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Why do you deliberately misquote the text? Shannow Send a noteboard - 03/02/2011 04:12:50 PM
Where does Egwene say Nynaeve is weaker than Rand? She says perhaps Nyn could match him if she were angry, and that's a guess.

As she later showed, she could herself almost match what he did then when she had come much closer to her full potential.

Not to mention that given the fact that neither she nor Elayne were experienced enough with the power to even really know how strong the shield on them was or if it was tied off or being held, and also the fact that Rand may or may not have jumped in power between that point and his confrontation with Asmo, we can make absolutely no actual statements about the comparative strengths of any of these people.

The only thing we have is that despite being a coward like Asmo, Moghedien still had a more dangerous reputation, and even that may mean nothing. Asmo could be barely weaker than Graendal, or weaker than Moghedien. Nothing in the text can really settle the issue.


Egwene judges that Nynaeve might come close to Rand in tSR. Close doesn't mean equal. It means almost as strong. At best.

And if Rand makes a significant jump in strength after that point, it only increases Asmodean's advantage over Moghedien.

Really, it is time for you to accept the reality of this issue. But you seem so entrenched in your viewpoint that you refuse to accept direct quotes.

I really cannot help you with that. You have to help yourself.

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Proof that Asmodean's effective One Power strength is greater than Moghedien's... Shannow - 03/02/2011 03:22:42 PM 2299 Views
Huh? fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 04:08:29 PM 1238 Views
Why do you deliberately misquote the text? Shannow - 03/02/2011 04:12:50 PM 1255 Views
You're deliberately being obtuse... as usual... fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 10:07:09 PM 1189 Views
Right. So Egwene can shield someone of Egwene's own strength, plus Elayne, AND weave a dozen flows.. Shannow - 03/02/2011 10:26:27 PM 1191 Views
fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 10:46:40 PM 1061 Views
No. Egwene is very close to her full potential at the time... Shannow - 03/02/2011 11:44:20 PM 1165 Views
Bullshit... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 12:39:42 AM 1038 Views
Unbiased view... Nargs - 04/02/2011 01:46:40 AM 1175 Views
The WoT Board in a nutshell. *NM* Ghavrel - 04/02/2011 02:34:32 AM 563 Views
Yeah, thats unbiased... *NM* fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 05:23:17 PM 547 Views
Don't agree Sidious - 04/02/2011 08:30:02 AM 1153 Views
Fair comment, but my question then is: Shannow - 04/02/2011 11:26:25 AM 1037 Views
I think the WO and Moiraine also Force Egwene as they know what's coming and need her darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 03:55:46 PM 1043 Views
It is specifically stated that Egwene was forced by the rigours of the damane training... Shannow - 04/02/2011 05:15:20 PM 1048 Views
Egwene has been continually forced... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 06:02:08 PM 984 Views
The direct quotes contradict you... Shannow - 04/02/2011 06:23:03 PM 1086 Views
actually the quote substantiates that Egwene is only slightly stronger than Moiraine in TSR darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 07:51:10 PM 1093 Views
here ya go they were all Forced darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 07:59:40 PM 960 Views
Nope... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 08:23:00 PM 1043 Views
I think you may have misused the term - RJ meant 'effective' to mean something a bit different. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 04:40:41 PM 1213 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. Shannow - 03/02/2011 05:30:15 PM 1133 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. Master Ablar - 03/02/2011 05:45:30 PM 1131 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 06:31:34 PM 1055 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. Kieran - 03/02/2011 07:06:50 PM 1082 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 07:17:25 PM 1068 Views
We still don't know who is effectively stronger, and not sure if Asmo was equal to Rand by the end. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 06:58:14 PM 889 Views
See my post above, I would say Asmo is Weaker than Moggy... *NM* Kieran - 03/02/2011 07:10:07 PM 571 Views
I'm not certain either way. I think it all depends on the terms being used. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 07:22:01 PM 1112 Views
Effective strength means who can make the bigger fireball, the stronger shield, the thicker balefire Shannow - 03/02/2011 07:42:17 PM 959 Views
I still hold to the point that your analogy is false. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 04/02/2011 04:20:05 PM 1021 Views
My impression of your view, in general, is that... Shannow - 03/02/2011 07:33:37 PM 990 Views
How... fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 10:15:34 PM 944 Views
If Nynaeve could do to Egwene and Elayne what Rand did to them, then I rest my case... Shannow - 03/02/2011 10:36:46 PM 1101 Views
Re: If Nynaeve could do to Egwene and Elayne what Rand did to them, then I rest my case... fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 10:50:57 PM 1057 Views
Got you now... Shannow - 03/02/2011 11:32:49 PM 1016 Views
You're clearly delusional... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 12:59:26 AM 1019 Views
You sound ridiculous Nargs - 04/02/2011 02:05:18 AM 1042 Views
Re: You sound ridiculous Kieran - 04/02/2011 02:23:50 AM 1099 Views
Ok... Nargs - 04/02/2011 04:13:34 PM 966 Views
Elayne is not stronger than most AS at this point in the books darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:14:41 PM 997 Views
Where on earth does it say Nynaeve could do to Egwene and Elayne what Rand did? darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:06:48 PM 1063 Views
Re: How... Sidious - 04/02/2011 08:34:21 AM 1159 Views
They're very close now... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 05:46:48 PM 1122 Views
That is unfortunately not true... Shannow - 04/02/2011 06:02:34 PM 1108 Views
It is... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 06:05:05 PM 955 Views
Re: It is... Sidious - 04/02/2011 06:31:32 PM 1208 Views
Yup... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 08:20:33 PM 981 Views
Semirhage hated Lanfear, but dared not act against her strength... Shannow - 04/02/2011 08:29:24 PM 1372 Views
yet Graendal showed a lot of respect for Semirhage ... even assumed she was the most darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:53:05 PM 1051 Views
Graendal on Semirhage and Demandred... Shannow - 04/02/2011 09:23:50 PM 1312 Views
No Sidious - 04/02/2011 11:10:00 PM 1090 Views
CLAPS *NM* darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 05:15:21 AM 601 Views
We will just have to disagree on this one... Shannow - 05/02/2011 06:57:36 AM 973 Views
Indeed Sidious - 05/02/2011 07:38:10 AM 974 Views
I agree with you ... especially abou the perpective issue darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 03:00:58 PM 1068 Views
I agree with you here darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:19:35 PM 980 Views
I don't think that's true.. fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 08:21:38 PM 922 Views
the evidence is that Aginor burnt out trying to channel the Eye and Rand didn't darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:23:50 PM 889 Views
Considering that Asmodean and Rand were using a sa'angreal... ˥ɐ ʎpu∀ɹ - 04/02/2011 04:55:03 AM 1196 Views
I think this is a no brainer Sidious - 04/02/2011 08:22:00 AM 1139 Views
The nice fact which is proven is the magnitude of the gap between Moghedien and Semirhage... Shannow - 04/02/2011 11:32:00 AM 962 Views
Nynaeve could be at 90% or 80% when she faced Moghedien we have no way of measuring that darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:42:03 PM 957 Views
Disagree... Shannow - 04/02/2011 08:51:55 PM 1042 Views
spin it all you like... I'm tired of this arument and your creative quoting. darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:56:14 PM 935 Views
The creative quoter is Fionwe, not me. You quote correctly, but your interpretations are way off... Shannow - 04/02/2011 09:05:43 PM 912 Views
Nynaeve has grown in strength, but she started nearly as strong as Moiraine! darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 05:35:05 AM 934 Views
Starting out at Moiraine's strength meant starting out at barely 30% of her full potential... Shannow - 05/02/2011 07:05:46 AM 988 Views
Nynaeve's strength Sidious - 05/02/2011 07:49:07 AM 1030 Views
Agree, Egwene has never been as strong as Nynaeve at any stage. *NM* darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 03:03:25 PM 659 Views
I disagree that Moiraine is 30% of Nynaeve. Much closer to 50% of Nynaeve. EDIT darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 03:02:06 PM 1121 Views
Minor quibbles aside... fionwe1987 - 05/02/2011 04:05:30 PM 1110 Views
Agreed, the exact numbers are arbitrary, I place Egwene a tad higher than you ... EDIT darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 04:30:00 PM 927 Views
Re: Agreed, the exact numbers are arbitrary, I place Egwene a tad higher than you ... EDIT fionwe1987 - 05/02/2011 06:09:41 PM 1063 Views
shrugs darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 06:46:02 PM 987 Views
Re: shrugs fionwe1987 - 05/02/2011 08:03:37 PM 1014 Views
I don't recall the Merise quote you are refering too and they have not been together in the series darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 09:20:56 PM 915 Views
I'm sorry, I meant the glossary entry... fionwe1987 - 05/02/2011 10:29:46 PM 948 Views
Thanks for clarifying darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 11:12:19 PM 902 Views
Re: Thanks for clarifying fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 12:42:51 AM 952 Views
fair enough ... I can agree to Cadsuane and Bode both being 70 with Egwene and co at 80 *NM* darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 04:29:49 AM 515 Views
Cool! *NM* fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 04:18:52 PM 548 Views
Sorry, but here your entire Bell Curve goes up in smoke... Shannow - 06/02/2011 01:13:15 PM 915 Views
In fact, Moiraine is even STRONGER than I postulated in the above post... Shannow - 06/02/2011 01:22:11 PM 1306 Views
well... Sidious - 06/02/2011 02:11:02 PM 1043 Views
Only a separate Bell Curve for the Age of Legends - when the average strength was higher - will work Shannow - 06/02/2011 03:29:49 PM 963 Views
Or, you know, the Aes Sedai aren't a representative sample... *NM* fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 04:19:22 PM 670 Views
I don't think Strength was higher in the AOL I think there were just more channelers darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 04:50:42 PM 1016 Views
Yup. fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 05:30:54 PM 926 Views
Trivial darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 06:10:55 PM 948 Views
Uhhh... no... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 04:18:19 PM 849 Views
Read these facts slowly, maybe you will grasp the implication then... Shannow - 06/02/2011 04:41:02 PM 1017 Views
you are missing the fact that women like Sharina have no interest in the Tower darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 05:05:10 PM 1028 Views
You equate random exclusions with the deliberate block exclusion of 37.5% weakest women... Shannow - 06/02/2011 05:41:47 PM 976 Views
wrong darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 06:08:20 PM 1061 Views
That is weak logic in the extreme... Shannow - 06/02/2011 06:16:46 PM 951 Views
what I'm saying is that a representative sample of the entire population darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 06:40:51 PM 995 Views
Yes. *NM* fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:47:59 PM 613 Views
Yes. *NM* fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:48:00 PM 530 Views
But you don't prove that the undiscovered women are stronger. They may well be weaker... Shannow - 06/02/2011 07:26:27 PM 847 Views
Amys is far from the strongest WO! fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 07:37:14 PM 1173 Views
Explain the 1000 women they found in Murandy then... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:26:46 PM 942 Views
And a 1000 years ago... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:33:29 PM 976 Views
The only implication I grasped is that you don't grasp math... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:21:12 PM 1060 Views
Circular reasoning... Shannow - 06/02/2011 07:03:53 PM 1003 Views
No, reasoning based on facts and what RJ said, both of which you ignore... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 07:34:21 PM 1255 Views
If you're going to ignore direct quotes, then we may as well stop right now... Shannow - 06/02/2011 08:42:40 PM 1086 Views
Agreed. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 04/02/2011 04:32:05 PM 1056 Views
Agree. *NM* fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 05:49:05 PM 614 Views
agreed *NM* darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:27:22 PM 629 Views
off tangent question: Has Nynaeve yet to reach full potential or did she already after being ... Bookwyrm - 04/02/2011 08:39:29 PM 1068 Views
I think the general concensus is that after the CK she was forced to her full potential darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 03:44:29 PM 998 Views
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