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You're reading the evidence wrong. Shannow Send a noteboard - 22/12/2009 06:27:17 PM
How much can 6 foot 6 man weigh? Do you think either Rand or Lan could possibly weigh more than 225lbs? According to the national heart institute a healthy man of 6 feet 6 inches should weigh in at less than 215lbs to have an acceptable BMI. Assuming Rand and Lan are more muscular than average that still won't put them over 230lbs, and probably less as swordsmanship would be difficult for a man who was too bulky.

As for Sea folk, even assuming they are tiny, let's say 5'2" the NHI says 125lbs is about right... so no I'm not completely guessing at this. Unless you think Rand and Lan are both freakishly overweight and the WF insanely tiny.

Lanfear vs. Egwene's circle... they both all female so E/R/L would be stronger regardless and be of similar dexterity. Lanfear would likely still kick their butts as she managed Alivia with angreal who would have been even stronger than that circle of 3! I don't see why people seem to forget that Cyndane wiped the floor with a woman who must have been at least 2x stronger than she was simply because she was more skilled.

You have no basis or proof that Egwene is "much weaker" than Nynaeve, RJ himself has stated that level to be "one step below" Forsaken strength! If one step below = 50% as strong that's one hell of a step!


I've shown it to you countless times, but you refuse to accept the facts. Alivia is a poor example, because RJ himself said that Lanfear only matched her because Alivia has so little knowledge of the Power. A male Forsaken would not have that handicap.

I come back to the simple comparison. Lanfear has to be AT LEAST of similar strength to Egwene, Lelaine and Romanda combined. Because it all comes down to EFFECTIVE strength. And Lanfear's EFFECTIVE strength, has to match the effective strength of a male Forsaken, which must AT LEAST match the effective strength of Egwene's circle.

That fits the evidence. Your inflated model does not.
This message last edited by Shannow on 22/12/2009 at 06:28:12 PM
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I've been playing with some numbers since we've been having all of these OP strength debates darius_sedai - 20/12/2009 06:34:05 PM 1356 Views
There are 21 levels, not 100. More later. *NM* fionwe1987 - 20/12/2009 07:23:18 PM 484 Views
RJ has said a number of times that the 21 level scale darius_sedai - 20/12/2009 07:35:25 PM 745 Views
Few glaring errors... Shannow - 20/12/2009 09:04:55 PM 936 Views
Re: Few glaring errors... darius_sedai - 21/12/2009 07:52:18 AM 891 Views
You don't get it, do you... Shannow - 21/12/2009 08:19:00 AM 841 Views
Didn't you claim that Eggy+Rom+Lel cannot match a male forsaken? Now they can match Lanfear? fionwe1987 - 21/12/2009 04:14:32 PM 733 Views
That only strengthens my point. Shannow - 21/12/2009 06:23:39 PM 760 Views
No it does not. fionwe1987 - 28/12/2009 02:45:42 AM 823 Views
What you are missing is that darius_sedai - 21/12/2009 06:46:04 PM 778 Views
I'm not missing it at all.. Shannow - 21/12/2009 06:58:04 PM 810 Views
Let's try matching that with the actual text darius_sedai - 22/12/2009 03:01:36 PM 781 Views
Not correct... Shannow - 22/12/2009 03:29:24 PM 874 Views
Believe as you like, I'm not here to convince you to otherwise, I'm stating how I read the evidence darius_sedai - 22/12/2009 06:01:24 PM 775 Views
You're reading the evidence wrong. Shannow - 22/12/2009 06:27:17 PM 756 Views
RJ also pointed out that Alivia's skill set as a weapon came in handy darius_sedai - 22/12/2009 07:40:35 PM 710 Views
I thought a power law distribution is much more likely, TBH redhand - 20/12/2009 09:39:21 PM 839 Views
Yes. It essentially refers to a skewed histogram - biased to the lower end of the range... Shannow - 20/12/2009 09:53:18 PM 867 Views
Corrections Shadowkiller - 21/12/2009 01:48:43 AM 890 Views
No... Shannow - 21/12/2009 07:47:58 AM 768 Views
True, the application of this model is inconsistent *NM* Shadowkiller - 21/12/2009 02:34:26 PM 607 Views
Not if you point out that the average AS is not as strong as the overall average channeler darius_sedai - 25/12/2009 04:30:17 AM 745 Views
yet RJ has said flat out that OP strength is on an Bell Curve. Meaning the majority of channelers darius_sedai - 21/12/2009 07:36:22 AM 750 Views
Perhaps... Phelix - 21/12/2009 07:52:13 AM 832 Views
I've always hated bell curves Ryan - 21/12/2009 03:56:26 PM 769 Views
The most logical answer is that the average AOL channeler was stronger than the current average... Shannow - 21/12/2009 06:36:07 PM 759 Views
and that in no way maps to any kind of Bell Curve darius_sedai - 22/12/2009 06:02:41 PM 644 Views
Why? Shannow - 22/12/2009 06:34:25 PM 774 Views
Can you provide the quote where RJ tells us the darius_sedai - 22/12/2009 07:45:04 PM 689 Views
Always go back to the evidence... Shannow - 22/12/2009 09:03:42 PM 839 Views
I'll respond when you can actually provide a few actual quotes to support any of this darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 03:20:44 PM 755 Views
Name an item you dispute and I will provide the quote.... Shannow - 23/12/2009 05:19:49 PM 736 Views
it's addressed below darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 05:23:58 PM 740 Views
I've been looking into this a bit... and you really do overstate things to suit your arguments darius_sedai - 24/12/2009 06:15:44 PM 782 Views
And in looking for quotes for another thread I came across this gem darius_sedai - 29/12/2009 09:54:34 PM 756 Views
Nice! It proves what I've been saying for ages... fionwe1987 - 29/12/2009 10:13:41 PM 782 Views
Which is why I contend that they are about 80% of Lanfear darius_sedai - 29/12/2009 10:16:07 PM 759 Views
I wasn't trying to rip him a new one. Phelix - 22/12/2009 09:38:43 PM 670 Views
I don't think we have a representative sample of the mode in this population RugbyPlayingAshaman - 22/12/2009 08:35:23 PM 806 Views
Except that gateway size is used multiple times by characters to judge comparative strength... Shannow - 22/12/2009 09:21:07 PM 791 Views
Re: Except that gateway size is used multiple times by characters to judge comparative strength... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 22/12/2009 11:32:21 PM 902 Views
I agree that it's practically impossible to determine strength darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 03:19:49 PM 782 Views
How convenient. And by the way, it is NOT tied to a Talent. Anyone who is strong enough, can Travel. *NM* Shannow - 23/12/2009 04:36:24 PM 444 Views
Seriously go re-read the series, how can you have missed that Traveling is a Talent? darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 04:54:51 PM 688 Views
It is a weave, the knowledge of which guarantees that you can use it, if you are strong enough... Shannow - 23/12/2009 05:35:36 PM 777 Views
Yet every AS can Heal to a degree and Cloud Dancing involves weaves too darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 05:41:42 PM 810 Views
Lews Therin can't Heal. Aginor can't Heal. If you don't have the Talent, you can't do it. *NM* Shannow - 23/12/2009 05:52:02 PM 441 Views
LTT and Aginor have "Little Ability" with Healing darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 06:02:13 PM 811 Views
Because the channelers THEMSELVES don't use Healing to judge each other's strength... Shannow - 23/12/2009 06:06:58 PM 732 Views
The Channelers state that there is a minimum level of strength to make the Weave work darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 06:11:55 PM 903 Views
Beonin's Gateway darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 06:30:25 PM 763 Views
No, it makes her 25% as strong as Rand! Thanks for proving my model to be virtually perfect! Shannow - 23/12/2009 06:36:53 PM 736 Views
Nope, Beonin shouldn't be that strong! darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 06:48:30 PM 710 Views
This is true, however... lyringlas - 23/12/2009 04:55:48 PM 809 Views
Aviendha's gateway size doesn't decrease. She is just less energy efficient in creating it... Shannow - 23/12/2009 05:30:17 PM 1080 Views
Aviendha is suffering from the second weave limitation darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 05:37:45 PM 850 Views
Conceded. My faulty memory is to blame in this case. But it doesn't change the rule... Shannow - 23/12/2009 06:01:33 PM 700 Views
I'll give you that there is a stength limitation to Traveling darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 06:06:41 PM 723 Views
Why do the characters in the books judge each other's strength on gateway size then? *NM* Shannow - 23/12/2009 06:08:17 PM 410 Views
Re: Why do the characters in the books judge each other's strength on gateway size then? darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 06:20:18 PM 742 Views
And there you have it...Thank you. Shannow - 23/12/2009 06:27:24 PM 735 Views
And linked with Romanda and Lelaine darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 06:34:42 PM 733 Views
Sorry. That's pure speculation on your part. *NM* Shannow - 23/12/2009 06:38:43 PM 420 Views
No more than yours is! darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 06:49:57 PM 762 Views
That entire passage is in the context of strength... Shannow - 23/12/2009 07:55:50 PM 645 Views
You need to re-read some of this stuff darius_sedai - 23/12/2009 11:01:15 PM 830 Views
Re: I don't think we have a representative sample of the mode in this population Abunderment - 26/12/2009 12:38:43 PM 750 Views
Re: I don't think we have a representative sample of the mode in this population *NM* Abunderment - 26/12/2009 12:41:01 PM 390 Views
Re: I don't think we have a representative sample of the mode in this population darius_sedai - 26/12/2009 06:37:50 PM 741 Views
Goodness Abunderment - 31/12/2009 03:37:23 AM 767 Views
I'm working within the context of what we've been told by the author darius_sedai - 31/12/2009 03:43:31 AM 720 Views
Since you love Wiki so much darius_sedai - 31/12/2009 03:55:09 AM 732 Views
No you are not Abunderment - 31/12/2009 03:58:28 AM 759 Views
Dude we're discussion works of fiction darius_sedai - 31/12/2009 04:08:12 AM 796 Views
Dumb Bell Distribution of Mongoloid Turings Abunderment - 31/12/2009 04:36:50 AM 856 Views
Back to school AS, and you will be able to do this Abunderment - 26/12/2009 12:34:39 PM 707 Views
The problem we're working with is that RJ says strength follows a Bell Curve distribution darius_sedai - 26/12/2009 03:29:26 PM 740 Views
And RJ knew his maths (and you don't) Abunderment - 31/12/2009 03:22:09 AM 780 Views
I'm not the one who said OP strength followed a Bell Curve Distribution darius_sedai - 31/12/2009 03:34:55 AM 731 Views
You are the one who is MIS-USING his statement Abunderment - 31/12/2009 03:44:26 AM 737 Views
darius_sedai - 31/12/2009 03:48:20 AM 1026 Views
The pathos of Darius Abunderment - 31/12/2009 04:26:15 AM 763 Views
Is Lanfear the strongest?(now) knightmarea7x - 29/12/2009 12:46:13 AM 679 Views
Re: Is Lanfear the strongest?(now) darius_sedai - 29/12/2009 04:21:47 PM 747 Views
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