Let's give you one logic path for Millisair being poisoned.
TheUltimateReality Send a noteboard - 27/01/2010 05:47:04 PM
Assume Kerb was compelled beyond the ability for initiative and was truly an automaton.
Fact - Simple commands work best with compulsion. Refer to Verin's comments and the comments about Graendal's toys being useless for much beyond simple instructions because of the level of compulsion.
Assume only one prisoner under the shop. Given the discussion between Nynaeve and the warders, and that only Millisair is mentioned, it is likely the messenger was there alone as well.
Graedal decides to off the messenger. Her intel would have shown that Millisair uses that group of interrogators and that with the messenger going to her, she prepares a clean-up plan if necessary.
She activates the clean-up with a simple instruction to Kerb. Poison the prisoner. No name given because there is only one prisoner and it is safer if nobody knows the name. Also, with the messenger not talking, binding the instruction to the name might misfire if Kerb cannot connect the instruction to the prisoner.
Kerb poisons the prisoner.
Rand reacts like Rand does and sends Millisair to the same jail to suffer the same as the messenger did. She is now a prisoner, possibly in the same cell as the messenger was. Kerb's instructions are still there, so he poisons the prisoner.
There you have a clear, logical path with a simple instruction set that could result in an unintended poisoning of Millisair purely because Kerb was heavily compelled. Just like an industrial robot will happily weld clear air or the welding bench if no metal is present.
Fact - Simple commands work best with compulsion. Refer to Verin's comments and the comments about Graendal's toys being useless for much beyond simple instructions because of the level of compulsion.
Assume only one prisoner under the shop. Given the discussion between Nynaeve and the warders, and that only Millisair is mentioned, it is likely the messenger was there alone as well.
Graedal decides to off the messenger. Her intel would have shown that Millisair uses that group of interrogators and that with the messenger going to her, she prepares a clean-up plan if necessary.
She activates the clean-up with a simple instruction to Kerb. Poison the prisoner. No name given because there is only one prisoner and it is safer if nobody knows the name. Also, with the messenger not talking, binding the instruction to the name might misfire if Kerb cannot connect the instruction to the prisoner.
Kerb poisons the prisoner.
Rand reacts like Rand does and sends Millisair to the same jail to suffer the same as the messenger did. She is now a prisoner, possibly in the same cell as the messenger was. Kerb's instructions are still there, so he poisons the prisoner.
There you have a clear, logical path with a simple instruction set that could result in an unintended poisoning of Millisair purely because Kerb was heavily compelled. Just like an industrial robot will happily weld clear air or the welding bench if no metal is present.
Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story.
25/01/2010 05:18:23 PM
- 2736 Views
I think Graendal's death was a great scene
25/01/2010 05:26:51 PM
- 1469 Views
The scene itself was great. The rest is crap.
25/01/2010 05:37:44 PM
- 1269 Views
After reading 12 WoT books...
25/01/2010 05:46:31 PM
- 1369 Views
I think playing too many games just messes up with the integrety and solidness of the books ...
26/01/2010 09:46:16 PM
- 2760 Views
I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
25/01/2010 06:18:30 PM
- 1333 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
25/01/2010 06:44:34 PM
- 1269 Views
well one of her major character parallels is Josef Mengel
25/01/2010 06:54:43 PM
- 1089 Views
Can you think of any way that would explain the Compulsion vanishing?
25/01/2010 07:52:40 PM
- 1089 Views
that's kind of my whole point
25/01/2010 08:43:19 PM
- 1020 Views
None of those "easy explanations" could work
26/01/2010 07:14:16 AM
- 1123 Views
my entire problem with the scene is that it just felt too open ended
26/01/2010 08:58:37 AM
- 1211 Views
Can't she knot it to disapate after being examined once?
26/01/2010 03:43:55 AM
- 1053 Views
Do we have evidence that this is possible?
26/01/2010 03:44:48 AM
- 1216 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
26/01/2010 02:03:51 AM
- 1282 Views
I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive.
26/01/2010 07:38:40 AM
- 1037 Views
26/01/2010 11:42:04 AM
- 1222 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive.
26/01/2010 08:49:00 AM
- 1232 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive.
26/01/2010 09:19:35 AM
- 1014 Views
Moiraine probably learned it while researching with Adealas and Vandene. *NM*
26/01/2010 04:57:09 PM
- 840 Views

He was balefired by a direct stream in front of at least two credible witnesses.
26/01/2010 04:10:13 PM
- 1191 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
25/01/2010 08:56:16 PM
- 1302 Views
I believe she's dead
25/01/2010 09:06:37 PM
- 1138 Views
Re: I believe she's dead
25/01/2010 09:09:58 PM
- 1185 Views
Besides, if it wasn't Graendal, it implies that she knew of Rand's plan, which is not feasible *NM*
26/01/2010 02:01:41 PM
- 632 Views
The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene!
25/01/2010 11:54:02 PM
- 1305 Views
Re: The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene!
26/01/2010 01:22:57 AM
- 1060 Views
Stop passing judgments...
26/01/2010 02:05:21 AM
- 1247 Views
But your theories are becoming increasingly farfetched
26/01/2010 04:21:21 AM
- 1117 Views
I repeat that I find her "death" monumental...
26/01/2010 07:16:13 PM
- 1093 Views
Re: I repeat that I find her "death" monumental...
26/01/2010 07:23:29 PM
- 1130 Views
Dude, then you derailed the thread...
26/01/2010 07:31:55 PM
- 1038 Views
no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place
26/01/2010 08:51:31 AM
- 1056 Views
Re: no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place
26/01/2010 11:37:26 AM
- 1185 Views
read the whole quote
26/01/2010 04:35:17 PM
- 885 Views
LOL! You read the whole quote
26/01/2010 07:00:41 PM
- 1002 Views
the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together.
27/01/2010 12:40:09 AM
- 1076 Views
Re: the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together.
28/01/2010 04:28:21 PM
- 1215 Views
I don't see any flaws.
25/01/2010 09:14:44 PM
- 1252 Views
But...
25/01/2010 11:44:49 PM
- 1007 Views
Re: But...
26/01/2010 01:14:51 AM
- 1148 Views
That still doesn't make sense.
26/01/2010 02:23:12 AM
- 1241 Views
But, having a clean up guy does make sense.
26/01/2010 03:02:13 AM
- 1272 Views

But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy!
26/01/2010 03:35:44 AM
- 1124 Views
Nonsense.
26/01/2010 07:50:04 AM
- 992 Views
Dude, read what I said please...
26/01/2010 07:21:52 PM
- 1168 Views
Re: Dude, read what I said please...
26/01/2010 09:28:25 PM
- 1152 Views
Kerb had no initiative... he was under too heavy a Compulsion to think for himself
27/01/2010 12:45:47 AM
- 1042 Views
I think he had some, albeit probably not a whole lot
27/01/2010 01:03:44 AM
- 1095 Views
Messenger was running around being obvious. Noone would suspect Kerb though. Case Closed. *NM*
26/01/2010 11:08:16 AM
- 748 Views
Thank the creator you're not in the police then. *NM*
26/01/2010 07:22:29 PM
- 690 Views
Ok, in more detail:
26/01/2010 08:16:30 PM
- 1169 Views
Thoughts
26/01/2010 01:05:45 AM
- 1008 Views
Nope. Ramshalan was just "collecting taxes" or something.
26/01/2010 11:10:25 AM
- 986 Views
Re: Nope. Ramshalan was NOT just "collecting taxes" or something.
26/01/2010 05:41:17 PM
- 1060 Views
By, the way, if I understand this correctly...
26/01/2010 04:49:45 PM
- 1222 Views
I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
26/01/2010 07:29:42 PM
- 1072 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
26/01/2010 09:42:52 PM
- 874 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
27/01/2010 03:26:46 AM
- 1086 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
27/01/2010 04:05:23 AM
- 1194 Views
That's not fair
27/01/2010 04:09:38 AM
- 1035 Views
I agree about the 'awesome' part
.
27/01/2010 05:41:00 AM
- 1013 Views

Does anybody have a link to it? (nothing on Google). I'm intrigued. *NM*
27/01/2010 08:27:13 AM
- 644 Views
It was on Wotmania. Someone copied all the theories, but I don't recall whom. *NM*
27/01/2010 08:31:00 AM
- 776 Views
I just think it's funny that what you call omniscience has been done by the Forsaken before.
27/01/2010 02:02:44 PM
- 1007 Views
But Graendal was the victim of a greater plot.
27/01/2010 05:30:28 PM
- 1110 Views
So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal.
27/01/2010 05:57:20 PM
- 1176 Views
Re: So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal.
28/01/2010 04:05:21 AM
- 1190 Views
Give me one example. Just one. *NM*
27/01/2010 06:52:44 PM
- 716 Views
Ishamael plans millennia ahead by sowing the seeds for the Black Ajah, the Seanchan and the current
28/01/2010 01:57:39 PM
- 1173 Views
Not even comparable.
28/01/2010 06:31:06 PM
- 942 Views
Re: Not even comparable.
28/01/2010 07:50:38 PM
- 1055 Views
Could you please take the effort to read my posts?
28/01/2010 10:45:01 PM
- 1007 Views
And, just to double post:
27/01/2010 07:12:17 PM
- 823 Views
Re: And, just to double post:
27/01/2010 08:25:45 PM
- 1088 Views
Nice answer.
28/01/2010 12:10:27 AM
- 1147 Views
Re: Nice answer.
28/01/2010 01:55:16 PM
- 1079 Views
Hilarious.
28/01/2010 06:36:22 PM
- 1183 Views
Re: Hilarious.
28/01/2010 07:15:20 PM
- 1080 Views
Re: Hilarious.
28/01/2010 07:41:29 PM
- 1091 Views
Re: Hilarious.
28/01/2010 07:53:34 PM
- 943 Views
Re: Hilarious.
28/01/2010 10:55:57 PM
- 1124 Views
That's because you didn't look at other posts.
29/01/2010 03:37:08 PM
- 1076 Views
Moridin's main directive was..
29/01/2010 03:57:41 PM
- 1109 Views
Re: Moridin's main directive was..
29/01/2010 04:50:16 PM
- 1151 Views
Preventing order wasn't accomplished...
29/01/2010 05:12:22 PM
- 1110 Views
I disagree.
29/01/2010 05:28:59 PM
- 1504 Views
I will stop our discussion here; the posts are already pushed too far to the right of my display.
*NM*
29/01/2010 06:14:29 PM
- 576 Views

You expect me to search every post you've made on this forum, ever?
29/01/2010 06:50:49 PM
- 1032 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
27/01/2010 01:00:42 AM
- 1060 Views
I don't see a flaw
27/01/2010 06:24:44 AM
- 1168 Views
Re: I don't see a flaw
27/01/2010 04:18:27 PM
- 1115 Views
Yup, I'm tired of seeing arguments that ignore the need to back up their own claims.
27/01/2010 05:47:16 PM
- 1075 Views
Let's give you one logic path for Millisair being poisoned.
27/01/2010 05:47:04 PM
- 1102 Views
I don't think there's a flaw, I think you misinterpret Graendal's plans
27/01/2010 06:57:44 PM
- 1084 Views
Good point on Ituralde - he may still be Compulsed in ways we're yet to discover. *NM*
28/01/2010 04:11:15 AM
- 688 Views
Re: Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story.
27/01/2010 09:11:32 PM
- 1062 Views