(I reread Graendal's chapter yesterday and it was very upsetting - I did not remember what happened to her)
No offence but I think Robert Jordan (and most of his fans) was a misogynist. (Or he thought WoT can't compete mainstream fantasy anymore?)
I talk about Shaidar Haran's "punishments". WoT is not an R rated fantasy, so it's really disturbing to read about rapes.
And what makes it worst: many reader claim that these rapes are "fair and square", because they are evil people. Define me this term, evil! Rand, Egwene, Perrin etc. are evil too, they are killed many innocent people, started wars etc.
OK, let's say: they deserved it. But Shaidar Haran did not rape male Forsakens. So, where is the famous Jordan-balance?
What do you think about this?
No offence but I think Robert Jordan (and most of his fans) was a misogynist. (Or he thought WoT can't compete mainstream fantasy anymore?)
I talk about Shaidar Haran's "punishments". WoT is not an R rated fantasy, so it's really disturbing to read about rapes.
And what makes it worst: many reader claim that these rapes are "fair and square", because they are evil people. Define me this term, evil! Rand, Egwene, Perrin etc. are evil too, they are killed many innocent people, started wars etc.
OK, let's say: they deserved it. But Shaidar Haran did not rape male Forsakens. So, where is the famous Jordan-balance?
What do you think about this?
Beside being very offensive by accusing most readers of WOT to be mysogynists (that's totally gratuitous and deeply stupid), you've missed the whole point. A whole lot of points, actually.
Those scenes aren't supposed to make you feel good, those scenes of torture, rape, psychological abuse (Graendal's style or not) - they're supposed to be disturbing.
There is no actual rapes to read about, merely allusions between the lines that it's part of Shadar Haran's punishments. It's from a Q&A that we got the confirmation that yes, among other disgusting things Shadar Haran raped Moghedien as a punishment. Shadar Haran is part Fade. They're beastly and they lust for women. That's the Shadow, it doesn't think like human beings, it's life-negating and has no respect for anything in the pattern. Jordan's not responsible if some of his readers aren't disturbed by those punishments.
And now, what's Jordan's "famous balance" (as you put it) got to do with it? The side of the Creator is designed to work in balance, but that balance is in jeopardy because of the Dark One. Shaitan is chaos and the negation of balance. He is the very incarnation of whims and unfair treatments - and Jordan made that quite clear.
As for how these scenes actually makes a mysogynist out of Jordan, you're again missing the whole point. Why do you think Jordan had the character associated with Absolute Evil use rape as a barbaric and disgusting punishment if not precisely because he thought it was one of the most repellent things that can be done to a woman? It's not even exploitative, he chose not to describe the scenes or be blunt about it - he had rape in mind, among other things, but chose to largely leave to the readers' imagination (and young readers just won't imagine it was rape) what Shadar Haran has really done to punish Moghedien. The ethics followed in WOT by majority of male characters would never condone rape and would deal with rapists very harshly (and some have actually done it).
No offence! The most disgusting aspect of WoT
26/08/2011 02:12:46 PM
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Yes, I hate rape and I hate how it was used in this story.
26/08/2011 03:31:16 PM
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Missing the point...
26/08/2011 06:05:40 PM
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No, but maybe you are missing the point of what a good villain can do.
31/08/2011 05:48:47 PM
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The rapists are evil, and are presented as such in the books. Go soak your head.
26/08/2011 05:57:21 PM
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I think the argument that RJ is misogynistic because Rand has 3 GFs is more tenable.
26/08/2011 06:47:26 PM
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I think giving his hero 3 GFs more likely proves that RJ is a misandrist
26/08/2011 09:14:17 PM
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Re: No offence! The most disgusting aspect of WoT
26/08/2011 10:49:26 PM
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Jordan was going to call the series "The Wheel of Rape" until Tor axed the idea. *NM*
31/08/2011 02:19:25 AM
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I know and there are not any elves or fairies *NM*
01/09/2011 03:03:53 PM
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No Fairies? Because there are enough of us who are reading the series! *NM*
01/09/2011 05:02:52 PM
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