Active Users:344 Time:03/04/2025 11:24:50 PM
Commentary, then? Larry Send a noteboard - 02/04/2010 09:27:18 PM
Some of his complaints make no sense at all, and the others show him to possess an extreme amount of churlishness. At the end of this so called review, all he has done is repeat his issues with the series he had from day one.


Well, Roberts is known for his snark in reviews, which I did note when I posted this thread originally :P And yes, some of his complaints are repetitive, but perhaps some of those are due to certain perceived "defects" cropping up throughout the series? The prose certainly never gets to the "sparkling" level at any point that I recall; it did feel a bit padded throughout, to be honest. That is something that could be raised as a point about each individual volume. Whether you agree with it or not is a different matter :P

That might not be so bad, if he could in fact address them with respect to this current book. But he doesn't even do that. Where the first review complained about lifting from Tolkien, this one just focuses on some extremely thin similarities with Dune.


And for someone who admittedly read it hurriedly, that's grounds for dismissing his point that there are indeed those similarities? It's little different than reviewers of various epic fantasy works noting the similarities (and possible derivations) between works. Yes, it is quite likely RJ wanted to have those similarities in there to serve a different purpose than what Roberts appears to concede, but there are quite a few of them, if I recall.

And it goes on. The only difference is, this time he comes and says straight out that he barely glanced through the book:

I read the book fairly rapidly, but I look back on it now trying to remember what all this diverse running-around, collecting, fighting and so on amounted to.

Now some of this, I’ll confess, had to do with the rapidity of my reading of the book.

What is worse is his absurd idea of what "adult" character development is...

There are intimations of sex in the book, but instead of actual sex we get a load of schoolyard crushes, mooning about, kissing, jealousies and the occasional bottom-pinch.

Why the obsession with sex? Explicit portrayal of sex is not consistent with the mood and characters of the series at all!


I think it's more of a case where there is a more graphic description of warfare and suffering (and quasi-bondage scenes later in the series) than there is a deeper exploration of the coming-of-age issues that the characters have. The emotional/romance/love parts are perhaps a weak PG compared to the PG-13 to almost R-rated violence. That is something that is interesting, to say the least. But it's probably been discussed to death here over the years, I guess?

And then there's his grousing about the "words of wisdom" in the book, some of which were nothing of the sort, others which are clear in context and some which are clear on their own, but get mocked for the sake of mocking. Like:


"On the heights, the paths are paved with daggers." [43] Laid flat, this would surely result in a perfectly serviceable, if expensive, road. Laid edge-upwards, you’d probably want to walk alongside it rather than on it. Either way it seems self-defeating.

Really? His interpretation of this quote is... what? That literally paving a road with daggers is senseless?

If this is the kind of silly childish stuff a Cambridge professor can manage these days, the place must be going to the dogs. I'd give more kudos to the Lemmings of Discord over at Westeros. At least, they don't claim to be doing actual reviews, and end up being hilarious and still making good points.
Illusions fall like the husk of a fruit, one after another, and the fruit is experience. - Narrator, Sylvie

Je suis méchant.
Reply to message
Author Adam Roberts tackled the WoT. - 19/03/2010 09:30:25 PM 12433 Views
A question for Larry - 19/03/2010 09:40:37 PM 2918 Views
Roberto Bolaño - 19/03/2010 11:09:57 PM 2728 Views
I completely agree with his review. - 19/03/2010 11:11:17 PM 2862 Views
Ouch! Somebody pull that guy off RJ! *NM* - 20/03/2010 03:47:07 AM 1422 Views
Can't say that I really disagree. - 20/03/2010 05:19:26 AM 2183 Views
My problem with the reviews: - 20/03/2010 06:29:08 AM 2844 Views
Hear Hear !!! ....................... = ........................ *NM* - 20/03/2010 06:37:11 AM 1361 Views
I agree - 20/03/2010 11:19:29 AM 2298 Views
You know what else I'm finding annoying? - 07/04/2010 07:29:37 AM 2233 Views
Fully Agree *NM* - 21/06/2010 12:41:05 AM 1245 Views
well I agree and disagree - 20/03/2010 06:51:29 AM 2594 Views
Re: well I agree and disagree - 20/03/2010 02:12:43 PM 2115 Views
I'd say just The Eye of the World - 20/03/2010 05:26:19 PM 2163 Views
Indeed - 21/03/2010 12:34:19 AM 2084 Views
These reviews are pathetic - 20/03/2010 12:52:22 PM 2097 Views
I'm amused by some of the responses - 20/03/2010 07:20:03 PM 2522 Views
+1 *NM* - 20/03/2010 10:48:14 PM 1574 Views
Are you suggesting that we are unqualified to disagree with him ? - 20/03/2010 11:21:44 PM 2262 Views
No, I said rather that it's ridiculous to make such disparaging comments about his takes - 20/03/2010 11:37:56 PM 2268 Views
I considered doing so - 21/03/2010 12:27:27 AM 2126 Views
I will reply to myself: What's the problem McFly , chicken ? - 21/03/2010 12:29:36 AM 2088 Views
My sister called me chicken once - 10/04/2010 01:18:31 AM 2134 Views
what's wrong runt... are you yellah? *NM* - 10/04/2010 10:40:16 AM 1323 Views
NICE! *NM* - 10/04/2010 02:19:44 PM 1186 Views
Re: I'm amused by some of the responses - 23/03/2010 04:50:42 PM 2169 Views
And I'm even more amused by this response - 24/03/2010 01:11:50 AM 2097 Views
Re: And I'm even more amused by this response - 24/03/2010 03:03:28 AM 1966 Views
Nah, TGS was the only serious review of the series I've done - 24/03/2010 04:31:28 AM 2061 Views
On a completely unrelated note... - 24/03/2010 06:15:25 AM 1968 Views
Ha! - 24/03/2010 06:34:48 AM 2009 Views
My congratulations then . *NM* - 24/03/2010 06:36:11 AM 1921 Views
You say it as if I had been condemned to hell! - 24/03/2010 07:13:45 AM 1828 Views
No. Well, maybe. - 24/03/2010 06:52:28 PM 2007 Views
! - 24/03/2010 06:54:34 PM 2017 Views
Re: Author Adam Roberts tackled the WoT. - 22/03/2010 02:47:23 PM 2128 Views
Re: Author Adam Roberts tackled the WoT. - 23/03/2010 01:53:16 PM 2104 Views
Wow, you guys have completely missed the point of the Wheel of Time series - 22/03/2010 05:28:07 PM 2149 Views
There's a point to it? - 22/03/2010 06:47:12 PM 2114 Views
Yes, RJ has explained it at least a few times and the main sequence of each book invokes his message *NM* - 24/03/2010 02:09:01 AM 1328 Views
You're not taking me seriously now, are you? - 24/03/2010 02:54:37 AM 2061 Views
I meant the reason why RJ wrote WoT in the first place - 24/03/2010 06:39:47 AM 2042 Views
I thought the point was to write about a bunch of stuff happening? - 09/04/2010 03:42:49 PM 2104 Views
Re: Author Adam Roberts tackled the WoT. - 23/03/2010 04:54:38 PM 2070 Views
pfft wth-ever - 26/03/2010 12:35:53 AM 1938 Views
Dude's been up for more awards for his writing than RJ ever was - 26/03/2010 12:28:19 PM 2187 Views
bla bla bla - 29/03/2010 06:17:07 AM 2055 Views
Usually, it's spelled "blah" - 29/03/2010 07:03:51 AM 2032 Views
Wow. That post was more entertaining than Mr. Roberts' review. Thank you *NM* - 29/03/2010 08:23:41 AM 1504 Views
You must have low standards for entertainment - 29/03/2010 08:54:03 AM 1996 Views
Re: You must have low standards for entertainment - 29/03/2010 09:13:44 AM 2130 Views
I know you were, thus the at the least of my comment - 29/03/2010 09:19:30 AM 1944 Views
Unimpressed - 29/03/2010 10:50:07 PM 2389 Views
Thank you - 30/03/2010 12:35:39 AM 1844 Views
*Standing ovation for DomA* - 30/03/2010 07:36:59 AM 2125 Views
Yes. Also, Roberts is a wanker. *NM* - 05/04/2010 09:28:57 PM 1334 Views
Re: Dude's been up for more awards for his writing than RJ ever was - 29/03/2010 04:32:23 PM 2093 Views
Might want to re-read their Wikis again. - 29/03/2010 07:07:11 PM 1972 Views
Awards - 29/03/2010 07:42:03 PM 1932 Views
That link is out of date - 29/03/2010 07:54:56 PM 1923 Views
Re: That link is out of date - 29/03/2010 08:22:03 PM 2055 Views
This is a battle of win/lose? - 29/03/2010 08:47:54 PM 1971 Views
Re: This is a battle of win/lose? - 29/03/2010 09:03:07 PM 2002 Views
*considers employing the Chewbacca defense* - 29/03/2010 09:28:06 PM 1971 Views
Re: *considers employing the Chewbacca defense* - 29/03/2010 09:44:58 PM 2153 Views
The final point explains the "defense" - 30/03/2010 12:24:56 AM 1875 Views
Re: The final point explains the "defense" - 30/03/2010 01:33:04 PM 1863 Views
No, no, no - 30/03/2010 06:38:41 PM 1917 Views
Re: No, no, no - 30/03/2010 07:51:34 PM 2043 Views
Still continuing, huh? - 31/03/2010 02:10:13 AM 1984 Views
Re: Still continuing, huh? - 31/03/2010 03:56:57 PM 1950 Views
Those were polls - 31/03/2010 08:46:07 PM 1959 Views
Re: Those were polls - 05/04/2010 03:22:13 PM 1914 Views
Does it gives him right to insult me? - 13/04/2011 02:10:32 PM 1951 Views
I wouldn't know. Was he speaking directly to you? - 14/04/2011 11:28:16 PM 2053 Views
He's now reviewed the third book - 26/03/2010 12:27:16 PM 2175 Views
Well, this time I must disagree with him . - 29/03/2010 07:31:40 AM 1910 Views
I don't think he was claiming that RJ was alone in doing that - 29/03/2010 07:44:07 AM 1903 Views
Hah! - 29/03/2010 06:07:28 PM 1942 Views
Well... - 29/03/2010 06:52:10 PM 1833 Views
Differing perspectives, I guess. - 29/03/2010 07:58:13 PM 2011 Views
I suppose - 29/03/2010 08:50:43 PM 1933 Views
Re: I suppose - 30/03/2010 12:18:30 AM 2082 Views
True - 30/03/2010 12:23:28 AM 1915 Views
Hey, DomA, do you know why the Shienarans randomly speak in the Old Tongue? - 30/03/2010 12:52:01 AM 1880 Views
Re: Hey, DomA, do you know why the Shienarans randomly speak in the Old Tongue? - 30/03/2010 07:45:08 AM 2041 Views
But why only them? - 30/03/2010 08:07:00 AM 1965 Views
Re: But why only them? - 30/03/2010 03:56:54 PM 1918 Views
Re: But why only them? - 30/03/2010 08:29:37 PM 2035 Views
I really liked a lot of the minor characters in The Great Hunt. - 30/03/2010 12:49:03 AM 1953 Views
I barely thought twice about those, to be honest - 30/03/2010 06:39:55 PM 1977 Views
I can't wait what he's going to try to do with TFoH and beyond - 28/03/2010 08:18:59 PM 2066 Views
Glad you enjoyed it - 29/03/2010 09:33:43 PM 1878 Views
The Shadow Rising review - 02/04/2010 09:42:53 AM 2161 Views
I wonder if this borders on trolling - 02/04/2010 02:29:58 PM 10721 Views
You want complaining? You got it... - 02/04/2010 06:38:09 PM 2046 Views
That would be a mistake - 02/04/2010 09:16:25 PM 2168 Views
Re: That would be a mistake - 02/04/2010 10:28:56 PM 1927 Views
I agree, Roberts is more and more coming across to me as just bitter - 10/04/2010 01:24:52 AM 2052 Views
Little late to this one as well - 10/04/2010 11:12:04 AM 2068 Views
Perhaps you should have led with this bit - 10/04/2010 02:52:23 PM 2135 Views
Re: I wonder if this borders on trolling - 04/04/2010 09:16:22 AM 2034 Views
What review? I couldn't find one... - 02/04/2010 08:00:45 PM 2133 Views
Re: What review? I couldn't find one... - 02/04/2010 09:22:13 PM 2138 Views
See my comment below - 02/04/2010 09:32:54 PM 2188 Views
Re: See my comment below - 03/04/2010 09:31:22 AM 2548 Views
Sorry I'm late in responding, but I've been quite busy this week - 07/04/2010 09:45:48 PM 2386 Views
Yes, I can probably agree with what you say here. - 08/04/2010 12:29:16 AM 1846 Views
- 08/04/2010 12:32:53 AM 1989 Views
I agree completely. *NM* - 02/04/2010 09:53:44 PM 1227 Views
Speaking of irritation - 02/04/2010 10:50:04 PM 2103 Views
Commentary, then? - 02/04/2010 09:27:18 PM 1980 Views
Here's the thing... - 02/04/2010 10:11:18 PM 1919 Views
Re: Here's the thing... - 02/04/2010 10:31:56 PM 1772 Views
Re: Here's the thing... - 03/04/2010 01:34:05 AM 1829 Views
I somehow overlooked this last week, it seems - 10/04/2010 11:01:17 AM 2131 Views
Indeed - 02/04/2010 10:34:00 PM 1823 Views
Re: Commentary, then? - 05/04/2010 03:44:07 PM 1903 Views
for a man that bitterly complains about an author who is padding his work - 08/04/2010 09:41:07 PM 2108 Views
1400 words is long-winded? - 09/04/2010 10:07:41 AM 2145 Views
since you can sum up those 1400 words in about 25 yes that's longwinded - 09/04/2010 01:36:16 PM 2025 Views
Except I didn't really sum it up, as I left out quite a bit - 10/04/2010 11:15:42 AM 2050 Views
You are very defensive over this - 10/04/2010 01:54:15 PM 1866 Views
Nah, more of a devil's advocate than anything else - 12/04/2010 03:57:12 AM 1910 Views
Re: Nah, more of a devil's advocate than anything else - 12/04/2010 05:30:53 PM 1834 Views
You sound like a Goodkind webmaster from a couple of years ago - 12/04/2010 06:58:42 PM 1930 Views
You don't come across as a devil's advocate - 30/03/2011 03:07:32 PM 1916 Views
Well Larry I have started reading Gradsil by Adam Roberts - 07/04/2010 08:59:28 PM 2085 Views
I demand a paragraph by paragraph review, with footnotes! - 07/04/2010 09:50:39 PM 1948 Views
Re: I demand a paragraph by paragraph review, with footnotes! - 08/04/2010 01:06:20 PM 1798 Views
Which Invisible Man? - 09/04/2010 09:58:44 AM 2036 Views
Re: Which Invisible Man? - 09/04/2010 01:26:42 PM 1991 Views
I have a very different take on that book - 10/04/2010 11:17:13 AM 1874 Views
Re: I demand a paragraph by paragraph review, with footnotes! - 09/04/2010 01:45:44 PM 1954 Views
Hrmm... - 10/04/2010 11:19:01 AM 1792 Views
Re: Well Larry I have started reading Gradsil by Adam Roberts - 12/04/2010 05:37:36 PM 2020 Views
He brings up some interesting points, if in an unnecessarily rude manner - 08/04/2010 12:42:25 PM 1982 Views
To be honest, I doubt most readers of the series obsess over it that much - 09/04/2010 10:05:49 AM 1973 Views
Re: To be honest, I doubt most readers of the series obsess over it that much - 09/04/2010 01:28:17 PM 2520 Views
Re: To be honest, I doubt most readers of the series obsess over it that much - 10/04/2010 11:40:22 AM 1984 Views
why are you so bothered by people being unimpressed with Roberts? - 10/04/2010 02:19:08 PM 2006 Views
I don't understand it either - 11/04/2010 12:44:25 PM 1969 Views
right? - 11/04/2010 02:13:00 PM 2005 Views
Nah - 12/04/2010 04:13:44 AM 1797 Views
And in vol. 5, Roberts discovers the horrors of the circus - 09/04/2010 09:57:03 AM 1967 Views
5 reviews without saying more than "I hate the series" - 09/04/2010 01:31:13 PM 1813 Views
Basically he just states the "nothing happens"-argument... - 09/04/2010 03:26:02 PM 1865 Views
Well, what was really resolved here? - 10/04/2010 11:25:25 AM 1948 Views
Well... - 12/04/2010 05:05:20 PM 2028 Views
well exactly - 12/04/2010 05:33:11 PM 2091 Views
So very little was resolved and much was set into motion, then? - 12/04/2010 06:55:45 PM 2022 Views
Yes... - 12/04/2010 10:51:08 PM 1770 Views
Ever read Umberto Eco's How To Travel with a Salmon? - 12/04/2010 11:07:19 PM 2090 Views
I guess... - 13/04/2010 10:03:03 AM 2086 Views
Sounds like you value prolixity for the sake of prolixity, to be honest - 13/04/2010 04:41:07 PM 3203 Views
Nah... - 13/04/2010 05:29:34 PM 1773 Views
He's read and enjoyed Proust, among others - 13/04/2010 07:37:39 PM 1859 Views
Ah, well... - 13/04/2010 09:45:45 PM 1802 Views
Dismissive, much? - 13/04/2010 10:52:30 PM 1986 Views
About that bifurcation... - 14/04/2010 02:02:15 AM 1931 Views
I'm rather moderate - 14/04/2010 10:11:30 AM 1846 Views
I'm just a liberation theologist at heart - 15/04/2010 01:51:16 PM 2772 Views
So, if you don't mind... - 13/04/2010 05:51:06 AM 1963 Views
That's fine with me - 13/04/2010 06:31:41 AM 1935 Views
I'm sorry, but he's totally right. "The Circus" made me put down this series for 5 YEARS. - 09/04/2010 03:38:16 PM 1972 Views
I didn't find it quite that bad, but... - 11/04/2010 08:27:52 AM 1962 Views
LoC represented a sharp drop in quality!!? - 19/05/2010 03:27:21 PM 1966 Views
And ignores everything else... - 09/04/2010 05:10:00 PM 2014 Views
Inchoatus went offline a couple of years ago - 10/04/2010 11:42:26 AM 2908 Views
This guy is going to get what he deserves... - 09/04/2010 10:26:14 PM 1943 Views
I'm waiting with bated breath for his CoT review *NM* - 10/04/2010 01:00:59 PM 1297 Views
Just wanted to point out that he is not reviewing the series. - 16/04/2010 04:04:49 PM 1885 Views
Lord of Chaos commentary - 16/04/2010 03:39:39 PM 1932 Views
He has reached - The Hump. - 16/04/2010 03:55:51 PM 1896 Views
Re: He has reached - The Hump. - 18/04/2010 08:08:59 AM 2334 Views
No no. It was Lord of Heaven! - 16/04/2010 05:51:11 PM 1850 Views
Yeah, I noticed that - 16/04/2010 11:16:26 PM 1767 Views
I would love the see him review Goodkind... - 16/04/2010 11:51:07 PM 1986 Views
Finally re-read that post - 20/04/2010 09:35:45 PM 1967 Views
The magic items are mostly irrelevant... - 21/04/2010 03:37:36 AM 1923 Views
A Crown of Swords - or is it deco-porn? - 23/04/2010 08:36:17 AM 2043 Views
Re: A Crown of Swords - or is it deco-porn? - 29/04/2010 06:02:28 PM 1977 Views
I disagree - 29/04/2010 09:34:49 PM 1788 Views
I agree. - 29/04/2010 09:45:29 PM 2008 Views
Took me a moment to realize with whom you were agreeing - 29/04/2010 10:19:05 PM 1910 Views
Well, I did mention the necklines get overdone... - 06/05/2010 06:17:46 PM 2216 Views
Well, there's now also the tea to comment about - 07/05/2010 11:29:03 AM 2043 Views
A bit of a stumble this week - 30/04/2010 01:53:31 PM 2072 Views
The Path of Daggers commentary - 07/05/2010 10:39:03 AM 2108 Views
You'd think a Brit would like the tea... *NM* - 11/05/2010 04:05:42 PM 1164 Views
Maybe he's just a contrarian? - 11/05/2010 07:55:43 PM 1869 Views
Winter's Heart - 21/05/2010 12:46:14 PM 2085 Views
To be fair - 21/05/2010 01:56:49 PM 2206 Views
I think WH was my least favorite of the WoT novels I re-read - 21/05/2010 04:49:31 PM 1948 Views
Re: I think WH was my least favorite of the WoT novels I re-read - 25/05/2010 05:05:09 PM 2098 Views
WH was my least favorite novel in the series, and that is saying a lot. - 28/05/2010 03:15:13 PM 1960 Views
I completely agree with his KoD post. Here is my favorite quote: - 28/05/2010 03:08:31 PM 2271 Views
CoT, you mean (link to actual post included) - 28/05/2010 04:56:10 PM 2099 Views
Yep, I meant COT. *NM* - 28/05/2010 07:02:48 PM 1169 Views
Knife of Dreams - 18/06/2010 09:07:27 AM 1975 Views
Re: Knife of Dreams - 19/06/2010 05:49:38 AM 2056 Views
Agree... - 19/06/2010 05:08:44 PM 1990 Views
Roberts reflects back on WoT 1-11, with answers to questions asked of him - 25/06/2010 12:51:29 PM 2051 Views
This guy should be burned at the stake - 25/06/2010 03:22:34 PM 9496 Views
Are you done making a fool out of yourself, Mark? - 26/06/2010 06:53:37 PM 1965 Views
Oh come on... - 26/06/2010 09:06:01 PM 2075 Views
Well, the burning at the stake was a bit much... - 26/06/2010 10:19:40 PM 2065 Views
Well, really! You brought the comment to his notice... - 26/06/2010 11:34:08 PM 2072 Views
And your point is...? - 27/06/2010 12:37:00 AM 2072 Views
Well... - 27/06/2010 05:38:12 AM 2039 Views
Indeed... I think it's rather clear that Larry's goal has been to cause trouble - 27/06/2010 10:57:36 AM 2207 Views
There is no "borderline" about it. - 28/03/2011 05:17:15 PM 1903 Views
Ridiculous - 27/06/2010 06:38:46 AM 1977 Views
I like his FAQ and his overall musings on its' popularity. - 29/06/2010 06:35:10 PM 1969 Views
One year later... - 27/03/2011 03:40:29 AM 1904 Views
Re: One year later... - 28/03/2011 05:03:32 PM 2145 Views
I see you subconsciously support critical takes. - 28/03/2011 11:41:48 PM 2146 Views
No I conciously support telling you and him that you are pathetic, arrogent, & jelous. *NM* - 30/03/2011 01:40:36 PM 1231 Views
Jealous? - 30/03/2011 05:20:32 PM 1905 Views
I agree, I didn't even notice it was an old post, definitely did not deserve to be revived. *NM* - 30/03/2011 02:41:12 PM 1152 Views
Seconded. - 30/03/2011 04:04:36 PM 1853 Views
Now I notice as well that this is a year old. You're very silly, Larry, very silly. *NM* - 30/03/2011 04:13:38 PM 1278 Views
Yep! - 30/03/2011 05:16:38 PM 1853 Views
Jeez Larry, you're starting to sound like a GRRM detractor. - 31/03/2011 03:01:38 PM 2035 Views
Nah, no detractor - 01/04/2011 03:00:41 PM 2025 Views
Could a thread be locked? - 31/03/2011 07:48:26 PM 1892 Views
Re: One year later... - 01/04/2011 02:55:02 AM 2268 Views
Yep - 01/04/2011 02:57:52 PM 2033 Views
He's not an "author", he's just a stupid troll, do not feed him *NM* - 30/03/2011 02:39:19 PM 1163 Views

Reply to Message