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Re: Awww. Spoilsport. DomA Send a noteboard - 19/10/2011 11:19:03 AM
The fact that they are only mentioned before this moment does not mean they cannot be in the novel at a later point. Mat would not know them for what they were, and they could still (or better) function as a Chekov's gun.

The same goes for Liandrin's stealing them. Unless we have seen her holding them going "mine, all mine".

The needing channeling is a much bigger problem. I suppose this should teach me not to discuss this series of books with too much of the "I know I'm right, damnit".


Hmm... there seems to be a confusion on your part... This ter'angreal isn't real playable dices. It's a miniature shaped like a pair of dices (fused together, a figurine if you wish).

Mat has no idea they even exist (Liandrin's group stole them months before Mat even went to TV. We know she did for real, as Verin who colliged that list of the stolen objects explained in TGS to Egwene that though she didn't like that, Alviarin agreed that Verin couldn't risk being caught lying and had to pass to the real information to Siuan's BA hunters as Siuan had asked of her). The dices Mat was so concerned about in the TDR chapter you refer to are his own real dices he's brought along from Emond's Field. He's fond of them because of he's started to get luckier than usual in his gambling since Fal Dara (but it's got nothing to do with the dices, as he's about to discover - he's lucky with any dices and anything random), and he was anxious to check that the Aes Sedai had not taken them while he was sick because he needed to raise money at inns to buy his way out of Tar Valon. There's nothing special about Mat's dices. He carried one hidden special object that we didn't know the real purpose of, and it was his ashan'darei, so Jordan has already used that device with Mat. Same for Perrin - in his case it was his blacksmith hammer he was gifted with back in Tear, which is a normal hammer, but that became siginificant because Perrin had it with him to use it when he decided to forge himself his special power-wrought hammer. As for Rand, he was gifted Justice back in TGS, but we still don't know if that's a red herring to leave us wondering if Min and Cadsuane are right about Callandor's importance, or if that new power-wrought sword about which LTT knew things he wasn't telling Rand (dixit Rand) is actually the true sword of the light mentionned in the prophecies. Nynaeve's "gun" was Lan's ring. Min was Fel's books. Elayne has her ter'angreal collection, some of which are apparent "guns". Egwene? Why has she none, of all the main cast? Well... another currently hidden object shown in the middle of TDR but that we never heard about again (but it would require that Brandon is off by 5 chapters or so), nor do we know why Verin decided not to give it to Egwene after considering doing so, and that she put back in a box and explicitely mentionned she wouldn't destroy is Corianin Nedeal's dream diary/notes.

Brandon has also referred to Chekov about Perrin's hammer and Mat's ashan'darei (without naming them, of course) before TOM.

There are also little things in those chapters that aren't fully resolved... the real relevance of Gaul Perrin met then (Egwene even had a true dream about Gaul and Perrin in chapter 37, shortly after he met Perrin), Thom and the Red Ajah. It's also the beginning of Thom's and Mat's trip from TV to Caemlyn (it's not obvious what could be hidden in them... it's pretty much all solved issues), the meeting of the girls and Aviendha. There's also a chapter where Lanfear comes in the open to claim to Ishamael's face that TAR belongs to her. It's also the real beginning of Mat's luck, and Jordan has mysteriously hinted there might be more than we know behind this (that in a way he truly has the DO's own luck etc. - meaning that the Shadow has a role in his luck? Not so likely... but far more in line with Jordan's usual semi-rafo answers, perhaps hinting that when Mat's around it's as if the DO is out of luck, as if Mat had "stolen it... which would tie with Egwene's dream of Mat dicing with the DO, possibly unresolved if it's truly about the DO, not Ishamael) - but it's nothing to do with any object.

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