Active Users:930 Time:15/11/2024 08:20:29 AM
Who da man? I'M da Man! Cannoli Send a noteboard - 28/10/2009 02:06:36 AM
People who complain about various protective ter’angreal sets being too convenient & deus ex machina-ish will not have seen anything yet,


So true, and here I am thinking of Verin's appearance in the Tower.

1. Keep the scope of the issue in mind Last book, Egwene won the hearts and loyalty of the novices in the Tower. Impressive, yes? But what does that achieve? How is that progress towards the fight against the Shadow? Or even to reuniting the Tower or gaining the Amyrlin Seat? It’s not like they have a vote or make an economic contribution.
Well, to be fair, it made it slightly easier for her to conscript a handful of them into her link. But I hardly think the exigent circumstances were the kind where she would have had difficulty even if they all knew her for the tremendous ass she really is.

Likewise, most of the people she impresses with whatever qualities she fakes will be people who thought the bi-curious increasingly alcoholic megalomaniacal sadist was a good choice for Amyrlin.
I LOVE it when Egwene herself confirms my critiques!

So when Egwene wins, bear in mind, she has not averted a major calamity, or saved thousands of people, at a time when other battles are being waged that DO have those stakes! Ituralde’s strategic ambush of the Seanchan has FAR more follower’s lives, enemy lives and innocent lives and greater direct implications for the situation of the world than Egwene’s plan to expose Elaida’s tyranny.
One might argue that the single most important event of Egwene's whole "PoV cluster" (in B-Sand's terms) was her seeing the sunlight Rand made.

Holding Egwene's victory as a major triumph in a league with the others taking place in KoD & future books is like commiserating with Egwene’s sufferings and admiring her triumphs in getting her stolen credit card cancelled and her $67 dollars back... while Rand is eluding black market organ harvesters...Sorry, Egwene. We REALLY are not impressed.
She comes close to realizing this when she admits that Rand was treated far worse by Elaida.

2. Keep in mind just whom she is defeating or winning over
Her opponents' arguments were pathetic in the Tower, her advice was glaringly obvious common sense, and she was handled with kid gloves, except when raging psychosis made her adversary look bad. Sure, it's not Egwene's fault that she is impressing morons, but these retarded imbeciles are the ones she is determined to protect at all costs, plans to punish Rand for bonding and would rather see thousands of soldiers die than harm a hair on the heads of these simpletons.

3. Egwene is a shameless hypocrite. I will give her this: tGS has promoted her to "slightly embarassed hypocrite," due to her recognition and admittance of her hypocrisy. Not that she is refraining from reaping the rewards, of course.

4. Cui bono? Egwene's turning on her own followers after being accepted by the Tower loyalists, while it may be promoted as a magnificent display of fairness and justice, is simply a re-enactment of the same principles she was operating on when she smacked down Lelaine and Romanda in tPoD after revealing that they had accidentally voted her dictatorial powers. She said she could not afford to let either one get the moral high ground or upper hand (and that was the same principle operating in her absence from the camp - Lelaine getting an edge over Romanda was to be feared, because it might make her powerful enough to challenge Egwene), and she is doing the same with the halves of the Tower that are now reunited - she can't let either faction think she owes them more lest they get sufficient power to influence her. So she castigates everyone, pretends to scold herself (while retaining the power and acclaim of the Amyrlin Seat) but forcing everyone to make a gesture of guilt. Oh, and let's not forget that Elaida could have made her exact portion of her speech in the Hall about what she was going to demand in the times to come. Elaida was a tyrant who bullied sisters and abused the limits of her power and the Hall should have checked her, but Egwene is going to be a strong forceful leader, who will cut through old, worn-out customs and will criticize the Hall's obstructionist behavior when they try to check HER power.

5. How does Egwene get what she got?Egwene has a history of getting things through sheer luck or by proximity to people who actually matter in their own right.
"Hi! I'm Verin and I'll be your deus ex machina for the evening!"

Just keep in mind HOW Egwene wins. Is it the result of a carefully planned strategy or the execution of prearranged contingencies? Or is it merely circumstances beyond Egwene’s control creating a situation where she looks good? I think we know how this will turn out.
I don't know HOW you can call her portion of tGS ANYTHING but what I predicted here!

6. Comeuppance does not matter, and the lack of it does not hurt our cause.Egwene’s happy ending does not prove anything about her, and is not a repudiation of our position. Trust not in the assertions of her heroism when they come from her or her sycophants, but weigh them against what she actually does.
What she did was exactly no different than Rand's unleashing of Callandor on the Seanchan in Ebou Dar back in tPoD. But in Rand it's a sign of arrogance & hubris, while in Egwene it is sheer good fortune that she got handed the information she needed to grab the sa'angreal.

7. If Egwene DOES do something genuinely good, we STILL win! she will surely to reverse her previous positions or else take up a course of action we have been wanting her to take all along.
Boo-yah! I've been ripping the rebels up one side and down the other for years, and Egwene agrees!

So it shall be for Egwene. Either it will be a cheap victory that falls into her lap through none of her own doing,
*COUGH, COUGH*verin*COUGH, COUGH*!!!!!

no matter how much effort she expends on futile & self-serving pursuits that actually contribute very little to that victory,
Wow, look at her blasting at those Seanchan, who were more or less leaving anyway... all the while envisioning herself as some sort of hero and in grandiose terms.

a false accomplishment, spun by her egocentric mentality into a grand triumph and blindly swallowed by the readers through the magic of the PoV Trap, or else it will be a retraction of her prior faults and a genuine change and improvement that will only prove WE have been right in our criticism all along.
Damn right!
Cannoli
“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Inde muagdhe Aes Sedai misain ye!
Deus Vult!
*MySmiley*
Reply to message
An Aegwenist Guide: Reading The Gathering Storm & Evading Egwne's PoV Trap. - 21/10/2009 10:18:44 PM 1551 Views
Preach, brother! - 21/10/2009 11:04:19 PM 535 Views
When did I ever credit her with long-term planning? *NM* - 22/10/2009 03:38:05 AM 251 Views
I see you survived your syrup encounter - 21/10/2009 11:06:26 PM 582 Views
Romanda? - 22/10/2009 12:56:53 AM 605 Views
Great post, you've made a believer out of me *NM* - 22/10/2009 06:07:48 PM 262 Views
Well apparently tGS proves all this to be the BS it is. Can't wait! *NM* - 22/10/2009 10:25:30 PM 355 Views
That's what you think. *NM* - 22/10/2009 10:46:15 PM 245 Views
Who da man? I'M da Man! - 28/10/2009 02:06:36 AM 622 Views

Reply to Message