Not to mention it's not like any of these have been without repercussion!
darius_sedai Send a noteboard - 25/10/2010 04:50:39 PM
1: Elaida - kidnapping of King Mattin Stepaneos
2: Alanna - bonding Rand against his will (nothing short of rape, known by lots of Aes Sedai)
3: Elaida - severely torturing a novice (Egwene) in front of a lot of Aes Sedai.
4: Elaida - kidnapping Rand
5: Aes Sedai kidnapping gang - severe torture of a prisoner (Rand)
2: Alanna - bonding Rand against his will (nothing short of rape, known by lots of Aes Sedai)
3: Elaida - severely torturing a novice (Egwene) in front of a lot of Aes Sedai.
4: Elaida - kidnapping Rand
5: Aes Sedai kidnapping gang - severe torture of a prisoner (Rand)
Wow, if these are atrocities to you, then I'd hate to think what category you put the Holocaust in.
Show me where an AS has murdered people on a whim and gotten away with it... but in the mean time your examples are very weak and the AS in question didn't get off half so easily as Carridin (who never so much as broke a sweat for his actions).
1. Kidnapping a King was easy to get away with since she could claim she was saving him from Rand, and he's being treated quite well in the Tower. A Stupid and pointless act from Elaida, but hardly an atrocity.
2. How many times has she been told she would be held accountable at some point? At the very least her standing has been compromised with every other Sister who knows what she did. But since Rand seems to accept it, and has been using her services they've left it alone. Alanna is ostracized by both groups of AS she is with for her actions (see quote below)
3. Elaida was put on trial by the Hall for those actions and was formally censured for it.
4. How long did Alviarin manage to keep Elaida cowed over this? Elaida followed the purpose of the Red Ajah here. She ordered the capture of a man who can Channel and had him brought to TV. Stupid since he is also the DR, but also perfectly within the realm of what AS do ... how does this qualify as an atrocity? Stupidity I'll grant you.
5. No AS has had any indication of that and been able to affect it (those that know have no way of punishing them more than what the WO are doing to them), not to mention even those that did participate who were not DF (or Erian's special circumstances) refused to take part more than once. Also, note Shalon's comment about the AS who participated ... they are treated by the others as though they had committed a crime:
WH
To Loose the Sun
Four of them, Nesune and Erian, Beldeine and Elza, rode in a cluster not far behind her, though they were not really together, only occupying the same space. They did not talk among themselves, or look at one another. They did not seem to like one another very much. In her mind, Shalon had them in the same boat with Sarene. The Aes Sedai pretended that they were all one under Cadsuane, yet that was plainly untrue. Merise, Corele, Kumira and Daigian crewed another boat, commanded by Cadsuane. Sometimes Alanna seemed in one boat, sometimes the other, while Verin appeared to be in some way of Cadsuane's boat but not in it. Swimming alongside, perhaps, with Cadsuane holding her hand. If that was not strange enough, there was the matter of deference.
Oddly, it seemed that Aes Sedai valued strength in the Power above experience or skill. By their own hierarchy, some in Nesune's boat were in a position to expect deference from some in Cadsuane's, but although those in Cadsuane's boat who should defer did so, they did so as though to a superior who had committed a grievous crime known to all. By that hierarchy, Nesune stood higher than any save Cadsuane and Merise, yet she faced Daigian, who stood at the very bottom, as if willfully defiant over committing that crime, and so did the others in her boat.
Try again to show us where AS get away with murder...
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
The Children of the Light and the White Tower
20/10/2010 08:32:10 PM
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21/10/2010 01:47:19 AM
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Re: The Children of the Light and the White Tower
20/10/2010 08:58:12 PM
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The one known rapist was, by his own admission, committing a crime against their standards.
20/10/2010 09:05:55 PM
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Re: The one known rapist was, by his own admission, committing a crime against their standards.
21/10/2010 12:15:48 AM
- 1143 Views
Re: The one known rapist was, by his own admission, committing a crime against their standards.
21/10/2010 02:59:49 PM
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Re: The one known rapist was, by his own admission, committing a crime against their standards.
21/10/2010 04:35:00 PM
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And farmers are, of course, treated the same as rebel officers and usurpers and mutineers.
23/10/2010 03:07:10 PM
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Re: The one known rapist was, by his own admission, committing a crime against their standards.
21/10/2010 07:55:06 PM
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And there is no indication of how far that went.
23/10/2010 03:12:42 PM
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"The question" as opposed to "questioning"
24/10/2010 06:21:43 PM
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And that would indicate everyone does it, if it is so commonly used, so how are the CoL worse? *NM*
25/10/2010 01:14:13 AM
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Re: The one known rapist was, by his own admission, committing a crime against their standards.
24/10/2010 06:53:19 AM
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The utter stupidity of this statement caught my eye...
24/10/2010 08:12:58 AM
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Your analyses and extension of concepts always brings that "utter stupidity" phrase to my mind.
25/10/2010 02:17:10 AM
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Huh? ... what !! ... are you mad?
21/10/2010 05:05:16 PM
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Did you forget the very first PoV Darkfriend in the series?
23/10/2010 03:27:25 PM
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Difference being the whitecloaks who were ordered to do it were not DFs. All the AS evil deeds
23/10/2010 07:55:23 PM
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So similar scenes in the Cairhienin civil war were all the work of Darkfriends?
25/10/2010 02:25:57 AM
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Please provide an example of a DF AS committing an atrocity and not being punished by the Tower
25/10/2010 03:34:46 AM
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Just one? Here's a list from the top of my head in 60 secs:..
25/10/2010 09:28:10 AM
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Re: Just one? Here's a list from the top of my head in 60 secs:..
25/10/2010 04:14:05 PM
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Not to mention it's not like any of these have been without repercussion!
25/10/2010 04:50:39 PM
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Re: Not to mention it's not like any of these have been without repercussion!
27/10/2010 01:06:53 PM
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You under some delusion that I'm defending the AS
27/10/2010 08:29:14 PM
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No. I'm pointing out you are under the delusion that AS pay for their atrocities.
28/10/2010 09:16:38 AM
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okay, so AS never Still and execute AS for doing stuff ... have you read the series?
28/10/2010 05:20:28 PM
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That doesn't make the -unpunished- atrocities disappear, you know. Your point is lame AND moot.
28/10/2010 07:07:27 PM
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Re: That doesn't make the -unpunished- atrocities disappear, you know. Your point is lame AND moot.
28/10/2010 07:09:33 PM
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To echo Darius...
23/10/2010 08:34:00 PM
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Re: To echo Darius...
25/10/2010 10:03:14 AM
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Go look up the definition of the word atrocity
25/10/2010 04:53:55 PM
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Their implicit role in the genocide of Manetheren was probable their greatest atrocity *NM*
26/10/2010 03:01:01 AM
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You mean the act that got Tetsuan deposed, Stilled and sentenced to hard labor until she gave up the
26/10/2010 04:19:45 AM
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Ya, the ultimated punishment of cleaning pots and floors
NOOOOOOOO!!!
26/10/2010 11:59:51 PM
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Maybe you should have done that yourself: "behaviour or an action that is wicked or ruthless"
27/10/2010 11:11:30 AM
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the fact that you can't differentiate between the extermination of an entire village
27/10/2010 08:30:12 PM
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READ; I *did* differentiate between them. It doesn't change the fact all are atrocious deeds
28/10/2010 09:00:56 AM
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28/10/2010 05:22:18 PM
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You asked for atrocities and you got them. Now you just don't know what to do with them.
28/10/2010 06:49:16 PM
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28/10/2010 07:07:57 PM
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dude, you gave us a list of petty crimes and compared it to mass murder
28/10/2010 06:59:33 PM
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Complete the thought...
28/10/2010 07:11:37 PM
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seems I must do so for this guy to understand ... and I'm not holding my breath on that!
28/10/2010 08:24:57 PM
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Rape, murder, starting wars and doing noting about them, kidnap / severe torture of prisoners... *NM*
28/10/2010 07:51:33 PM
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again you fail to note that the AS have systems in place to prevent these things
28/10/2010 08:23:32 PM
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Again you fail to note that the AS haven't used those "systems" of theirs
28/10/2010 09:02:15 PM
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What wars did they start?
28/10/2010 08:56:46 PM
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You should be an Aes Sedai; the way you can twist truth would scare Siuan.
28/10/2010 09:07:24 PM
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Take your own advice, please
28/10/2010 07:30:51 PM
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Come on. Just say it. Real men don't act like catty, bitchy women. *NM*
20/10/2010 11:14:49 PM
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"Rightly hold responsible for the threat of the Shadow?" Puh-leeze
21/10/2010 12:06:34 AM
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Puh-leeze right back at you:
21/10/2010 08:24:12 AM
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The Wheel was created so the DO could break in. The Creator plays his game with the DO thru people
21/10/2010 01:45:07 PM
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It was you who brought up that silly Real World kitchen example, silly.
25/10/2010 10:55:29 AM
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I could say you zinged me, but you're just bent on silliness. Bored now. *NM*
25/10/2010 10:54:41 PM
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Your personal theories do not constitute evidence, and your aberrant logic better supports MY case
21/10/2010 03:21:44 PM
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Objection, your honor! Bringing evidentiary rules into this is asinine! *NM*
21/10/2010 11:22:19 PM
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The word "evidence" is not exclusive to the practice of jurisprudence
23/10/2010 03:31:57 PM
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Rational thinking. Well, you use the word "deserved" in all caps. Nuff said. *NM*
23/10/2010 04:55:02 PM
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Emphasis means nothing one way or another as far as rationality goes, which you would know...
25/10/2010 01:13:23 AM
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You know zilch about my acquaintances. "mk" was wrong - you're not an idiot. But you are ignorable. *NM*
25/10/2010 10:57:04 PM
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Not so sure about that
21/10/2010 02:29:02 AM
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the city is closed to WC
21/10/2010 04:01:45 AM
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Re: the city is closed to WC
21/10/2010 04:55:45 AM
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But that is irrelevant. Aes Sedai can also go to Amadicia in disguise. *NM*
21/10/2010 05:35:18 AM
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But they aren't in disguise
21/10/2010 08:31:38 AM
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They don't wear their uniform, their one identifying feature. That is a disguise.
21/10/2010 09:08:25 PM
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Re: They don't wear their uniform, their one identifying feature. That is a disguise.
22/10/2010 02:10:07 PM
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CotL are welcome in Tar Valon to have a drink. Aes Sedai are hanged when found in Amadicia..
21/10/2010 08:33:03 AM
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Now hang on a minute!
21/10/2010 07:28:45 AM
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Re: Now hang on a minute!
21/10/2010 10:49:34 AM
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it would be an interesting comparison if they weren't completely different organizations
21/10/2010 04:09:31 PM
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