TOTALLY. LadyLorraine - 03/12/2010 10:00:01 PM 715 Views
GASP! *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 04/12/2010 06:59:09 AM 493 Views
I know RJ said something guttering flame - 04/12/2010 06:15:51 AM 731 Views
Re: I know RJ said something Fanatic-Templar - 04/12/2010 07:05:50 AM 814 Views
So... guttering flame - 04/12/2010 07:24:07 AM 838 Views
Re: So... Fanatic-Templar - 04/12/2010 10:12:45 AM 796 Views
Of course... DomA - 05/12/2010 08:21:05 PM 888 Views
If the first age is the Technological / Scientific Age guttering flame - 06/12/2010 06:33:18 AM 867 Views
I don't see why they would have to be unique themes. LadyLorraine - 06/12/2010 07:04:08 AM 798 Views
I don't even know why they're supposed to be mutually exclusive. *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 06/12/2010 07:37:35 AM 418 Views
Re: I don't see why they would have to be unique themes. guttering flame - 06/12/2010 08:14:15 AM 781 Views
uhm, duh, stonehedge. LadyLorraine - 04/12/2010 07:11:44 PM 749 Views
No, because Heroes and Wolves are both different from run of the mill humans LadyLorraine - 03/12/2010 09:19:05 AM 863 Views
That's far from "the most basic" thing and it is entirely excusable that they do not know it. LadyLorraine - 02/12/2010 11:17:46 PM 927 Views
Re: That's far from "the most basic" thing and it is entirely excusable that they do not know it. DomA - 03/12/2010 02:42:39 AM 874 Views
It could be extrapolated from the fact that it's souls that inhabit it guttering flame - 03/12/2010 06:54:40 AM 804 Views
You're caving to bias from being outside the story with more information than any single character. LadyLorraine - 03/12/2010 09:13:12 AM 821 Views
Don't forget the Heroes guttering flame - 03/12/2010 09:34:43 AM 705 Views
I think that she meant that comment as more for the "hero" version Apsalar Shadowdancer - 03/12/2010 10:57:38 AM 761 Views
Maybe this should be a question for Sanderson? guttering flame - 03/12/2010 11:43:54 AM 774 Views
that's only because you're stubbornly holding to yours, despite everyone indicating its errors *NM* LadyLorraine - 03/12/2010 05:29:15 PM 489 Views
Obviously my tenacity indicates that I have a worthy point guttering flame - 03/12/2010 07:06:18 PM 590 Views
Perrin doesn't count since his information is from Hopper LadyLorraine - 03/12/2010 09:58:01 PM 790 Views
So it's my evidence against your non-evidence? guttering flame - 04/12/2010 06:05:41 AM 850 Views
why are you assuming that all souls are the same? LadyLorraine - 04/12/2010 07:18:10 PM 1060 Views
1. You're wrong. 2. Even if you're right, how would they know? beetnemesis - 03/12/2010 05:28:33 AM 1009 Views
Maybe, but I bet they can spell it. Joel - 03/12/2010 05:43:28 AM 839 Views
Incidentally, wouldn't that mean it is safer to go to Tel'aran'rhiod in the flesh? *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 03/12/2010 09:35:21 PM 417 Views
I'm more inclined to believe that being killed in the flesh in TAR darius_sedai - 04/12/2010 07:35:15 PM 705 Views
Where does that reasoning begin? Fanatic-Templar - 04/12/2010 07:53:42 PM 1272 Views
Perhaps it's more of a matter that the "usual route" may be altered? LadyLorraine - 04/12/2010 10:20:51 PM 684 Views
But human souls don't go to Tel'aran'rhiod, from what we know. Fanatic-Templar - 04/12/2010 11:19:53 PM 704 Views
maybe it does? LadyLorraine - 05/12/2010 12:18:05 AM 1035 Views
So do we have any reason to believe this is the case? *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 05/12/2010 02:48:48 AM 402 Views
I don't think so. It's not really something that's discussed LadyLorraine - 05/12/2010 03:19:37 AM 566 Views
I'm pondering too darius_sedai - 05/12/2010 03:04:10 PM 864 Views
Not @ all - if humans regularly go to TAR after they die, we'd have seen it already. Heroes would newyorkersedai - 04/12/2010 01:28:45 AM 882 Views
that would have been decidedly clever. *NM* LadyLorraine - 04/12/2010 07:18:52 PM 360 Views
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