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Re: I don't understand your point Sidious Send a noteboard - 03/09/2009 09:23:53 PM
A lot of this work was done by Moiraine and Siuan as well as Cadsuane and co. and lets not forget Verin either. The Wondergirls would not have existed but for Moiraine and wouldn't have become ready so fast but for Siuan.


So throw Moiraine, Siuan, Verin, and Cadsuane into the mix. That leaves you with 7 Aes Sedai out of roughly one thousand who have done little else but get in the way or make problems for the main characters in the series.


Why must everyone be a hero? Who can set the example... the Whitecloaks, the Aiel, the Sharans, the Seanchan? Every group has a bunch of achievers and legends. You can't expect 1,000 Sisters to all be special. They're mostly normal people who can channel and go about their daily activities.


My point is they aren't toted up to be normal people who can channel and they definitely don't mind their own business and go about their daily activities like normal people. I agree not everyone can or even should be heroes. But other groups that you reference aren't 100% composed of individuals who think they should be in charge of everything and everyone. The fact of the matter is, the majority of Aes Sedai (even those that aren't Black Ajah) negatively impact the war against the Shadow by meddling with everything they can on the grounds that they are Aes Sedai and should be in control. Very few Aes Sedai have had a positive impact in the series, and those that have done something positive have mostly had their actions negated by the rest of the Aes Sedai.


Yes, but remember that over 2/3 of Aes Sedai are permanently in the Tower - so it's not a fallacy to think that they are normal people who go about their lives. While most of them consider themselves to be queens on a level of royalty, they only act that way outside of the Tower, which is quite uncommon. Most Sisters stroll the halls and go about their daily activities.

The 'series' as you put it is a giant soup of good and evil deeds. It's very one dimensional to say that the Aes Sedai have had a minimal positive impact on the series. They do good things which are countered by Elaida's stupidity or the evil of the Black Ajah, but the same is really true of any group... Jaichim Carridin is surely counterproductive to any Whitecloak efforts to battle the Shadow, as is Suroth for the Seanchan.
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This message last edited by Sidious on 03/09/2009 at 09:24:52 PM
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You know... it feels like the Aes Sedai are pretty superflouous beetnemesis - 02/09/2009 09:48:19 PM 1178 Views
Y'know, the paralells betwen the Aes Sedai in the White Tower... vandevere - 02/09/2009 10:46:29 PM 765 Views
Well said. Hadn't really thought of it that way before *NM* Bryce - 03/09/2009 12:01:30 AM 483 Views
That is the inspiration for the Aes Sedai that RJ used - I can't find the article, though. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/09/2009 02:39:14 PM 711 Views
When I was reading this I was thinking of the paralells between the white tower and Tashmere - 03/09/2009 02:47:33 AM 913 Views
And yet the WT has been THE single greatest force for continuity and civilization. NaClH2O - 03/09/2009 03:37:14 AM 787 Views
Re: And yet the WT has been THE single greatest force for continuity and civilization. Corwin - 03/09/2009 05:46:13 AM 745 Views
Really? fionwe1987 - 03/09/2009 05:52:38 AM 716 Views
Re: Really? Corwin - 03/09/2009 06:03:13 AM 681 Views
So lets add a few more NaClH2O - 03/09/2009 11:42:48 AM 684 Views
most of these are accounted for above ranagrande - 03/09/2009 02:18:01 PM 756 Views
Just because we don't know all their names, doesn't mean their effectiveness on the Pattern was less RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/09/2009 03:19:41 PM 719 Views
But who did the work? NaClH2O - 03/09/2009 05:37:00 PM 608 Views
While these are good, none of it is because of the White Tower beetnemesis - 03/09/2009 05:43:56 PM 632 Views
So if Elaida didn't order it, it doesn't count? NaClH2O - 03/09/2009 07:29:20 PM 618 Views
Actually I think that's his point ranagrande - 04/09/2009 01:40:37 PM 701 Views
Spot-on beetnemesis - 04/09/2009 08:56:30 PM 529 Views
Re: Actually I think that's his point NaClH2O - 05/09/2009 03:17:25 AM 569 Views
Re: But who did the work? ranagrande - 04/09/2009 01:32:19 PM 642 Views
Only one point because obviously your mind is made up. NaClH2O - 05/09/2009 06:13:23 AM 669 Views
well, yeah ranagrande - 05/09/2009 02:33:51 PM 738 Views
In that case, Rand, Mat, Perrin... all of them are superfluous. fionwe1987 - 05/09/2009 03:03:07 PM 610 Views
Re: In that case, Rand, Mat, Perrin... all of them are superfluous. NaClH2O - 05/09/2009 04:57:44 PM 605 Views
No, fionwe1987 is absolutely right! ranagrande - 05/09/2009 05:13:39 PM 564 Views
I'm glad the real world disagrees with you NaClH2O - 05/09/2009 05:05:50 PM 608 Views
I'm not convinced that it does ranagrande - 05/09/2009 05:44:10 PM 708 Views
I don't understand your point Sidious - 03/09/2009 04:25:22 PM 630 Views
Re: I don't understand your point Corwin - 03/09/2009 09:09:38 PM 679 Views
Re: I don't understand your point Sidious - 03/09/2009 09:23:53 PM 612 Views
Re: I don't understand your point Corwin - 05/09/2009 09:02:47 AM 811 Views
Re: I don't understand your point NaClH2O - 03/09/2009 09:49:58 PM 589 Views
I was talking about the WT specifically, and only during recent years. It's Gotta be the Shadow, beetnemesis - 03/09/2009 05:39:11 PM 608 Views
So what you are really saying is that if you ignore over 2/3rds of the AS the rest aren't doing much NaClH2O - 03/09/2009 06:07:23 PM 553 Views
I'm talking about the organization as a whole beetnemesis - 03/09/2009 10:07:37 PM 624 Views
No you are talking about Elaida NaClH2O - 03/09/2009 10:32:59 PM 546 Views
You just made our point... fionwe1987 - 04/09/2009 12:49:44 AM 643 Views
Well, because most of her actions infringe on that "bubble" beetnemesis - 04/09/2009 09:00:52 PM 548 Views
Not at all... fionwe1987 - 04/09/2009 09:23:09 PM 658 Views
WT has been THE single greatest force for stagancy and lack of development. Lohikaarme - 09/09/2009 08:58:58 AM 575 Views
Like I said earlier the AS are superfluous except the ones who aren't superfluous. NaClH2O - 09/09/2009 11:55:47 AM 650 Views
To a certain extent ajsr1982 - 03/09/2009 11:33:30 AM 792 Views
Definitely. And Egwene is in denial. beetnemesis - 03/09/2009 05:53:14 PM 634 Views
Some pretty big blanket statements NaClH2O - 03/09/2009 10:24:50 PM 748 Views
Without the Tower Voscaia Sedai - 03/09/2009 02:05:09 PM 544 Views
Actually, I think Verin is a good metaphor here. nossy - 03/09/2009 07:59:46 PM 589 Views
Agrees with Nossy NaClH2O - 03/09/2009 10:44:06 PM 884 Views
That's mostly what I was trying to say beetnemesis - 04/09/2009 09:03:52 PM 549 Views
Re: That's mostly what I was trying to say NaClH2O - 05/09/2009 03:33:46 AM 890 Views
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