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Did he say he could not touch things, or that he just could not counter uber-channeling? Datakim Send a noteboard - 12/12/2009 12:30:40 AM
I don't understand how he could touch Mesaana or cancel out weaves she has tied off or maintained, while not being able to affect the net of Compulsion set in Elza's mind.


I think it has been said/speculated that he has a greater hold over those who have sworn to the DO. So he might not be able to cancel the weaves of someone who is not loyal to him. He is able to physically hurt someone who cannot fight back like Mesaana however.


Also, I was disgusted by what RJ had happen to Moghedien and Mesaana. I'm hoping the same punishment was visited on Moridin, Balthamel and Aginor - their failures were all more spectacular, and bullying the weakest of the female Forsaken lowered the scope of the evil in the series, and it seems to me that this is a blow that is worse than the breaking of Semirhage in terms of tarnishing the overall sense of risk in the series.

The double standard is quite tiresome. And lame.


I think the argument could be made that its not exactly failure that pisses the DO off. I mean given that the wheel has apparently been turning for a long time, and that the DO has failed to win in each turning, it makes sense that he might be more understanding than the average evil overlord about failure. Sometimes you just cannot win, not even every time.

That is why Balthamel and Aginor were not horribly punished, sure they failed miserably and I expect the DO might have slapped his hand to his forehead in despair once he saw how, but they also showed no sign of actually being disloyal. Ishamael too got his ass kicked and failed, but once more he was loyal to the DO until the very end.

The crimes of Moghedien and Mesaana are worse than just failure and incompetence. They actually betrayed the DO. In the case of Mesaana, the betrayal was one of knowing disobedience. In the case of Moghedien, she willingly and knowingly supported and taught the DO's enemies.

If Moghedien had escaped by channeling the TP or killing herself or something, I expect the DO would have been more understanding and saved/protected her.

Likewise if Mesaana had come to the cleansing and been vaporized by a blast from Callandor, the DO would have captured her soul and saved her.

But their true crime was one of betrayal/disobedience which is why their punishment was also worse. I expect if Asmodean had been captured alive, he too would have enjoyed some quality time with SH too before being mindtrapped.
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Two idiot Forsaken in the Prologue - 10/12/2009 04:31:10 PM 1568 Views
Oh you are being unfair! - 10/12/2009 04:49:31 PM 705 Views
LOL. Are you implying Mesaana killed Asmodean? *NM* - 10/12/2009 07:13:27 PM 268 Views
That would be a funny twist, but in reality I think we all know - 10/12/2009 08:10:16 PM 566 Views
Yes; this pretty much matched my expectations - esp. for Demandred. - 10/12/2009 04:56:32 PM 709 Views
Mesaana was motivated out of... - 10/12/2009 07:16:43 PM 627 Views
Ah, then she would be more of an idiot than I thought. 2nd Rate indeed. *NM* - 10/12/2009 08:19:05 PM 238 Views
Re: Yes; this pretty much matched my expectations - esp. for Demandred. - 11/12/2009 06:47:43 AM 662 Views
But BS said that Shaidar Haran couldn't do things in the physical world without aid. - 11/12/2009 03:20:59 PM 569 Views
I think that just proves SH isn't gay! *NM* - 11/12/2009 04:07:47 PM 257 Views
Or it could just prove - 11/12/2009 05:42:33 PM 546 Views
Re: Or it could just prove - 11/12/2009 07:00:57 PM 481 Views
I agree, but I think it's about the DO being totally random - 11/12/2009 07:07:17 PM 562 Views
Did he say he could not touch things, or that he just could not counter uber-channeling? - 12/12/2009 12:30:40 AM 501 Views
I don't ever want to find out who Demandred is - 11/12/2009 02:47:58 PM 503 Views
Imagine how bad it would be if - 11/12/2009 11:22:56 PM 497 Views
I would say... - 10/12/2009 04:58:15 PM 621 Views
he hasn't really done anything - 10/12/2009 05:25:03 PM 614 Views
But the point is valid - 10/12/2009 05:32:12 PM 751 Views
I'm pretty sure he did something... - 10/12/2009 05:33:04 PM 602 Views
Re: I'm pretty sure he did something... - 10/12/2009 07:51:25 PM 487 Views
Yeah, but now Graendal is dead, while Demandred is still alive. *NM* - 10/12/2009 08:29:24 PM 503 Views
Re: Yeah, but now Graendal is dead, while Demandred is still alive. *NM* - 11/12/2009 12:17:54 AM 453 Views
I tend to agree - 11/12/2009 06:52:51 AM 615 Views
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of course he's never set foot anywhere close to anything long enough - 11/12/2009 02:11:19 PM 488 Views
Is it smart to take a risk... - 11/12/2009 02:22:18 PM 474 Views
I think your making a lot of assumptions - 11/12/2009 05:40:47 PM 502 Views
Well... - 11/12/2009 06:04:47 PM 509 Views
Re: Well... - 11/12/2009 07:15:06 PM 637 Views
I agree that Demandred will fail in the end. - 12/12/2009 11:00:59 AM 498 Views
Either a Channeler or Mat - 12/12/2009 03:41:09 PM 424 Views
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Thanks for the BS quote, that's new news to me! - 12/12/2009 03:55:37 PM 477 Views
Moridin didn't want to betrayal Sammael... - 12/12/2009 04:07:49 PM 465 Views
It amounts to the same thing - 12/12/2009 04:12:42 PM 505 Views
Then you could also say... - 12/12/2009 04:22:30 PM 464 Views
no actually you cannot - 12/12/2009 04:46:03 PM 464 Views
Ah, I give up... - 12/12/2009 04:50:07 PM 468 Views
thanks for your permission - 12/12/2009 04:53:01 PM 481 Views
To be fair, Mesaana's brood of channelers promise could still come to fruition. *NM* - 10/12/2009 04:58:28 PM 276 Views
Yup, especially if she is a higher-up AS in the tower. - 10/12/2009 05:57:12 PM 540 Views
Sanderson's first attempt at portraying the Forsaken based on character summaries in RJ's notes... - 10/12/2009 05:29:51 PM 688 Views
Well... - 11/12/2009 06:55:17 AM 525 Views
That was RJ's biggest flaw, IMO - 11/12/2009 02:45:41 PM 533 Views
I'll respond to someone who wants to say that - 11/12/2009 05:19:52 PM 583 Views
Ya. Fain's a good exception. I still have hopes for him. And... Thereva was scary, but... - 11/12/2009 08:32:38 PM 478 Views
Slayer/Luc/Isam is also pretty cool. - 12/12/2009 04:16:14 PM 473 Views
One theme of tGS was "The Forsaken are actually pretty lame" - 11/12/2009 05:12:55 PM 521 Views

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