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Re: Egwene said otherwise DomA,... fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 18/10/2012 01:23:48 AM

Rulers who want an advisor ask for one, or ask a sister they have met and are comfortable with to fill that role. Sisters who go to rulers and even more nobles most likely do it out of their own initiative (it's what they wish to do as Aes Sedai, be accepted somewhere as advisor) or go under incitive from their Ajah leader who sees interest for the Ajah (I'm betting this is how the Green manage to secure posts as advisors in the Borderlands).

That doesn't make much sense. It totally doesn't fit the Hall's usual MO to simply allow rulers to chose who they like. Maintaining the Tower's relationship with the nations is an extremely important job, and the Aes Sedai advisors to the rulers are some of the most influential Aes Sedai. They're the representatives of the Tower in the court of the rulers. No way is the Hall letting those jobs go without the Ajahs jostling for the influence to be gained by them.
I'm not saying it's never done for the Hall to manoeuvre for a specific sister to be sent to a ruler who lost his advisor, in the hope the ruler would find her agreeable and ask her to join his/her court, but I don't think the fact Elaida became Morgase's advisor had much of anything to do with her strength, nor would the Hall would have done anything had someone like Daigian been the one who got close to Morgase and been asked to become advisor.

I think exactly the reverse is true. I think the Hall maneuvers all the time, and issues like strength in the Power, experience, prior relationship with the rulers, etc. are major points around which the maneuvering revolves. A sister like Daigian isn't impossible as a candidate, but at the stage of her Aes Sedai career that Elaida was, a Daigian would have found things a lot harder.

In Andor in particular, it sounds likely the Queens often asked a sister she met and liked during her studies at the Tower.

Highly unlikely. Morgase was in a unique position of being raised Queen soon after her Tower training. In normal circumstances, the Daighter Heir likely already has a strong relationship with her mother's advisor, and unless a serious break in relations occurs, or the advisor is recalled to the Tower for another job, I don't see how a woman she meets in her few years in the Tower will end up exceeding the many of her formative years she'd have spent with her mother's advisor. Let's remember that unlike Elaida, many other advisors likely have warmer relationships with the monarch's families.

Elaida also had a rare gift in that she saw that Morgase was likely to be queen before the succession was finished, and the previous advisor to Andor wouldn't see her cozying up to Morgase as interference in another sister's affairs (since Gitara had been raised Keeper).

The hierarchy of AS is "secret". To the outside world, outside the Sitters and Amyrlin, a shawl is a shawl.

But of course. I'm not saying the rulers pick the strongest Aes Sedai!

I can't find your answer, the thread's too big.

Here:

"Aes Sedai, then. I wasn't raised Amyrlin because I am the strongest. The wisest women are chosen for the Hall or to be ambassadors or advisors, the most skillful anyway, not those with the most strength."


This is Egwene in aCoS, so she's still naive. But her statement that Sitters, ambassadors and advisors are chosen is pretty clear. There's no way she wouldn't know about this by this point, and no way Siuan wouldn't have corrected her on it.

Also, consider this, from the BWB:

Whether or not love was involved, Ishara knew she needed both Maravaile’s army and the White Tower’s goodwill. Marrying Souran gave her the first; sending her eldest daughter to study in the Tower gained her the second as well as an Aes Sedai advisor named Ballair. She was the first ruler to have an Aes Sedai advisor.

Its pretty clear Bellair came as part of the deal, and not someone Ishara picked.

To all outward appearances, Hawkwing eventually made a peace with the White Tower, if not one with a signed treaty, of course, for Tar Valon was not likely to admit that it had been opposing him. In FY 954, he accepted an Aes Sedai advisor, Chowin Tsao of the Green Ajah. Rulers fighting him also still had advisors from Tar Valon, of course, but the White Tower had always maintained a public stance of neutrality, and it appears that he accepted this posture at least in public.

Apparently a temporary break occurred during the Black Years. Chowin Tsao is his advisor in a fragmentary letter reliably dated in FY 962, but another letter (probably FY 967, by internal evidence) states that “after five years the High King has reconciled with Tar Valon and agreed to accept once more a counselor from among the sisters.”

Again, Hawkwing was sent an advisor, who he accepted. If the Tower would send an advisor to Hawkwing himself, do you think they'll give up that for lesser rulers?
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Misc observations from my latest re-read - 14/10/2012 08:26:37 PM 2943 Views
How does LTT know about Far Madding's history? - 14/10/2012 08:29:13 PM 1495 Views
How Stong was Gitara? - 14/10/2012 08:34:43 PM 1399 Views
So so stong. She had incredible stength. - 14/10/2012 09:04:15 PM 1473 Views
Degree of slowing is the same as how long they will live - 14/10/2012 09:22:23 PM 1280 Views
Re: Degree of slowing is the same as how long they will live - 14/10/2012 09:36:19 PM 1090 Views
Not in the mood to deal with you ... Go read the Ages section of 13th Depository - 14/10/2012 09:53:14 PM 1113 Views
Not interested in Linda's private theories. - 15/10/2012 02:29:41 AM 1247 Views
And there's Sorilea... - 15/10/2012 02:53:15 AM 1318 Views
Perhaps, but Bair is in her 80s and can't channel at all - 15/10/2012 03:09:35 AM 1064 Views
Problem is... - 14/10/2012 11:52:00 PM 1222 Views
Again, my point isn't about motivations for Elaida or Gitara ... that is clear - 15/10/2012 12:07:49 AM 1065 Views
Show me where in the books an adviser is selected by Tower authorities! - 15/10/2012 02:58:19 AM 1087 Views
Yet look what happens the minute a Stronger woman showed up - 15/10/2012 03:19:18 AM 1017 Views
Re: Yet look what happens the minute a Stronger woman showed up - 15/10/2012 03:35:10 AM 1153 Views
Yet Morgase herself states she didn't consider Elaida a friend - 15/10/2012 03:45:45 AM 1009 Views
How did Gareth Bryne get to stay Captain General, given his lack of respect to Aes Sedai? - 15/10/2012 04:07:07 AM 1093 Views
He was banging the queen - 15/10/2012 04:19:24 AM 1029 Views
And what Aes Sedai gave him permission to bang the queen? - 15/10/2012 04:30:42 AM 1309 Views
here ya go - 15/10/2012 04:39:29 AM 1142 Views
There's an awful lot for "not many" - 15/10/2012 05:07:30 AM 1064 Views
When did I say I bought into Linda's theories? - 15/10/2012 05:29:27 AM 1018 Views
Re: Again, my point isn't about motivations for Elaida or Gitara ... that is clear - 15/10/2012 03:15:18 AM 1131 Views
The thing is Elaida had no experience in the arena at all - 15/10/2012 03:25:10 AM 1076 Views
IT IS NOT THE TOWER'S DAMNED JOB! She had more than enough credentials for ANDOR - 15/10/2012 03:45:15 AM 1091 Views
Nope. Every other advisor we've seen has been sent from TV - 15/10/2012 03:50:07 AM 1059 Views
Those are not official advisers, those are ambassadors! - 15/10/2012 04:17:51 AM 1127 Views
So now you are saying that Elaida was a personal advisor not an envoy of the Tower? - 15/10/2012 04:22:31 AM 1043 Views
Finally! I was beginning to despair of your literacy! - 15/10/2012 04:34:18 AM 1124 Views
now I am questioning your literacy *NM* - 15/10/2012 04:40:45 AM 709 Views
She didn't "land it". She took the job for herself... - 15/10/2012 04:00:35 AM 1076 Views
Actually every advisor we've seen except Elaida has been appointed - 15/10/2012 04:11:39 AM 1089 Views
You can bully someone into an act, not a twenty year relationship - 15/10/2012 04:22:16 AM 1206 Views
Not arguing that Morgase had a problem with her - 15/10/2012 04:33:10 AM 1037 Views
We know nothing of the sort. - 15/10/2012 05:14:54 AM 1013 Views
Prove that Elaida's post was not Tower sanctioned - 15/10/2012 05:39:23 AM 1117 Views
Re: Prove that Elaida's post was not Tower sanctioned - 17/10/2012 04:15:37 AM 1147 Views
Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 17/10/2012 05:33:01 AM 1108 Views
Re: Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 17/10/2012 01:01:47 PM 1183 Views
Just to be clear - 17/10/2012 03:58:58 PM 1016 Views
Re: Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 18/10/2012 01:23:48 AM 1104 Views
Elayne's thoughts about this - 17/10/2012 04:16:38 PM 1065 Views
And an answer to the rest of your "points" - 15/10/2012 02:48:07 AM 1275 Views
Again. I refer you to Linda's blog. The relevant quotes are there ... Enjoy - 15/10/2012 02:52:03 AM 1076 Views
Oh for the love of...! Here's the relevant quote: - 15/10/2012 04:04:48 AM 1158 Views
Okay, but that's still irrelevant to the Oath Rod & its cutoff period or method, as well as lifespan - 15/10/2012 04:54:26 AM 1045 Views
To quote you RTDB - 15/10/2012 05:16:56 AM 1016 Views
Re: To quote you RTDB - 15/10/2012 05:27:47 AM 1093 Views
Some people look young. - 15/10/2012 05:51:25 AM 981 Views
I never mentioned the OR... - 16/10/2012 01:38:48 AM 1093 Views
RJ said Sharina would go back to about middle aged - 16/10/2012 02:23:21 AM 909 Views
And that is probably the ONLY quote that wasn't on Linda's page *NM* - 15/10/2012 04:55:33 AM 637 Views
Told you so. *NM* - 15/10/2012 05:21:58 AM 736 Views
I think so. - 16/11/2012 11:40:17 AM 1232 Views
Aging - 15/10/2012 06:08:47 PM 1099 Views
How old was Lanfear? - 14/10/2012 08:41:35 PM 1108 Views
Re: How old was Lanfear? - 14/10/2012 11:27:12 PM 1194 Views
I couldn't find it - 15/10/2012 12:22:43 AM 1091 Views
Are the Seanchan prophesies false? - 14/10/2012 08:43:55 PM 1230 Views
I've only been saying no for years. - 14/10/2012 09:21:43 PM 1298 Views
Not the same thing - 14/10/2012 09:44:43 PM 1078 Views
Show me some damn PROOF already!! - 15/10/2012 03:19:18 AM 1236 Views
Re: I've only been saying no for years. - 14/10/2012 10:15:29 PM 1301 Views
Your argument is based on a faulty premise. - 15/10/2012 08:11:19 PM 939 Views
Of course there is truth... - 14/10/2012 09:42:24 PM 1168 Views
Didn't know Bsand had confirmed the corruption. Thanks for sharing - 14/10/2012 10:02:40 PM 1130 Views
Re: Didn't know Bsand had confirmed the corruption. Thanks for sharing - 14/10/2012 10:23:17 PM 1125 Views
Hmmm ...I like it! It is actually very similar to what Nynaeve does - 14/10/2012 10:31:48 PM 1217 Views
How do the Black Ajah not figure out who the others are? - 14/10/2012 08:48:14 PM 1130 Views
Who says they can't? - 14/10/2012 09:23:11 PM 1131 Views
True to a point - 14/10/2012 10:00:01 PM 1022 Views
Was Sheriam ranking? Would many of them have met her? Not everyone even gets to meet the SC. - 15/10/2012 03:23:16 AM 1077 Views
Perhaps not. But a woman like Sheriam would stick out - 15/10/2012 03:37:12 AM 1025 Views
Re: Was Sheriam ranking? Would many of them have met her? Not everyone even gets to meet the SC. - 15/10/2012 03:52:39 AM 1098 Views
But isn't it interesting that Sheriam and Galina, both young and strong are on the SC? - 15/10/2012 04:06:38 AM 987 Views
Galina isn't young. *NM* - 17/10/2012 03:24:30 AM 714 Views
Yes she is - 17/10/2012 03:46:39 PM 1135 Views
85 years being BA, 90 years as a sister does not qualify her as a "young AS" - 18/10/2012 05:35:33 PM 1104 Views
She is not dissimilar to Sheriam when she made her rise IMO - 18/10/2012 06:53:54 PM 1044 Views
Re: She is not dissimilar to Sheriam when she made her rise IMO - 18/10/2012 08:10:58 PM 1089 Views
I think Linda is correct in this particular instance - 19/10/2012 02:14:23 AM 1166 Views
You mean the SC? - 14/10/2012 10:47:31 PM 1138 Views
No others meet as well - 14/10/2012 11:01:21 PM 1144 Views
Re: No others meet as well - 14/10/2012 11:36:50 PM 1104 Views
Yet rank and file BA have methods of communicating - 15/10/2012 12:14:36 AM 976 Views
Re: Yet rank and file BA have methods of communicating - 15/10/2012 03:26:59 AM 1061 Views
I concede that the rank and file likely don't meet in large groups - 15/10/2012 04:54:04 AM 1018 Views
Re: I concede that the rank and file likely don't meet in large groups - 15/10/2012 02:28:45 PM 1150 Views
I agree that RJ probably had some thing up his sleeve - 15/10/2012 03:01:20 PM 947 Views
Re: I agree that RJ probably had some thing up his sleeve - 15/10/2012 05:57:04 PM 1257 Views
I have a different opinion of Delana - 16/10/2012 01:20:32 AM 1295 Views
Re: I have a different opinion of Delana - 16/10/2012 11:51:34 PM 1010 Views
Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 02:55:19 AM 1103 Views
Re: Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 03:40:54 PM 975 Views
Give the sign to a woman and see how she reacts - 18/10/2012 06:57:38 PM 1121 Views
Re: Give the sign to a woman and see how she reacts - 18/10/2012 07:26:56 PM 1037 Views
Not a good plan, I'll give you that - 18/10/2012 07:37:45 PM 1141 Views
*sigh* - 18/10/2012 08:25:23 PM 1106 Views
*double sigh* - 19/10/2012 04:03:00 AM 1050 Views
Re: *double sigh* - 19/10/2012 05:48:25 PM 1073 Views
Agreed *NM* - 20/10/2012 04:57:18 PM 624 Views
Re: Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 04:59:25 PM 1173 Views
Not conclusive ... in fact the whole bit is vague ... I wonder if RJ would have given us more detail - 18/10/2012 07:23:30 PM 1132 Views
Not conclusive? - 18/10/2012 08:49:49 PM 1007 Views
Don't put words in my mouth that I never said - 19/10/2012 04:08:22 AM 978 Views
double post *NM* - 19/10/2012 04:08:22 AM 631 Views
Is there a Dark Friend WO? - 14/10/2012 08:51:16 PM 1192 Views
Re: Is there a Dark Friend WO? - 17/10/2012 08:33:27 PM 1211 Views
I'd like to see more discussion on this; I'm curious as well - 18/10/2012 12:44:35 AM 987 Views
Just a note about Bair - 18/10/2012 07:53:45 AM 1119 Views
I don't see how it could be possible - 23/10/2012 09:31:51 PM 999 Views
Galad and Gaywn ... Channlers? - 14/10/2012 10:47:55 PM 1266 Views
Re: Galad and Gaywn ... Channlers? - 14/10/2012 11:36:25 PM 1208 Views

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