Wheel of Time Messageboard: Lol... too true by Sidious

Back to Messageboard

Post New Thread

Help

Stats

Rules

Lol... too true Sidious Send a noteboard - 01/10/2009 09:32:29 PM

Rahvin was killed in the most improbable way imaginable:

Rand attacks him with an angreal (which probably doubles his strength), and Rahvin reacts by still managing to draw Rand into a territory that provides Rahvin with a strategic advantage. One of Sun Tzu's famous truths is that you must try to choose the territory that suits your strengths rather than your adversary's. Full marks to Rahvin. Unfortunately, even Sun Tzu himself could not have predicted that Nynaeve - totally untrained in TAR - would somehow capture Moghedien - the most skilled user of TAR EVER - and entrap her in an adam.

Nor could he have predicted that while this happened on the other side of the continent, that these two would happen to find themselves in the TAR version of Caemlyn, of all places.

And now for the most unbelievable coincidence of all.

Not even Nostradamus himself could have predicted that all of these totally random events would happen to take place at EXATLY THE SAME MOMENT that he happened to draw Rand into TAR.

Faced with a massively improbable sequence of events of this magnitude, Sun Tzu, Karl Von Clausowich, or even Alexander the Great himself might as well have thrown in the towel before they even started planning the battle.

Same goes for Sammael, who did everything by the book, drawing his foe into a terrirory he had prepared beforehand, only for Moridin to interfere and save Rand.

Compared to these two male Forsaken generals, Semirhage's plan was absolutely idiotic, and certainly not properly thought through.

Based on these three examples, the males are already demonstrated as having greater aptitude for strategy than the female generals.

The advantage is that RJ made the male Forsaken generals formidible. At least he didn't have them die with humiliation like Balthamel and Aginor. It took teams of people to kill Rahvin, Sammael and Be'lal.

Still, I think there are some facts worth mentioning. Rahvin wasn't really a general. The more I read the BWB on him, the more it seems like he was a male Graendal. The book even hints at as much. He did make two critical errors though -
- He tried to fight Rand from his throne without moving because he thought Rand couldn't Travel.
- When Rand turned into a beast in TAR he stood there savouring the moment, smiling. He should have killed Rand immediately.

Sammael was thwarted by Moridin, so he was unlucky there. Still, he can't whine that he was killed by Mashadar - he knew before he went there that it doesn't differentiate between him and Rand.

Be'lal entered a monologue which is typical of classic villainy. But who wouldn't against a 3rd Age Aes Sedai? Too bad she's one of about two Aes Sedai who know balefire and can weave it.

I still can't understand Semirhage's plan. How did she think she could capture Rand while he was surrounded by the most powerful channelers alive? The only possibility is that she had prepared weaves to produce intense pain or death in some of the party, which would give her enough time to a'dam Rand, and perhaps use his strength to finish off the rest of the party. Osan'gar knew pain weaves like that, and I'm sure Semirhage could do ten times the damage. What a ridiculous gamble though.

Lanfear didn't even have a plan. She just saw Rand walk past her wagon and decided to attack him. Aginor blew himself up. Later he returned and destroy an empty room.

This is why I think a non-general sent the Trollocs after Rand in KoD. It's the dumbest plan ever. There is no way that army could kill 30 Ashaman and Aes Sedai and a group of the deadliest channelers in the Light. Rand didn't lose a single channeler, and not even one of them got injured. For all this Forsaken knew, Rand could have used the Choedan Kal on this army - he certainly still has the male Access Key. This attack could thus only have been 'brilliantly' orchestrated by someone like Moghedien or Graendal. Demandred and Moridin almost exclude themselves because of the low IQ of this military blunder.

Wheel of Time board admin
Fan of Lanfear

This message last edited by Sidious on 01/10/2009 at 09:33:56 PM

Edit 1 by Sidious on 01/10/2009 at 09:33:56 PM

Reply to message

Are women really bad generals? Sidious - 01/10/2009 07:05:03 PM 1448 Views

I think that all we can conclude from this... Rand al'Thor - 01/10/2009 07:39:49 PM 742 Views

No. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 01/10/2009 07:41:35 PM 860 Views

Or RJ just loves stacking ridiculously unfavourable odds against the male Forsaken generals... Shannow - 01/10/2009 08:40:47 PM 962 Views

Lol... too true Sidious - 01/10/2009 09:32:29 PM 858 Views

And you guys whine about the lameness of RJ's villains? fionwe1987 - 01/10/2009 09:41:54 PM 847 Views

I still haven't seen proof of Demandred or Ishamael's "brilliance". RugbyPlayingAshaman - 01/10/2009 09:56:41 PM 699 Views

Ishamael's destroyed Civilization twice Rurouni_Kenshin - 02/10/2009 04:25:37 AM 669 Views

Re: Ishamael's destroyed Civilization twice RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/10/2009 03:48:13 PM 595 Views

but you are difficult to please Sidious - 02/10/2009 05:10:13 AM 653 Views

Re: but you are difficult to please RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/10/2009 03:46:56 PM 590 Views

Re: but you are difficult to please Sidious - 03/10/2009 06:17:21 AM 609 Views

But they are lame... they've done minimal damage to the Light Sidious - 02/10/2009 05:06:05 AM 600 Views

You can't have it both ways.... fionwe1987 - 02/10/2009 06:47:21 AM 680 Views

Why not? Sidious - 02/10/2009 08:45:35 AM 642 Views

Re: Why not? fionwe1987 - 02/10/2009 04:27:00 PM 541 Views

Re: Why not? Sidious - 03/10/2009 06:34:16 AM 678 Views

Re: Why not? fionwe1987 - 03/10/2009 07:40:16 AM 613 Views

Re: Why not? Sidious - 03/10/2009 05:07:51 PM 584 Views

Yeah Etzel - 01/10/2009 09:57:01 PM 628 Views

Re: Yeah nossy - 01/10/2009 10:40:28 PM 658 Views

I thought the same in the past... Etzel - 02/10/2009 07:01:18 AM 652 Views

Gah! Hate! nossy - 02/10/2009 04:11:49 PM 658 Views

Ah, come on... Etzel - 02/10/2009 04:41:37 PM 626 Views

No no, I was just being pouty that I haven't read the new stuff yet.

nossy - 02/10/2009 05:01:15 PM 628 Views

Yeah, I can understand that!

Etzel - 03/10/2009 12:23:25 PM 507 Views

Unless... Fanatic-Templar - 01/10/2009 10:49:55 PM 700 Views

Re: Unless... Sidious - 02/10/2009 05:07:14 AM 729 Views

Well, it's entirely hypothetical, Fanatic-Templar - 02/10/2009 06:31:32 AM 606 Views

Re: Or RJ just loves stacking ridiculously unfavourable odds against the male Forsaken generals... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 01/10/2009 09:51:30 PM 725 Views

What about Mat and Ituralde? Rurouni_Kenshin - 02/10/2009 04:28:49 AM 668 Views

Re: What about Mat and Ituralde? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/10/2009 03:52:24 PM 622 Views

Good points! Also, these "generals" haven't actually fielded any troops beetnemesis - 01/10/2009 11:23:40 PM 604 Views

Further... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/10/2009 12:14:44 AM 637 Views

But as individuals they are meant to be deadly too Sidious - 02/10/2009 05:09:21 AM 595 Views

Just one point ^_^ RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/10/2009 12:51:50 AM 609 Views

Well, yeah. They're knowledgable and deadly in person. Generalship doesn't come into it. beetnemesis - 04/10/2009 12:09:50 AM 570 Views

nope nossy - 01/10/2009 08:06:57 PM 753 Views

Re: nope Sidious - 01/10/2009 09:32:38 PM 816 Views

Tylee Kirgan, Birgitte, and one other, Egeanin NaClH2O - 01/10/2009 09:47:00 PM 1023 Views

Birgitte's not a soldier though. Darth_Katie - 01/10/2009 10:10:50 PM 611 Views

She says she's not, but so does Mat.

nossy - 01/10/2009 10:34:04 PM 536 Views

Mat's not a soldier, either - he's a general RugbyPlayingAshaman - 01/10/2009 10:51:29 PM 681 Views

Right, which was what we were discussing at first. nossy - 02/10/2009 04:13:43 PM 606 Views

Yeah, I'm supporting your point about them both being generals RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/10/2009 06:10:31 PM 626 Views

true, but she does pretty good NaClH2O - 02/10/2009 01:06:03 AM 679 Views

Oooh I forgot she's in charge of Elayne's lady guards. Darth_Katie - 02/10/2009 03:22:57 AM 552 Views

Egeanin or Leilwin

nossy - 01/10/2009 10:35:53 PM 748 Views

A ship captain is like a calvary general NaClH2O - 02/10/2009 01:24:37 AM 614 Views

Right. Cannoli - 02/10/2009 01:36:59 AM 597 Views

Well said. (And its short and to the point.) RabidWombat - 02/10/2009 03:54:23 AM 734 Views

Birgitte is too cautious to be better than an adequate tactician. RabidWombat - 02/10/2009 04:22:45 AM 661 Views

Isn't this more of an outgrowth or her respective specialty? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 07/10/2009 08:40:46 PM 568 Views

My opinion Cannoli - 02/10/2009 01:30:12 AM 1035 Views

That's a poor excuse rAndy aL - 02/10/2009 11:59:42 AM 562 Views

That's a poor argument Cannoli - 02/10/2009 04:02:53 PM 763 Views

Re: That's a poor argument rAndy aL - 03/10/2009 04:26:55 AM 638 Views

I disagree nossy - 02/10/2009 04:26:28 PM 653 Views

Re: I disagree Cannoli - 02/10/2009 08:31:29 PM 851 Views

Oh, puh-lease. nossy - 02/10/2009 09:09:30 PM 801 Views

Re: Oh, puh-lease. Cannoli - 03/10/2009 04:52:37 PM 630 Views

Re: Oh, puh-lease. NaClH2O - 03/10/2009 08:26:27 PM 520 Views

Re: Oh, puh-lease. nossy - 05/10/2009 05:08:27 PM 3078 Views

I always know I've out-argued an idiot when they fall back on the tired old "RJ wanted it that way" Cannoli - 06/10/2009 04:42:11 AM 668 Views

And I can tell you're through when you've gotten to three+ insults per paragraph. nossy - 06/10/2009 05:46:24 PM 761 Views

um nossy - 08/10/2009 07:36:52 PM 904 Views

Monday morning quarterbacking at its worst RabidWombat - 04/10/2009 07:28:36 AM 718 Views

Men and football. nossy - 05/10/2009 04:49:35 PM 634 Views

She didn't kill anyone! Why SHOULD she feel guilty? She gave necessary orders. Cannoli - 06/10/2009 03:33:15 AM 727 Views

It's the only thing men are allowed to do in Randland CupofDice - 02/10/2009 03:09:19 AM 645 Views

My thoughts LordPerrin - 02/10/2009 03:12:46 PM 576 Views

.... Fantasy - 04/10/2009 03:38:44 AM 563 Views

Back to Messageboard

Post New Thread

Help

Stats

Rules

Reply to Message

Subject

Formatting

Smiley Codes

Body

<quote id="28055">
<quote id="28015">Rahvin was killed in the most improbable way imaginable:

Rand attacks him with an angreal (which probably doubles his strength), and Rahvin reacts by still managing to draw Rand into a territory that provides Rahvin with a strategic advantage. One of Sun Tzu's famous truths is that you must try to choose the territory that suits your strengths rather than your adversary's. Full marks to Rahvin. Unfortunately, even Sun Tzu himself could not have predicted that Nynaeve - totally untrained in TAR - would somehow capture Moghedien - the most skilled user of TAR EVER - and entrap her in an adam.

Nor could he have predicted that while this happened on the other side of the continent, that these two would happen to find themselves in the TAR version of Caemlyn, of all places.

And now for the most unbelievable coincidence of all.

Not even Nostradamus himself could have predicted that all of these totally random events would happen to take place at EXATLY THE SAME MOMENT that he happened to draw Rand into TAR.

Faced with a massively improbable sequence of events of this magnitude, Sun Tzu, Karl Von Clausowich, or even Alexander the Great himself might as well have thrown in the towel before they even started planning the battle.

Same goes for Sammael, who did everything by the book, drawing his foe into a terrirory he had prepared beforehand, only for Moridin to interfere and save Rand.

Compared to these two male Forsaken generals, Semirhage's plan was absolutely idiotic, and certainly not properly thought through.

Based on these three examples, the males are already demonstrated as having greater aptitude for strategy than the female generals.</quote>

Still, I think there are some facts worth mentioning. Rahvin wasn't really a general. The more I read the BWB on him, the more it seems like he was a male Graendal. The book even hints at as much. He did make two critical errors though -
- He tried to fight Rand from his throne without moving because he thought Rand couldn't Travel.
- When Rand turned into a beast in TAR he stood there savouring the moment, smiling. He should have killed Rand immediately.

Sammael was thwarted by Moridin, so he was unlucky there. Still, he can't whine that he was killed by Mashadar - he knew before he went there that it doesn't differentiate between him and Rand.

Be'lal entered a monologue which is typical of classic villainy. But who wouldn't against a 3rd Age Aes Sedai? Too bad she's one of about two Aes Sedai who know balefire and can weave it.

I still can't understand Semirhage's plan. How did she think she could capture Rand while he was surrounded by the most powerful channelers alive? The only possibility is that she had prepared weaves to produce intense pain or death in some of the party, which would give her enough time to a'dam Rand, and perhaps use his strength to finish off the rest of the party. Osan'gar knew pain weaves like that, and I'm sure Semirhage could do ten times the damage. What a ridiculous gamble though.

Lanfear didn't even have a plan. She just saw Rand walk past her wagon and decided to attack him. Aginor blew himself up. Later he returned and destroy an empty room.

This is why I think a non-general sent the Trollocs after Rand in KoD. It's the dumbest plan ever. There is no way that army could kill 30 Ashaman and Aes Sedai and a group of the deadliest channelers in the Light. Rand didn't lose a single channeler, and not even one of them got injured. For all this Forsaken knew, Rand could have used the Choedan Kal on this army - he certainly still has the male Access Key. This attack could thus only have been 'brilliantly' orchestrated by someone like Moghedien or Graendal. Demandred and Moridin almost exclude themselves because of the low IQ of this military blunder.
</quote>

Link title

Link url

Send notification emails?

Username

Password