I'd say it's more like
Cadsuane = 2 (Moiraine's reaction to her leads me to believe that Cadsuane is closer to the FS than she is to regular AS too)
Egwene = 3 (in tGS her shield is almost always held by 2 "strong" Reds despite the forkroot)
Nynaeve = 3.5 (Semirhage's shield was maintained by 3 women at all times, Daigian being one of them so really only 2.5 AS).
Cadsuane = 2 (Moiraine's reaction to her leads me to believe that Cadsuane is closer to the FS than she is to regular AS too)
Egwene = 3 (in tGS her shield is almost always held by 2 "strong" Reds despite the forkroot)
Nynaeve = 3.5 (Semirhage's shield was maintained by 3 women at all times, Daigian being one of them so really only 2.5 AS).
Elza says that Cadsuane must be using an angreal because she's drawing more than she and Merise combined. This leads me to believe that Cadsuane is less powerful than 2 Sisters.
Bode’s future would be brilliant. Her potential almost equalled Egwene’s.
- Crossroads of Twilight, What the Oath Rod Can Do
- Crossroads of Twilight, What the Oath Rod Can Do
Yes, but I'm saying that people aren't going wild about her strength. Your quote is valid though.
What makes you think this? There is no evidence to support this as all of them have been addressed and Be'lal couldn't even feel their strength! Moghedien is in no way solely addressing Nynaeve! She comes in, slaps some compulsion on them, starts talking about them being strong enough to be trouble, then looks at Nynaeve and says "especially you"... implying that she is even stronger than Elayne (as we know), but clearly Elayne even as far back as TSR was strong enough to be a problem.
Be'lal may have a way to feel their strength - we know that Rahvin described the strength of an Aes Sedai he was using to Lanfear. Then again, Demandred relies on Mesaana to tell him about Cyndane. On the other hand, perhaps it requires a weave and he would not risk channeling directly at Cyndane. Many possibilities
Moghedien addresses Elayne and Nynaeve, but it's Nynaeve who takes most of her notice. If you're a normal sized guy and you come across two men, one 6"5 and one 8", then you correctly remark that both are very tall, but especially the 8" guy. There's no way that the 6"5 person would elicit that degree of shock even if he is uncommon.
So now 3 times equates to "often"? And we have no idea what the circumstances of these battles were like, there is no evidence that these women had anymore change than Tovien and her group did. I agree that Lanfear can match even one as strong as Ishamael/Rand, but that's more to do with her strength combined with her dexterity. She beat back Alivia who was at least 2x stronger with angreal on her side! I think strength has little to do with dueling (especially between men and women)... obviously you can take on a channeler of more than 2x your own power if you are more highly skilled.
And yet Kiruna is confident that six Aes Sedai could not overwhelm him. This is confirmed by historical texts that show that six women could not overwhelm a strong male.
Strength is an issue in dueling. You merely saw the extremes fighting one another - one with incredible skill, and one with incredible strength but little skill. There are countless examples in the series where strength is a large issue when estimating an opponent. The best would be in NS when Moiraine duels Merean, and says that the stronger woman is much harder to fight.
I think her poise against a swarm of Sul'dam gives us plenty of indication! She fought off 20-some (50 pairs originally figure 30 went to the ground to gather AS) pairs of women who she has a deeper seated fear of than any Forsaken she'll ever battle! Strength issues aside Egwene has some major skill and IMO would do much better than 6 linked AS against one of the FS.
Conjecture. Egwene isn't even as strong as six linked Aes Sedai. If 3 or 4 linked women could match the Forsaken at the cleansing, you're effectively saying that Egwene could overwhelm one of them, which is clearly not true. Egwene has never claimed to be on that level, and never could be. Egwene may be the most skilled Aes Sedai by a long shot, but it's probably that most, if not all, of the Forsaken are still vastly more skilled in saidar.
I agree that Cadsuane's status is part of it, but do you really think Semirhage would have reacted to Verin or even Moiraine in the same way she did to Cadsuane? I doubt it, i think Cadsuane has enough strength to be noticed by even one such as Semirhage.
We don't know what Semirhage saw when she evaluated Cadsuane.
When does Egwene say this? The entire book 2 "strong Reds" hold a shield on her. Not to mention we know that even back in TFoH (or maybe TSR) Amys tells her that she would have broken through her shield soon. Amys is stronger than most sisters (probably around Moiraine level), so it's very doubtful that any one AS could hold Egwene.
KoD (Embers falling on dry grass) - ... Silviana was far from weak; there was no hope that she could break the woman's shield."
Amys's strength is further supported by Melaine announcing to Alviendha that she herself is stronger than most AS, and we know from earlier in the series that Amys is stronger than Melaine.
Amy's strength varies between Sheriam's and Moiraine's.
This point kind of goes against what you are saying though. Nynaeve should never have been able to shield Moghedien or Talaan, not be unable to shield Elayne!
No it doesn't. It shows that concentration and preparation are essential in channeling and can greatly weaken a weave. Nynaeve saw herself naked and lashed out at Elayne and failed. Meanwhile, we know that she can shield women even of her own strength.
It's similar to Moghedien's chapter where she weaves Compulsion on the innkeeper prior to balefiring Nynaeve. She says it's a hasty web with precipitous effects that could leave the woman dimwitted, but she has no time for finesse. A weave isn't just a weave. By preparing a shield too well, Egwene actually stilled Amico.
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Is Nynaeve of "very rare" strength?
21/11/2009 02:53:22 PM
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BS said...
21/11/2009 02:57:58 PM
- 778 Views
Actually, you are adding a word that isn't there.
21/11/2009 03:47:48 PM
- 990 Views
IMO, it's self evident that the female list only contains named characters
21/11/2009 03:58:33 PM
- 655 Views
IMO, the above post by "Logain" is trolling and not worth the debating!! *NM*
21/11/2009 04:01:08 PM
- 236 Views
Re: IMO, it's self evident that the female list only contains named characters
21/11/2009 04:09:58 PM
- 508 Views
I don't know
21/11/2009 04:17:02 PM
- 474 Views
I find it unlikely that a super strong channeler would end up being unimportant to the plot *NM*
21/11/2009 11:54:43 PM
- 230 Views
she's in the top 0.1% of channelers we know of
21/11/2009 03:01:02 PM
- 538 Views
She's in the top 0.05% *NM*
21/11/2009 11:41:42 PM
- 226 Views
Re: Is Nynaeve of "very rare" strength?
21/11/2009 06:00:29 PM
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So, in terms of Nynaeve's power, do you think she is VERY rare? *NM*
21/11/2009 06:23:14 PM
- 234 Views
Yes. She is so rare that she is mythic. A foiled Nynaeve can prolly fetch $100. *NM*
21/11/2009 09:59:28 PM
- 229 Views
So what's the point? Why the quotes? *NM*
21/11/2009 10:24:37 PM
- 213 Views
Well...
21/11/2009 11:44:40 PM
- 535 Views
I really doubt Nynaeve strength channelers are one in thousand...
22/11/2009 12:09:15 AM
- 531 Views
I agree with you!
23/11/2009 12:48:35 AM
- 458 Views
Re: I agree with you!
23/11/2009 03:56:14 AM
- 494 Views
Re: I agree with you!
25/11/2009 05:50:06 PM
- 484 Views
Re: I agree with you!
26/11/2009 05:10:22 PM
- 587 Views
Re: I agree with you!
26/11/2009 07:22:30 PM
- 479 Views
Re: I agree with you!
26/11/2009 07:36:38 PM
- 432 Views
Hmmm...
26/11/2009 10:38:44 PM
- 487 Views
Re: Hmmm...
27/11/2009 04:36:59 AM
- 518 Views
Re: Hmmm...
27/11/2009 05:40:50 AM
- 530 Views
Re: Hmmm...
27/11/2009 04:42:36 PM
- 541 Views
Re: Hmmm...
27/11/2009 05:53:11 PM
- 489 Views
Re: Hmmm...
30/11/2009 04:44:41 AM
- 534 Views
Don't forget Therava. She's stronger than any woman in the tower according to Galina.
28/11/2009 09:41:10 PM
- 430 Views
Re: Don't forget Therava. She's stronger than any woman in the tower according to Galina.
29/11/2009 12:40:02 AM
- 647 Views
Fionwe1987 is right. We do have a large enough sample. And the linking examples are good. *NM*
28/11/2009 09:32:14 PM
- 215 Views