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Re: Some thoughts about the Force... DomA Send a noteboard - 20/12/2015 08:06:40 PM

View original postThat's what I hope Abrams & co get right in depicting the downfall of the New Order and the Knights of Ren. It doesn't matter so much if Ben gets redeemed (and he seemed to be deliberately putting himself beyond that with his killing of Han, suggesting that he gets what the Light side of the Force is all about, and was deliberately burning that bridge), but Rey & Finn have to win the right way for this to be true to Star Wars.

Good analysis, and a snippet of interview with Abrams highly suggests you're on the right track.

He confirmed that Kylo Ren knows about Anakin's last minute return to the light. He sees it as a failure on Vader's part, a betrayal of Darth Vader by his Anakin Skywalker side (Abrams says Kylo tends to see them as separate entities), a weakness that let Vader fall for the enemy's seduction. In this light your hypothesis that Ren seems to deliberately put himself beyond a return to the light is probably dead on the money: it's his goal, and probably his greatest fear is that Kylo Ren might not have fully vanquished the Ben Solo part of himself.

That may be the most interesting (and most original) novelty: Kylo Ren seems to see the temptations of the Light the same way the Jedi see the temptations of the dark side.

In any case, after what happened to Han, it doesn't sound like appealing to who he was will work on this one...

As for how he turned to the dark side, the novelization apparently spells out that Snoke had been influencing Ben Solo since childhood and the reason why Leia sent her son to Luke for training early is that she could sense his darkness.


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Star Wars : The Force Awakens review (spoiler free) - 17/12/2015 09:18:26 AM 2718 Views
Love your review! I'm seeing it tomorrow night at 9pm. Can't wait! *NM* - 18/12/2015 01:20:16 AM 1038 Views
Some (relatively spoiler free) thoughts - 18/12/2015 12:27:22 PM 1796 Views
I pretty much agree with most of that. - 18/12/2015 01:05:16 PM 1671 Views
Agreed, Driver did a great job..... - 19/12/2015 05:46:44 AM 1551 Views
Replies and spoilers - 18/12/2015 03:04:37 PM 1650 Views
Re: Replies and spoilers - 18/12/2015 04:35:49 PM 1479 Views
Re: Replies and spoilers - 18/12/2015 05:51:29 PM 1574 Views
Re: Replies and spoilers - 29/12/2015 04:44:36 AM 1544 Views
Re: Replies and spoilers - 29/12/2015 07:37:39 PM 1493 Views
Re: Replies and spoilers - 19/12/2015 05:30:13 PM 1621 Views
Re: Replies and spoilers - 20/12/2015 09:51:22 AM 1732 Views
Re: Replies and spoilers - 21/12/2015 06:31:54 PM 1871 Views
The books... - 21/12/2015 09:05:28 PM 1654 Views
Re: The books... - 22/12/2015 03:12:52 AM 1631 Views
In general agreement ** potential Spoilers ** - 19/12/2015 06:06:23 AM 1522 Views
There are books? - 19/12/2015 11:19:07 AM 1569 Views
Re: There are books? - 19/12/2015 05:41:45 PM 1597 Views
So Darth Plagieus might still be in? Sweet. - 20/12/2015 04:44:21 AM 1498 Views
Palpatine's master? - 20/12/2015 02:25:45 PM 1569 Views
I mean the novel of that name. - 22/12/2015 09:47:16 PM 1517 Views
Re: I mean the novel of that name. - 22/12/2015 10:05:49 PM 1604 Views
Yeah, I think we're talking about the same one. - 24/12/2015 12:05:57 AM 1497 Views
Journey to Star Wars: The Force Awakens - 19/12/2015 06:07:16 PM 1596 Views
I don't think any of that had to be explained. - 19/12/2015 12:16:07 PM 1478 Views
I'm more or less in complete agreement (spoilers) - 19/12/2015 08:22:21 PM 1621 Views
Some thoughts about the Force... - 20/12/2015 06:04:43 AM 1669 Views
Re: Some thoughts about the Force... - 20/12/2015 08:06:40 PM 1469 Views
Re: I'm more or less in complete agreement (spoilers) - 20/12/2015 10:07:36 AM 1617 Views
Also, SPOILER thoughts. - 18/12/2015 01:00:32 PM 1790 Views
Re: Also, SPOILER thoughts. - 18/12/2015 01:11:30 PM 1583 Views
You're making me reply to two posts - 18/12/2015 03:29:23 PM 1655 Views
The death (spoilers) - 22/12/2015 10:30:05 PM 1591 Views
Re: You're making me reply to two posts - 29/12/2015 05:24:39 AM 1576 Views
Re: Also, SPOILER thoughts. - 29/12/2015 05:19:54 AM 1586 Views
I have tickets for tonight - 18/12/2015 04:47:17 PM 1543 Views
Arbrams impressed me(spoiler free) - 19/12/2015 05:17:42 AM 1679 Views
'Revenge of the Sith' (3rd prequel) was actually a decent movie - 18/12/2015 10:46:52 PM 1585 Views
They were all good. Internet geeks suck. - 18/12/2015 11:38:36 PM 1534 Views
Re: They were all good. Internet geeks suck. - 19/12/2015 12:19:10 AM 1715 Views
Well - 19/12/2015 05:53:56 AM 1544 Views
Re: They were all good. Internet geeks suck. - 19/12/2015 07:46:06 AM 1726 Views
people forget they were kids movies *NM* - 19/12/2015 01:17:10 AM 939 Views
Yeah, people take the whole 'Star Wars' thing too seriously - 19/12/2015 02:59:29 AM 1587 Views
BTW, Daniel Craig is totally forgiven for Spectre. He was a Stormtrooper (spoilers for role) - 18/12/2015 11:40:44 PM 1477 Views
Yip that's true *NM* - 19/12/2015 07:46:59 AM 970 Views
And Simon Pegg was the alien who ran the trading post Rey always went to *NM* - 20/12/2015 02:30:59 PM 1015 Views
I got the impression he was actually her boss or contractor - 28/12/2015 12:48:48 PM 1652 Views
Pretty much... - 29/12/2015 12:08:58 AM 1574 Views
Absolutely, yes *NM* - 29/12/2015 01:54:52 PM 1038 Views
Just saw it! Holy shit, shit, shit, shit.....it was amazing. - 19/12/2015 05:38:44 AM 1609 Views
Loved it (Spoilers) - 19/12/2015 06:16:54 AM 1589 Views
Fantastic characters, great entertainment, no originality, no logic - 29/12/2015 03:33:43 AM 1613 Views
Your Mom has no originality or logic! *NM* - 29/12/2015 11:39:41 AM 993 Views
JJ Abrams should be able to do better than my Mom - 30/12/2015 04:20:54 AM 1550 Views
I gave it a B+ overall but I think the characters are its weak spot - 29/12/2015 05:08:15 PM 1374 Views
JJ Abrams' movies are character-driven, Lucas' movies are plot-driven - 30/12/2015 04:38:49 AM 1483 Views
Lucas has created some of the most iconics chacters in movie history ? - 31/12/2015 02:29:02 PM 1491 Views
So, Rey (Possible Spoilers ahead) - 30/12/2015 10:11:01 AM 1552 Views
Re: So, Rey (Possible Spoilers ahead) - 30/12/2015 07:10:56 PM 1873 Views
Re: So, Rey (Possible Spoilers ahead) - 30/12/2015 09:24:08 PM 1506 Views
Re: So, Rey (Possible Spoilers ahead) - 31/12/2015 04:58:24 PM 1453 Views
It was fun, and I look forward to the next ones, but can't say I was that wowed. - 30/12/2015 09:26:10 PM 1545 Views
Why is time for female lead and why does the lef think subtraction is the answer to inequality? - 04/01/2016 01:37:37 PM 1338 Views
Because the six other movies had zero female Jedis of any importance? - 04/01/2016 05:58:25 PM 1552 Views
Just another check the box movie, then - 04/01/2016 06:02:41 PM 1409 Views
Oh, come on. You're really going to complain just because they had a woman and a black guy? - 04/01/2016 11:48:52 PM 1538 Views
They are talking abou tmakin ght Gunslinger black - 05/01/2016 02:05:36 PM 1439 Views
Yeah, Star Wars is just part of the larger trend. It can't be viewed in a vacuum (pun intended). - 05/01/2016 02:38:34 PM 1417 Views
That's not really what I said, you'll note. - 05/01/2016 07:48:08 PM 1622 Views
I don't think it was Disney's business acumen. - 06/01/2016 06:59:46 PM 1671 Views
Wow. That's... sad. - 06/01/2016 09:32:37 PM 1605 Views
Re: Wow. That's... sad. - 08/01/2016 03:08:58 AM 1550 Views
I am noit sure how well that 7-12 girl demographic will work in merchandising - 08/01/2016 06:30:47 PM 1548 Views
Your premise is entirely wrong. - 12/01/2016 05:53:26 AM 1444 Views
Actually, they do have a major character who is Latino. - 12/01/2016 07:15:31 PM 1533 Views
The culture wars are just about blacks and feminists. - 13/01/2016 02:31:20 AM 1519 Views
All that Paul said - 17/01/2016 05:13:59 PM 2195 Views
LOL - 05/01/2016 06:33:50 PM 1447 Views
Funny that people use strwmen arguments to make themsleves feel smart - 08/01/2016 04:22:22 PM 1556 Views
It's not a straw man - 08/01/2016 04:52:03 PM 1530 Views
it was story of a father and son so it makes sense to male leads - 04/01/2016 06:59:33 PM 1383 Views
Male leads, sure, but it wasn't just the leads. - 04/01/2016 11:28:12 PM 1521 Views
Was finn as strong as Leia? I would say not even close - 05/01/2016 05:55:51 PM 1483 Views
I don't see how it makes sense to compare their roles, but Finn is certainly plenty strong. - 05/01/2016 07:38:05 PM 1563 Views
Finn reacts and is pretty much drug through the story - 06/01/2016 02:52:58 PM 1598 Views
Re: Finn reacts and is pretty much drug through the story - 06/01/2016 05:50:08 PM 1521 Views
I don't have an issue with a strong female jedi - 07/01/2016 02:49:44 PM 1495 Views
Re: I don't have an issue with a strong female jedi - 07/01/2016 03:26:34 PM 1519 Views
The reall issue it looks like Luke sucked as Jedi master - 07/01/2016 07:14:31 PM 1469 Views
Sorry, no. - 06/01/2016 06:56:09 PM 1567 Views
What a load of crap. - 08/01/2016 10:29:35 AM 1438 Views
I only partially agree - 08/01/2016 03:27:10 PM 1585 Views
Sorry if science isn't your thing but no what I said is true - 09/01/2016 11:49:15 PM 1603 Views
Re: Was finn as strong as Leia? I would say not even close - 08/01/2016 10:01:16 AM 1421 Views
Well said *NM* - 05/01/2016 12:01:25 PM 983 Views
Because it isn't "subtraction"... - 08/01/2016 09:33:24 AM 1475 Views
Of course it is - 09/01/2016 10:19:53 PM 1440 Views
Okay so about the big bad guy *spoilers* - 05/01/2016 06:27:37 PM 1512 Views
I may be alone on this, but... - 05/01/2016 08:07:26 PM 1510 Views
Re: I may be alone on this, but... - 05/01/2016 08:42:42 PM 1449 Views
What speaks against is for me... - 05/01/2016 10:57:44 PM 1867 Views
Re: What speaks against is for me... - 06/01/2016 10:08:35 AM 1644 Views
It's all good stuff, like the first book in a good sci-fi/fantasy trilogy! - 07/01/2016 06:44:45 AM 1543 Views
I think it's pretty obvious... - 17/01/2016 07:43:19 AM 1639 Views

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