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Re: I'm think Mesaana's hand is quicker than the eye Shishka Send a noteboard - 18/01/2010 05:58:44 PM
From what I've read from Brandon, and from TGS, Mesaana is not bound by the Oaths. His statement that she defeated the Oath Rod implies that she was not bound, but rather defeated actually being bound in the first place. Not only that, but Mesaana is over 300 years old, which would make her die on the spot or at least look like Cadsuane after a few weeks. Very few Aes Sedai live past 300 once they're bound.


I'm not sure Mesaana would die, but regardless I agree with your reasoning - it's essentially the same as mine.

We know that to be bound you need to channel a flow of Spirit into the rod and then make an Oath. It's possible she used some form of Illusion to make it seem like she was channeling into the rod,


Actually, the person being Bound is not the one who channels the Spirit into the rod - another channeler does that. So, when I talked about (and rejected) the idea of Mesaana diverting the flow of Spirit, I meant the other channeler's flow of Spirit. The person being Bound doesn't channel during the process, as I understand it. She just holds the rod and speaks the words.

or she used Illusion around a voice, so that the Rod bound the weave, and not her, if that makes sense... in other words, she made a fake target for the ter'angreal.


I see what you mean. However, since it appears the person being Bound has to hold the rod while speaking the words, I'm guessing that the holding part is key, in which case creating a fake target may not be possible.

Just thinking off the top of my head here. We certainly don't know enough to rule that idea out for certain.

My other thought is that she used some subtlety with Spirit that resembled Nynaeve's anti-Compulsion to Heal Compulsion - like a neutralizing weave that looked like a mirror but wouldn't be noticed easily by the attending Sisters.


Yeah, that might have been possible. But, for no one to notice her channeling during the process (since normally the Bound channeler doesn't channel), not only would she have had to invert the weaves (no problem, there), but she'd also have had to mask her ability (otherwise she'd glow), and if she had masked her ability before arriving, you'd think the other women there would have noticed. *shrugs *

Either way, Mesaana probably had lots of time to prepare and with her knowledge I think she found a way around the actual binding.


I agree. My guess is that, whatever she did, she did/prepared it before she arrived, so that she didn't have to channel during the process, because of the mask-her-ability issue I mentioned previously.
Rise and fall, turn the Wheel,
'cause all life is
is really just a circle.

-BHT&tM
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Mesaana and defeating the Oath Rod - 18/01/2010 04:50:29 PM 2633 Views
I'm think Mesaana's hand is quicker than the eye - 18/01/2010 05:12:12 PM 1278 Views
Re: I'm think Mesaana's hand is quicker than the eye - 18/01/2010 05:43:26 PM 1187 Views
I like that idea ... - 18/01/2010 06:07:09 PM 1067 Views
A little archaic though - 18/01/2010 06:58:04 PM 1056 Views
Just because she's an academic ... - 18/01/2010 08:27:50 PM 1164 Views
Re: I'm think Mesaana's hand is quicker than the eye - 18/01/2010 05:58:44 PM 1045 Views
I don't think Messana would have fallen over dead - 18/01/2010 06:06:35 PM 1099 Views
I agree ... - 18/01/2010 06:15:25 PM 987 Views
I'm not sure - 18/01/2010 06:54:51 PM 1009 Views
It didn't when Romanda retook her Oaths in TGS - 18/01/2010 07:13:20 PM 833 Views
Hmmm ... - 18/01/2010 07:24:51 PM 1002 Views
No she unswore them and retook them - 18/01/2010 07:33:30 PM 1054 Views
I'm not sure I follow - 18/01/2010 07:41:19 PM 1026 Views
The point I was trying to make was ... - 18/01/2010 08:05:16 PM 814 Views
Now I get it ... seems needlessly complex for the Oath Rod though - 18/01/2010 08:21:35 PM 808 Views
Yes, this is what I was thinking *NM* - 18/01/2010 08:29:20 PM 403 Views
What you suggested is pretty much what I've always thought ... - 18/01/2010 08:39:30 PM 824 Views
yup - 18/01/2010 09:02:04 PM 710 Views
I'm with you, though ... - 18/01/2010 09:27:59 PM 976 Views
The closest evidence we have is a Stilled/Burned out woman - 18/01/2010 09:49:41 PM 820 Views
But if being unbound reverts you to your normal lifespan, then being bound isn't really a punishment *NM* - 18/01/2010 09:52:29 PM 408 Views
Sure it is - 18/01/2010 10:02:09 PM 860 Views
Also ... - 18/01/2010 10:13:38 PM 845 Views
I considered that ... - 18/01/2010 10:11:32 PM 941 Views
I doubt we'll ever really know - 18/01/2010 10:26:43 PM 860 Views
Re: I'm not sure - 18/01/2010 07:22:34 PM 877 Views
interesting - 18/01/2010 07:46:12 PM 714 Views
Re: interesting - 18/01/2010 08:18:11 PM 867 Views
see above *NM* - 18/01/2010 08:23:28 PM 431 Views
I think it more like aging them faster... - 18/01/2010 08:24:56 PM 915 Views
and given how things in the AoL works this seems far more likely - 18/01/2010 08:32:52 PM 874 Views
Re: I'm not sure - 20/01/2010 12:59:27 PM 867 Views
She's not immortal ... yet - 20/01/2010 04:15:03 PM 770 Views
The Dark Ones Mark possibly could black the oath rod? *NM* - 20/01/2010 01:28:08 AM 397 Views
No, that can't be it, because when AS become Black Ajah ... - 20/01/2010 02:53:21 PM 796 Views
But Alviarin's mark is different. Perhaps the mark of a FS is too *NM* - 20/01/2010 04:21:16 PM 375 Views
Good point. I sort of misinterpreted what Kieran was suggesting. *NM* - 20/01/2010 07:19:02 PM 395 Views
Re: Good point. I sort of misinterpreted what Kieran was suggesting. - 22/01/2010 01:52:51 AM 950 Views
actually it's different - 22/01/2010 07:32:18 AM 915 Views
actually I think it's the same... - 23/01/2010 01:49:19 AM 608 Views
One point... - 18/01/2010 06:12:26 PM 993 Views
Good point ... - 18/01/2010 06:21:22 PM 783 Views
here's another quote that gives us - 18/01/2010 07:12:09 PM 1030 Views
FYI ... - 18/01/2010 06:50:22 PM 954 Views
Re: FYI ... - 18/01/2010 06:56:02 PM 1008 Views
Therava channeled the flow, in that case ... - 18/01/2010 07:11:00 PM 686 Views
Yes - 18/01/2010 06:55:22 PM 765 Views
Re: I'm think Mesaana's hand is quicker than the eye - 18/01/2010 06:10:45 PM 833 Views
Re: Replacing it with a fake - 18/01/2010 06:22:33 PM 810 Views
I highly doubt it ... - 18/01/2010 06:23:55 PM 870 Views
Why not ask somebody else to stand in for you? - 19/01/2010 07:55:39 PM 889 Views
I like this idea. *NM* - 20/01/2010 03:11:51 AM 381 Views
I agree... - 18/01/2010 06:55:33 PM 969 Views
Re: Mesaana and defeating the Oath Rod - 18/01/2010 09:43:34 PM 954 Views
I'm thinking the point of the thread is to discuss how to beat the Oath Rod, not Mesaana's disguise - 18/01/2010 09:59:18 PM 784 Views
Right, and also ... - 18/01/2010 10:17:11 PM 804 Views
IMHO... - 19/01/2010 03:41:10 AM 995 Views
Another interesting possibility - 19/01/2010 05:08:42 PM 805 Views
I'd say it was highly unlikely that the Binder/Oath Rod works that way. *NM* - 19/01/2010 06:06:49 PM 344 Views
We've seen pretty weird stuff happens before - 19/01/2010 06:30:12 PM 875 Views
Oh, I agree ... - 19/01/2010 06:47:52 PM 677 Views
Re: Oh, I agree ... found a few tidbits ... EDIT - 19/01/2010 06:55:22 PM 816 Views
Heh, I had just dug up that quote myself, before I saw your edit ... - 19/01/2010 07:17:19 PM 840 Views
I agree, it seems as if Moghedien just effectively transmigrated Birgitte - 19/01/2010 10:00:45 PM 915 Views
she could just be posing as a non-channeler. - 19/01/2010 05:52:01 PM 783 Views
To speak no word that is not true - 19/01/2010 10:06:30 PM 858 Views
Could there be a true word, though? - 20/01/2010 03:47:46 PM 1108 Views
In going through some old RJ quotes I found this gem... - 19/01/2010 10:22:03 PM 1127 Views
Good find, I had forgotten about that quote ... - 20/01/2010 02:42:55 PM 850 Views
Yes - 20/01/2010 03:03:53 PM 837 Views
Agreed - our guts are thinking alike again. *NM* - 20/01/2010 03:12:30 PM 383 Views
Indeed - 20/01/2010 03:28:12 PM 733 Views
Oh I agree! I just thought it was funny that RJ made such a quote - 20/01/2010 04:20:09 PM 844 Views
In the AoL... - 20/01/2010 04:49:24 PM 921 Views
Re: In the AoL... - 20/01/2010 07:17:55 PM 712 Views
I was thinking this too - 20/01/2010 07:18:19 PM 877 Views
Still seems like two oaths, to me, due to the "and" ... - 20/01/2010 07:27:03 PM 743 Views
The "and" means nothing... - 20/01/2010 08:01:27 PM 693 Views
Re: Good find, I had forgotten about that quote ... - 21/01/2010 05:24:18 AM 1058 Views
I like it, mainly because it points to Mesaana being bested by Egwene in T'A'R - 21/01/2010 04:26:34 PM 723 Views
Re: Mesaana and defeating the Oath Rod - 20/01/2010 04:11:37 AM 842 Views
Re: Mesaana and defeating the Oath Rod - 20/01/2010 07:28:39 AM 793 Views
It can't be that easy ... - 20/01/2010 02:51:47 PM 800 Views

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