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Re: You must tell me of this special math... Tor Send a noteboard - 20/11/2012 04:29:40 PM


Nope, they mustn't. Not from the maths alone. And I'm fairly sure I would have remembered if the books had mentioned standard deviations at any point.

From the math alone, any two strengths equidistant from the mean will have the same probability of occurrence. That is baked into the definition of normal distribution, not a matter of opinion.


Absolutely. But it doesn't follow that Lanfear and Morgase are equidistant from the mean.

Edit: What I mean is that you can't argue that Lanfear and Morgase are equidistant from the mean on the basis of maths alone, you have to have something from the books.

And while it seems to be commonly accepted that Lanfear is as strong as a woman can be, I don't think it's established that Morgase is as weak as it's possible to be, and even if it was, Jordan didn't neccessarily truncate the distribution symmetrically.
Fram kamerater!
This message last edited by Tor on 20/11/2012 at 04:45:35 PM
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How many standard deviations is Lanfear Lanfear - 15/11/2012 06:04:39 PM 2203 Views
Well... vandevere - 15/11/2012 07:02:45 PM 1211 Views
Hmm... Sidious - 15/11/2012 07:25:34 PM 1340 Views
see we CAN agree on stuff darius_sedai - 15/11/2012 07:56:12 PM 1176 Views
Sidious - 18/11/2012 08:37:22 PM 1048 Views
We've always been close with everything except the scale darius_sedai - 18/11/2012 10:29:07 PM 1093 Views
Re: DomA - 18/11/2012 11:07:17 PM 1265 Views
Re: Sidious - 19/11/2012 05:16:00 AM 1099 Views
Re: DomA - 19/11/2012 03:13:01 PM 1087 Views
They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5% Shannow - 19/11/2012 03:19:19 PM 1108 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5% DomA - 19/11/2012 04:01:43 PM 1308 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5% darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 09:04:04 PM 1061 Views
Hmmm... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:08:40 AM 1132 Views
Perhaps, but Egwene is also being a bit dramatic in the scene as she managed darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:28:57 AM 1080 Views
Nope... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:13:13 PM 1133 Views
I believe she is being over dramatic darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 03:26:24 PM 1025 Views
Keep believing that... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:30:14 PM 1165 Views
*shrugs* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 03:49:10 PM 1111 Views
Tired and forkroot are the same now? fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:55:22 PM 1013 Views
No it's the literary device darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:04:28 PM 1145 Views
This is getting ridiculous... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:43:13 PM 1019 Views
You are missing my point completely darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:50:46 PM 984 Views
Impossible. Daigian is exactly 0.32SD below the mean Shannow - 19/11/2012 11:06:04 AM 1087 Views
You keep saying that, but it is either a linear or a non-linear distribution darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 09:09:32 PM 1140 Views
That's the whole point. Thanks for finally seeing it. Shannow - 19/11/2012 09:43:27 PM 1095 Views
keep believing that ... but you making up numbers isn't really relevant *NM* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:29:44 AM 694 Views
Please show me a number that is made up. The 0.32SD for Daigian is a rule of statistics. Shannow - 20/11/2012 07:15:48 AM 1053 Views
Go read Fionwe's post about it *NM* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 02:33:19 PM 696 Views
Is that before or after she started juicing? Praziquantel - 15/11/2012 11:04:14 PM 1083 Views
Wouldn't it be 1 in 105 million? Lanfear - 21/11/2012 04:56:19 PM 935 Views
Are you sure that it is a normal distribution? Dreadlord - 16/11/2012 04:21:02 PM 1148 Views
Ugh. I hate power level discussions. For real world applications, it should be kind of meaningless beetnemesis - 16/11/2012 10:28:49 PM 1040 Views
I don't really agree Sidious - 18/11/2012 08:40:53 PM 1012 Views
Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 09:13:48 PM 1062 Views
Re: Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel Sidious - 20/11/2012 08:10:01 AM 1033 Views
probably ... Lanfear/Cyndane is clearly remarkably skilled darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 02:35:09 PM 1075 Views
Since I've proven that it's not a normal distribution in units of absolute strength, SDs don't apply Shannow - 17/11/2012 07:48:21 PM 1089 Views
You have proven nothing, except that you have an opinion *NM* darius_sedai - 18/11/2012 02:21:35 AM 668 Views
You simply don't get it. It is mathematically a fact. There is no opinion involved. Shannow - 18/11/2012 02:19:40 PM 925 Views
Only because you've assigned numeric values. That you created. darius_sedai - 18/11/2012 02:40:51 PM 1057 Views
It doesn't matter what figure you use... Shannow - 18/11/2012 03:01:56 PM 934 Views
What if Daigian is one third Lanfear's strength? fionwe1987 - 18/11/2012 04:37:58 PM 1092 Views
We have a limit for Daigian's strength, as you well know. Shannow - 18/11/2012 05:41:49 PM 1058 Views
Are you kidding me? fionwe1987 - 18/11/2012 09:07:38 PM 1187 Views
Sure you can darius_sedai - 18/11/2012 10:09:31 PM 1089 Views
Re: Sure you can DomA - 18/11/2012 10:54:50 PM 1059 Views
You're right, though its 37.5% fionwe1987 - 19/11/2012 12:21:29 AM 1012 Views
Oops, typo! darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 02:54:25 AM 1067 Views
Again, not possible, due to Daigian being just 0.3SD below the Mean Shannow - 19/11/2012 08:37:01 AM 1021 Views
Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... fionwe1987 - 19/11/2012 04:05:12 PM 944 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... Sidious - 19/11/2012 05:55:02 PM 904 Views
Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 09:19:50 PM 1023 Views
Re: Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:11:26 AM 1059 Views
Forkroot in every case darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:32:26 AM 1023 Views
No! fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:15:16 PM 1006 Views
I'm not going to go re-read the books to you on this darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 03:39:46 PM 1035 Views
You need to read it for yourself, since you're completely confused. fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:54:26 PM 989 Views
Not going to argue this with you. darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:09:44 PM 952 Views
Your own example disproved your point... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:39:25 PM 1067 Views
let's see, she's both asleep and would need hours to regain her strength darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:43:17 PM 965 Views
Enough! fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:04:06 PM 1033 Views
LOL ... whatever. You go on believing that ... no one else sees it this way. *NM* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:20:52 PM 660 Views
What a brilliant argument! fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:25:18 PM 1047 Views
this is why I refuse to continue this debate darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:31:11 PM 986 Views
Re: Your own example disproved your point... Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:10:15 PM 1075 Views
Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:26:31 PM 1068 Views
Re: Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:31:50 PM 1038 Views
Re: Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:42:53 PM 1028 Views
Excuse me? fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:28:48 PM 1075 Views
see we can agree on the relative strength of Egwene v. Forsaken darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:35:07 PM 1037 Views
??? Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:37:01 PM 1143 Views
2 middling sisters darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:45:27 PM 1055 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:26:47 AM 974 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... Sidious - 20/11/2012 09:03:40 AM 1010 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 02:59:08 PM 1043 Views
None of this is backed by any evidence... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:24:12 PM 974 Views
who said Cadsuane was 1.5x Moiraine or more? darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:03:13 PM 983 Views
Nope... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:41:35 PM 996 Views
wrong darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:48:50 PM 934 Views
My bad. Mized up 1/3 and 2/3. fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:05:05 PM 1043 Views
gotcha *NM* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:46:21 PM 627 Views
Better evidence? LOL! fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:18:55 PM 1023 Views
Huh? How did you come to that conclusion? darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:40:56 PM 1015 Views
Exactly *NM* Sidious - 20/11/2012 04:55:28 PM 974 Views
BEcause Cadsuane is close on the heels of Egwene? fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:10:50 PM 922 Views
I'm not arguing that. I agree that Cadsuane is pretty close to Egwene darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:50:34 PM 1032 Views
Re: Better evidence? LOL! Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:00:47 PM 935 Views
Interesting, but let's go with your figures... Shannow - 19/11/2012 06:54:54 AM 1058 Views
Indeed Sidious - 19/11/2012 08:16:44 AM 1115 Views
Rand is sort of a special case darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:25:02 AM 963 Views
Regarding Mesaana... Sidious - 20/11/2012 08:42:56 AM 1015 Views
You continue to mix two things darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 03:24:44 PM 938 Views
No Sidious - 20/11/2012 04:54:19 PM 1169 Views
You are mistaken darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:04:40 PM 1023 Views
Yes she did Darius! Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:27:36 PM 951 Views
Yet there is no duel darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 06:01:17 PM 949 Views
Explain the .3xSD thing to me... fionwe1987 - 19/11/2012 04:58:57 PM 1184 Views
Probably, but the AS have no idea what 37.5% means darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 02:59:26 AM 971 Views
It's irrelevant DomA - 19/11/2012 03:46:42 AM 1043 Views
Agreed. Daigian is the marker of the absolute bottom of Aes Sedai strength. Shannow - 19/11/2012 06:55:41 AM 1008 Views
Daigian Sidious - 19/11/2012 08:12:19 AM 1016 Views
It is a direct marker due to RJ's quote Shannow - 19/11/2012 08:50:26 AM 1041 Views
You missed my point Sidious - 19/11/2012 09:08:42 AM 969 Views
Re: You missed my point DomA - 19/11/2012 02:18:33 PM 1056 Views
Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:41:11 AM 982 Views
Re: Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS Sidious - 20/11/2012 09:07:49 AM 976 Views
Which would make an average AS around a 30 darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:58:56 PM 855 Views
Re: Sure you can Tor - 19/11/2012 09:22:09 AM 1093 Views
Care to explain this... fionwe1987 - 19/11/2012 05:06:28 PM 932 Views
Indeed Tor - 20/11/2012 07:16:37 AM 1129 Views
Explained far better than I ever could. Bravo. Shannow - 20/11/2012 07:30:29 AM 981 Views
Well duh. fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:57:24 PM 1091 Views
Incorrect. Shannow - 20/11/2012 04:28:07 PM 1081 Views
No fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:44:16 PM 1059 Views
Re: No Tor - 20/11/2012 04:48:36 PM 1042 Views
That depends... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:18:46 PM 913 Views
Re: That depends... Tor - 20/11/2012 05:31:03 PM 1328 Views
You're integrating without lower limits... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:55:06 PM 1037 Views
Re: You're integrating without lower limits... Tor - 20/11/2012 04:37:57 PM 1080 Views
It matters. fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:22:40 PM 1035 Views
We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:44:24 AM 879 Views
Re: We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case Tor - 20/11/2012 07:02:47 AM 1080 Views
You must tell me of this special math... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:10:09 PM 957 Views
Re: You must tell me of this special math... Tor - 20/11/2012 04:29:40 PM 1012 Views
Morghase is a placeholder... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:45:42 PM 1094 Views
Re: Morghase is a placeholder... Tor - 20/11/2012 04:49:54 PM 1248 Views
Why? fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:23:29 PM 1048 Views
Re: Why? Tor - 20/11/2012 05:36:45 PM 1225 Views
Well... Sidious - 18/11/2012 08:43:59 PM 1085 Views
Re: Well... DomA - 19/11/2012 03:40:44 PM 1068 Views
Wow. Shannow - 19/11/2012 03:53:47 PM 1092 Views
Re: Wow. DomA - 19/11/2012 04:26:09 PM 1110 Views
Some points Sidious - 19/11/2012 06:03:00 PM 1149 Views
Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid Sidious - 19/11/2012 06:09:36 PM 992 Views
Re: Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid DomA - 19/11/2012 07:42:58 PM 870 Views
this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:51:20 AM 1085 Views
Agreed Sidious - 20/11/2012 08:13:37 AM 1118 Views
probably darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 06:18:45 PM 989 Views
Re: this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power DomA - 20/11/2012 02:45:18 PM 1000 Views
I think RJ went out of his way to keep strength a bit of a mystery darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 08:42:44 PM 1010 Views
Indeed... DomA - 21/11/2012 05:44:18 PM 982 Views
I agree darius_sedai - 22/11/2012 01:43:02 AM 1232 Views
Math gurus...Is it possible to find the missing variable... Lanfear - 21/11/2012 05:12:24 PM 1023 Views
the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really darius_sedai - 22/11/2012 02:55:03 AM 1070 Views
Re: the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really Lanfear - 22/11/2012 03:15:33 AM 1388 Views
I do not think you can calculate the Mean without knowing the Units of Power darius_sedai - 22/11/2012 03:53:59 AM 1160 Views
Re: Math gurus...Is it possible to find the missing variable... Tor - 23/11/2012 02:59:12 PM 1299 Views
Disregard this post *NM* Tor - 23/11/2012 03:02:24 PM 875 Views
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