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Re: Like I said before... fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 21/05/2012 06:00:35 PM

Knowing the compulsion weave and how it works is no protection against it in itself.[/quote]
Its a protection because you get better at looking for its effects on yourself. Egwene does say she learned Compulsion so she could counter its effects. And further, the subtler forms of compulsion are not effective when a person channels, making it useless to place these on Egwene, because she's going to be channeling fairly often.
Graendal was able to place both Moghedian and Cyndane in compulsion when they visited her.

That was the very strongest form of compulsion, and it almost destroyed their brains.
Add to this the fact that Halima would have been channeling saidin, and Egwene could have been compelled right there in the camp while she was asleep and woken up with no idea that she now had saidin compulsion in her brain.

The effect of Compulsion has nothing to do with which side of the Power was used.

Egwene is already distrustfull of Rand.

No she isn't. She is wary of him, and wants to guide him, but she is not mistrustful of him.
For a person to suddenly notice that she is just a little bit more distrustfull today than she was yesterday, would require a level of self-reflection that I don't believe Egwene (or anyone else for that matter) has.

But that isn't what you're suggesting. You're saying her mistrust was being slowly amped up. If a week/month from now, you're more mistrustful of your childhood friend who dominates your thoughts and conversations, trust me you will notice, and so will those around you.
Halima would have had plenty of time to keep any compulsion small and subtle and adding to it slowly over time and keeping it undetectable that way.

That assumes that multiple small compulsions don't add up to effects similar to a single complex compulsion. That has no proof, and as a neuro-scientist, I can say that it makes no sense either.
Not to mention the fact that it would be simple enough to add another subtle compulsion that would make Egwene ignore the first one.

And things would swiftly spiral out of control. The moment you have to make people ignore a part of themselves, you've gone into more complex territory. That's why the subtlest forms usually need the greatest understanding of psychology. And Aran'gar has shown herself to have no such facility. She's dumb, and not even clued in that Graendal's hedonism is a ruse!

That might even be supported by the fact that not once did Egwene even suspect Halima of anything despite the fact that she was the only one who could rid her of her headaches.

She did keep her at arms length, though. And if you have to force someone to like you and not suspect you, you're again moving from subtle compulsion territory.
And was Aran'gar seriously punished anyway? Compared to what happened to Moghedien(Mindtrapped and horribly tortured) or Semirhage (Abandoned by Moridin and then sacrificed by the DO), it seems Aran'gar was not punished all that severely. Maybe her punishment was lighter than theirs, because she did partially succeed in influencing Egwene, even if she failed to prevent the tower from reforming.

We don't know how much she was punished, except that Graendal says she was which makes no sense at all if she had such major success.

And what kind of compulsion can she have placed that's going to be useful anyway? She had no way of knowing what the future held for Egwene. Heck, she didn't even know Egwene would personally take over sealing Tar Valon's harbor. How was she supposed to place compulsions that would help in the future with no idea on how events would unfold?
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Egwene under compulsion - 17/05/2012 05:40:31 AM 1662 Views
Re: Egwene under compulsion - 17/05/2012 08:27:50 AM 934 Views
To add to that - 17/05/2012 01:46:02 PM 802 Views
Re: To add to that - 18/05/2012 06:04:07 AM 818 Views
Re: To add to that - 18/05/2012 08:58:23 AM 685 Views
Re: To add to that - 19/05/2012 04:00:49 AM 694 Views
Re: To add to that - 19/05/2012 11:04:14 AM 647 Views
Re: To add to that - 20/05/2012 05:38:31 AM 631 Views
I think you are misunderstanding what I meant - 18/05/2012 04:22:38 PM 648 Views
Re: Egwene under compulsion - 18/05/2012 11:31:01 PM 812 Views
Except we know Aran'gar was punished in some way for "losing control of her charge" - 18/05/2012 11:47:44 PM 597 Views
Re: Except we know Aran'gar was punished in some way for "losing control of her charge" - 19/05/2012 12:31:10 AM 803 Views
Yes I know. That's the point we are discussing. - 19/05/2012 12:44:27 AM 580 Views
Re: Yes I know. That's the point we are discussing. - 20/05/2012 07:01:23 AM 692 Views
Fair point on Ishamael - 20/05/2012 03:36:32 PM 723 Views
Re: Fair point on Ishamael - 21/05/2012 01:56:30 PM 713 Views
You are over simplifying it I think - 21/05/2012 03:33:48 PM 725 Views
Re: Except we know Aran'gar was punished in some way for "losing control of her charge" - 20/05/2012 06:54:40 AM 629 Views
Well, Elza did somehow... - 20/05/2012 11:04:56 AM 633 Views
It happened off screen - 20/05/2012 03:44:40 PM 638 Views
Re: It happened off screen - 21/05/2012 01:45:26 PM 618 Views
Re: Egwene under compulsion - 19/05/2012 12:05:32 AM 928 Views
And lets not forget that Egwene knows to counter compulsion... - 19/05/2012 01:13:39 AM 696 Views
The Headaches - 19/05/2012 04:47:23 AM 688 Views
Re: The Headaches - 19/05/2012 05:12:26 PM 755 Views
Re: Egwene under compulsion - 20/05/2012 06:37:23 AM 630 Views
Like I said before... - 20/05/2012 07:30:58 PM 663 Views
Re: Like I said before... - 20/05/2012 08:57:17 PM 567 Views
Finding a weave and recognizing the symptoms are different things - 21/05/2012 03:13:12 AM 552 Views
Re: Finding a weave and recognizing the symptoms are different things - 21/05/2012 01:32:30 PM 623 Views
No argument that a subtle compulsion would be necessary - 21/05/2012 01:48:06 PM 654 Views
Re: No argument that a subtle compulsion would be necessary - 21/05/2012 01:57:44 PM 623 Views
Re: No argument that a subtle compulsion would be necessary - 21/05/2012 02:44:09 PM 680 Views
Re: Like I said before... - 21/05/2012 01:21:34 PM 543 Views
Re: Like I said before... - 21/05/2012 06:00:35 PM 694 Views
Seems logical to me, for whatever that is worth. - 21/05/2012 07:28:11 PM 499 Views

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