Active Users:805 Time:25/11/2024 11:56:16 AM
He's right on socialism Tom Send a noteboard - 25/09/2017 12:42:26 AM

I realize that everyone these days doesn't understand nuance, and social democracy which was supported by socialist and left-leaning parties is now equated with socialism, when in fact it never was or is the ultimate goal of those parties. I get it. But that doesn't make it socialism. Socialism is state control of the means of production, and it's the goal of every socialist party out there. Strict Marxists fight for it. Marxist-Leninists fight for it. Trotskyists and Maoists fight for it. Contemptible revisionist splitters (sorry, channeling Leninism there for a second) following Bernstein and Kautsky merely agreed to fight for it through democratic means rather than open conflict and revolution, and that latter group comprises pretty much every moderate Left Eurosocialist group out there. It also includes Bernie Sanders and much of the US socialist Left (though not their fellow travelers, who are naive enough to think it's all about healthcare for everyone).

Now, by those standards, I have yet to see socialism work. Every time the state takes something over, it becomes hideously corrupt, grossly inefficient and ends up failing. Then it either gets bailed out by the state (the preferred French method for dealing with state-controlled industry) or sold off (as Maggie Thatcher did, along with most eastern European post-communist states).

So let's see: we know planned economies fail 100% of the time. State industries have a failure rate approaching that if not at it (I'm sure there's one exception out there that's made money for brief periods of time due to market inefficiencies, like state-run oil companies in 2007). So then how is Trump wrong when saying socialism fails?

Political correctness is the pettiest form of casuistry.

ἡ δὲ κἀκ τριῶν τρυπημάτων ἐργαζομένη ἐνεκάλει τῇ φύσει, δυσφορουμένη, ὅτι δὴ μὴ καὶ τοὺς τιτθοὺς αὐτῇ εὐρύτερον ἢ νῦν εἰσι τρυπώη, ὅπως καὶ ἄλλην ἐνταῦθα μίξιν ἐπιτεχνᾶσθαι δυνατὴ εἴη. – Procopius

Ummaka qinnassa nīk!

*MySmiley*
Reply to message
I don't care if Trump deputizes the Klan or outlaws Spanish; Rocket Man is worth it. - 21/09/2017 01:00:46 AM 1161 Views
Rocket Man was hilarious. - 21/09/2017 02:57:15 AM 504 Views
I'm actually coming to respect him a little more... - 21/09/2017 04:51:06 PM 554 Views
Cordelia was one of the few Sunnydale High students I liked or for whom I had any respect - 21/09/2017 05:17:56 PM 581 Views
Cordelia was a great character.... - 21/09/2017 07:11:18 PM 459 Views
He's brilliant in strategy - 21/09/2017 08:34:51 PM 575 Views
It is fun to watch - 21/09/2017 08:52:25 PM 543 Views
Are you sure that's strategy? - 24/09/2017 08:39:19 AM 470 Views
Pretty sure - 24/09/2017 11:07:00 PM 489 Views
that is funny - 21/09/2017 07:03:17 PM 562 Views
You said something similar a while back. And really, I just don't get it. - 21/09/2017 07:52:31 PM 620 Views
Oh, and just to add... - 21/09/2017 07:55:35 PM 522 Views
such as? - 21/09/2017 08:16:48 PM 594 Views
Alright, let's see. - 21/09/2017 08:46:43 PM 565 Views
And yet....and yet....and yet.... - 21/09/2017 09:13:30 PM 513 Views
Now I'm curious. - 21/09/2017 09:40:32 PM 438 Views
Sure, I'll bite... - 21/09/2017 10:07:00 PM 485 Views
He's right on socialism - 25/09/2017 12:42:26 AM 476 Views
Sure, by the original meaning of the word. - 25/09/2017 05:22:50 PM 486 Views
People misuse words all the time (cf. ironic). That's their problem. - 25/09/2017 07:25:55 PM 497 Views
I'm making the argument... - 26/09/2017 07:12:56 PM 568 Views
Socialists are taking it back - 26/09/2017 08:03:39 PM 508 Views
...democratic... fascism? *NM* - 26/09/2017 08:22:36 PM 276 Views
Sure - 26/09/2017 08:32:17 PM 489 Views
It's an interesting idea. - 27/09/2017 02:19:19 AM 481 Views
Sounds like Singapore to me. *NM* - 27/09/2017 02:33:06 AM 264 Views
See, I wouldn't call Singapore democratic. - 27/09/2017 05:03:14 AM 424 Views
Did you see their hilarious presidential 'election' recently? *NM* - 27/09/2017 07:55:15 AM 311 Views
*shrug* - 27/09/2017 01:05:47 PM 450 Views
I think that's a weakness of your spectrum argument, though. - 27/09/2017 11:06:16 PM 402 Views
the non military is the further stretch - 27/09/2017 02:16:03 PM 480 Views
lol - 27/09/2017 02:37:00 PM 470 Views
Hmm. - 27/09/2017 06:52:46 PM 486 Views
Almost missed this reply, hiding down here. - 27/09/2017 09:40:41 PM 432 Views
Uh. You say no, but what follows makes it sound like yes? - 27/09/2017 11:42:11 PM 528 Views
You're again making an idiotic argument - 27/09/2017 07:25:36 PM 489 Views
Which you then did your best to prove? Thank you for that, by the way. - 27/09/2017 09:13:28 PM 527 Views
No, socialist is socialist. What is so hard about that? - 28/09/2017 05:05:27 AM 451 Views
It was a brilliant speech all around, and you don't understand Trump based on those comments. - 21/09/2017 08:32:29 PM 500 Views
He's doing jack shit. He tells people everything they want to hear, then blames Congress... - 21/09/2017 08:57:36 PM 539 Views
That's absolutely not what he's doing - 22/09/2017 09:54:34 PM 486 Views
If you say so. - 25/09/2017 05:31:00 PM 526 Views
I can see where you're coming from... - 21/09/2017 08:50:03 PM 516 Views
Oh, that people voted for him over Clinton, I can understand well enough. - 21/09/2017 09:02:50 PM 432 Views
Of course I'm going to defend him.. - 21/09/2017 09:19:32 PM 460 Views
PC is about much more than not saying things to offend people - 22/09/2017 01:26:16 PM 518 Views
It is? Like what? - 25/09/2017 06:37:01 PM 463 Views
By the by - 25/09/2017 07:23:39 PM 441 Views
That's a good point. - 26/09/2017 06:44:13 PM 426 Views
I get it.... - 26/09/2017 09:00:35 PM 412 Views
Re: It is? Like what? - 25/09/2017 08:09:53 PM 521 Views
Re: It is? Like what? - 26/09/2017 02:08:17 PM 512 Views
Trump lost credibility to me on the 'anti-PC' / 'pro free speech' issue - 26/09/2017 07:54:06 PM 421 Views
Let's hold the phone here for a moment.... - 26/09/2017 09:07:07 PM 406 Views
Too late to hold the phone! The horses are out of the barn. - 26/09/2017 09:20:06 PM 441 Views
Yeah. And not just Trump. - 26/09/2017 11:59:05 PM 408 Views
Re: Yeah. And not just Trump. - 27/09/2017 02:27:40 AM 436 Views
keep it in one thread n00b - 27/09/2017 02:52:55 AM 477 Views
Don't confuse PC with social norms - 27/09/2017 02:21:49 PM 403 Views
So... - 27/09/2017 02:39:01 PM 450 Views
and it has been very affective - 28/09/2017 12:55:06 PM 459 Views
He was in town today, stumping for Luther Strange - 23/09/2017 03:58:49 AM 513 Views
You're an Alabamian, huh? Me too! - 26/09/2017 06:05:24 PM 400 Views
I'm a Kansan, I live in 'Bama - 26/09/2017 06:19:13 PM 431 Views

Reply to Message