Anyone who wants to criticize or mock Rand's behavior has a bit of an open invitation to do so. Why? Cause Rand's taken his misfortune with a lot of bad grace. Sure, he's got great reason to be surly, angry, touchy, jumpy... But I'd say objective observers would say Rand does mope and engage in some self-pity (or self-hate). With frequency.
Sometimes it genuinely sounds like whining. It doesn't sound kind to write that, since Rand has been through harsh, cruel experiences in every single book (I think). Going nuts all the while, too. It's an unfair comparison, but Homer Simpson's quick turns to positivity make all his mood-swings and nastiness easier to pass over. It's just easier for folks to gravitate to.
Rand's darkness, for me, almost never makes for rewarding reading. I guess, perhaps, he's always been prone to being a wet blanket, but it usually happened (IIRC) when he took real responsibility upon himself while still being such a n00b at everything but farming.
Of course, Rand takes himself so bloody seriously - to such a great degree - that it also makes it both easy and fun to mock him. Even if you don't approve of the results, you have to admit that sort of thing is a joke magnet.
On the other hand: Egwene can often be positive. Maybe what makes her seem to have the upper hand here is that she hasn't spent nearly as much time being actively negative; certainly not enough to compare to Rand. Then again, the book's about him, so he gets more time. And no one should ignore the fact that she hasn't been through nearly as much constant torment as al'Thor.
It's easy to prefer Egwene when writing something like this because she does fight hard for the Light, and it doesn't get so damn dreary. But Egwene can be two-faced, double-standard bearing, over-proud, unsympathetic, judgmental, self-indulgent, self-aggrandizing, megalomaniacal, and astronomically whiny... But I like that she *does* make a point of openly going to people for help,. Even if it'll be fishy, like her study with the WO...
If you're going to look at warts and all, Egwene still conveys a good (if high-maintenance) attitude. The Gawyn thing is just odd, partly he's into her so hard. I can't judge her attitude toward Gawyn because (a) he sort of has a big creepy side to him (and the "kill Rand" thing) and (b) I haven't liked him for years now.
No biggie either way - real people got worse flaws than either of them.
PS - Rand definitely had Forsaken actively helping him - like Asmo's blocking that Gateway on McLovin's Eve. That sort of thing was unnecessary enough to count as a blessing. Asmo also helped keep Rand alive after a fight on Telescope Tower. There was also Lanfear. Does anyone doubt that if Mesaana grabbed Rand in book 2, Lanfear wouldn't spring him? The Wonder Girls wouldn't even have time to form a plan!
Sometimes it genuinely sounds like whining. It doesn't sound kind to write that, since Rand has been through harsh, cruel experiences in every single book (I think). Going nuts all the while, too. It's an unfair comparison, but Homer Simpson's quick turns to positivity make all his mood-swings and nastiness easier to pass over. It's just easier for folks to gravitate to.
Rand's darkness, for me, almost never makes for rewarding reading. I guess, perhaps, he's always been prone to being a wet blanket, but it usually happened (IIRC) when he took real responsibility upon himself while still being such a n00b at everything but farming.
Of course, Rand takes himself so bloody seriously - to such a great degree - that it also makes it both easy and fun to mock him. Even if you don't approve of the results, you have to admit that sort of thing is a joke magnet.
On the other hand: Egwene can often be positive. Maybe what makes her seem to have the upper hand here is that she hasn't spent nearly as much time being actively negative; certainly not enough to compare to Rand. Then again, the book's about him, so he gets more time. And no one should ignore the fact that she hasn't been through nearly as much constant torment as al'Thor.
It's easy to prefer Egwene when writing something like this because she does fight hard for the Light, and it doesn't get so damn dreary. But Egwene can be two-faced, double-standard bearing, over-proud, unsympathetic, judgmental, self-indulgent, self-aggrandizing, megalomaniacal, and astronomically whiny... But I like that she *does* make a point of openly going to people for help,. Even if it'll be fishy, like her study with the WO...
If you're going to look at warts and all, Egwene still conveys a good (if high-maintenance) attitude. The Gawyn thing is just odd, partly he's into her so hard. I can't judge her attitude toward Gawyn because (a) he sort of has a big creepy side to him (and the "kill Rand" thing) and (b) I haven't liked him for years now.
No biggie either way - real people got worse flaws than either of them.
PS - Rand definitely had Forsaken actively helping him - like Asmo's blocking that Gateway on McLovin's Eve. That sort of thing was unnecessary enough to count as a blessing. Asmo also helped keep Rand alive after a fight on Telescope Tower. There was also Lanfear. Does anyone doubt that if Mesaana grabbed Rand in book 2, Lanfear wouldn't spring him? The Wonder Girls wouldn't even have time to form a plan!
Rand vs Egwene... one-line scenarios
05/09/2010 05:21:08 PM
- 2736 Views
Hmm... I don't think you want to read the rebuttal to that *NM*
05/09/2010 06:07:16 PM
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True
05/09/2010 09:52:09 PM
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But you've already read my post *NM*
05/09/2010 11:53:58 PM
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You're being a reverse Cannoli. And at least he has a point and is sometimes amusing *NM*
05/09/2010 06:33:55 PM
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Re: You're being a reverse Cannoli. And at least he has a point and is sometimes amusing
05/09/2010 09:54:29 PM
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Re: You're being a reverse Cannoli. And at least he has a point and is sometimes amusing
06/09/2010 03:50:44 AM
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Wow, that's a really strident and succinct opinion. I hope you get paid by the snark! *NM*
05/09/2010 11:07:18 PM
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Corrected for the sake of accuracy .
05/09/2010 06:51:58 PM
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Nonsense...
05/09/2010 09:56:41 PM
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Gotta love Dark Templar
05/09/2010 10:14:00 PM
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That's partly why I didn't post a reply poking at her. *NM*
05/09/2010 11:56:15 PM
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That whole post is stupid, you can't compare Rand's ordeal to Egwene's.
05/09/2010 10:14:43 PM
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Too bad! He has trumped any attempt to counter his arguments by calling it humor! Shut up now. *NM*
06/09/2010 01:00:49 AM
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OMG
06/09/2010 11:48:48 AM
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I know, appalling, right?
09/09/2010 07:27:40 AM
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Re: I know, appalling, right?
09/09/2010 07:41:02 AM
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He doesn't think so, why should we?
09/09/2010 03:40:25 PM
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Revised for accurracy, improved characterization and humor
06/09/2010 12:57:35 AM
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the humor here is that you think you understand accurracy, improvement, characterization or humor! *NM*
06/09/2010 01:56:57 AM
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I'm having to settle for being right. Better than being president... *NM*
06/09/2010 03:47:52 AM
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Re: Revised for accurracy, improved characterization and humor
06/09/2010 11:51:12 AM
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indeed, one of the many reasons Tar Valon was such a large and powerful trading center
06/09/2010 04:33:56 PM
- 1125 Views
If a few score Yellows can't handle the disease issue, what point to the Aes Sedai at all?
06/09/2010 10:17:44 PM
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Re: If a few score Yellows can't handle the disease issue, what point to the Aes Sedai at all?
08/09/2010 08:30:35 AM
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Like Egwene understands the health implications! It's all about the aesthetics for her.
09/09/2010 12:35:57 AM
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Well, she was an apprentice wisdom with Nynaeve for a while
09/09/2010 05:33:25 AM
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An idiot would understand the implications
09/09/2010 07:38:57 AM
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and it's not just Egwene!
11/09/2010 02:11:16 PM
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Cannoli's just got huge blinders...
11/09/2010 04:59:50 PM
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I feel like this post should be bulleted and made required reading before posting on this forum *NM*
11/09/2010 05:11:14 PM
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You forgot one very important point
11/09/2010 06:44:32 PM
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As to that...
11/09/2010 08:47:26 PM
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after dealing with his bushwa waaay longer than you, I'm content to ignore him *NM*
11/09/2010 11:29:27 PM
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Remember the old times?
12/09/2010 03:35:43 AM
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When exactly have I ever given someone else a pass for "necessary actions" I blamed Egwene for?
14/09/2010 02:08:29 AM
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A few days back...
14/09/2010 04:03:41 AM
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Yes, those are completely different scenarios.
14/09/2010 05:36:30 AM
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Misinterpretations...
14/09/2010 07:26:11 AM
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Holy carp. I prefer my form of arguing. I make an *NM* post and then he calls me a name *NM*
15/09/2010 06:47:08 AM
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So your defense of Egwene is to refute her accusation against her rival?
14/09/2010 02:12:22 AM
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Double Post. See below. *NM*
14/09/2010 04:03:55 AM
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How was Egwene to know Elaida made a half-hearted attempt?
14/09/2010 04:06:15 AM
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Re: How was Egwene to know Elaida made a half-hearted attempt?
14/09/2010 06:58:17 AM
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I give up.
14/09/2010 07:44:57 AM
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No, I made MY point, and your refusal to admit to the slightest fault of Egwene proves MY point *NM*
15/09/2010 01:17:21 AM
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So much venom. Maybe you should take a break one of these days, Cannoli. At this rate...
08/09/2010 12:16:05 AM
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I'm not the one posting to undercut the hero, while calling it humor to duck critical response *NM*
09/09/2010 12:37:07 AM
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Somehow I think of the lyrics from "Defying Gravity", which aren't quite one line
07/09/2010 04:07:09 PM
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Look at it these ways
08/09/2010 02:47:46 AM
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It really comes down to the direction RJ went with his personality
09/09/2010 03:08:36 PM
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pretty cool idea. And I didn't know that about Alex the Great. Nice! *NM*
10/09/2010 12:03:36 AM
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Wow, posting from work is becoming less impressive as my stress increases. Had to fix errors *NM*
10/09/2010 10:50:07 PM
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This post was funny. Your responders are largely idiots who need a sense of humor. *NM*
08/09/2010 03:56:07 AM
- 696 Views