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Oh, there's more that I'm choosing not to say Larry Send a noteboard - 19/02/2013 06:12:02 AM
*wonders if he had the same misunderstanding about wotmania*

I didn't save mine (like some did), but I want to say I had something like just over 1 million page views (and a little over 20K posts) over the six CMBs and over 2 million page views (and around 13-14K) posts on OF, for example. For a shade over 8 years, that was on the high end on the site, I think, but compared to something like 4K posts here for nearly 4 years, the disparity is sobering enough, I suppose.

Well, I have ranted about that often enough in response TO rants about my machine gun posting: Yeah, I have posted on RAFO more than anyone (Camilla is the only one whose total is even within a couple thousand,) mostly on the CMB, but am still a hair under 10K even here, and it did NOT take me 3.5 years to reach that mark at wotmania. Even then it only took two years to get ANOTHER 20K despite getting there literally in wotmanias last days, when it was less active than ever.


I like to tease you about that, but yeah, it's not like you're approaching 50K on this board, like a couple did on the wotmania CMBs ;) But monomania in posting is never healthy, I think :P

That was Grand Central Station compared to this CMB. I have slowed way down (especially the last few months) and am only hyperactive by COMPARISON. I know there is FB and such, the BMB is RAFOs intended centerpiece and the WoTMB gets most of the action whether anyone likes it or not, but... wow.... :(


Actually, until January, the Books board was receiving more, but that's deceptive. Six active posts (I set mine at 3 days to mimic what I had it on wotmania in order to note changes better) compared to five isn't a hive of activity at most anywhere. But these are but a third or so of what I think was the norm back in 2010, around a year after the switch.

That is a little over once per week, so the answer to your question is apparently "precious few."

There's really little left to be said. The people I liked most have almost totally left this site and I suspect that might be the case for many. I'm not the same person at 38 (almost 39) as I was at 26. Probably many others feeling the same way.

Huh, we are nearly the same age then; I never realized that, and am not sure I like it, all things considered. :P


Ha! I was one of the older wotmaniacs in October 2000 when I joined. But that was the difference between 26 and 15-19 in most cases. I don't the age difference, though: it allowed me to remember why my college years were better than many :P

Looks like you are right about the rest though. Usually that is dismissed with references to dedicated social media sites that did not exist a decade and a half ago, but I do not really buy that. At the risk of idealizing something whose genesis I did not witness, wotmania stuck together because its membership developed unique qualities in it they could not find at the various geocities and similar sites. Qualities certainly not present at Facebook or MySpace, with the generic LCD aspects wotmaniacs tend to abhor. Maybe we have moved past the need or desire for that, or get as much as we need of it by staying in touch with those we met at wotmania and chose to keep in our lives on some basis. I prefer that theory to believing it general disillusionment.


There are only four people I keep in semi-regular contact with outside this site: Dunja and her sister Maja, Oscar, and miki. Lost contact with three others that were dear to me at one time. The others haven't meant enough to me to warrant more than a passing thought. C'est la vie.

But as for wotmania's earlier years, some of that may be true, but I think it was more just a place to visit between AIM/MSN Messenger for many. After October 2001, when OF began and I was soon the unofficial head of it (more like others deferred to me because I was more active and organized things), my main focus was on that section and not on the "social" aspects.

To date the site averages about 6-7,000 posts a month or about 200 a day. We've had roughly 3000 since 2013 started, just under 50 days ago so we're running just over 150 posts a day currently, down but not a lot, of course that's about what its been running at since mid-2010 anyway. Not much has been going on at the CMB of late but the other boards are busier.

If you want to compare those numbers to wotmania, I recall the OF board having something around 240K posts from October 2001-August 31, 2009. Its volume was about an eighth of the CMBs over that time and a third or so of the two WoT MBs. OF, again if I recall, would have about 20-30 active posts (at the three day setting). The four main MBs right now combined barely reach that these days. So I'd estimate the current traffic here is probably less than 10% of wotmania's in 2008-2009. Sobering, huh? :P

It would be, had I not already made pretty much the same rough estimate on a different basis; instead it is just confirmation, though still appreciated for that. Like I say, it is taking me nearly twice as long to total 10K as it did at wotmanias lowest ebb, and all but about a handful of people are still working on 5K: The number I never deigned to acknowledge at wotmania because it was too low to merit mention.


The lowest ebb was actually (once the switch from Perl to this MB format occurred in May 2001) 2001-early 2002, when there would be about 50-75% of the volume of the next 5-6 years. Last year or so of wotmania wasn't as slow as its beginning, not by a longshot (and I missed the first two years of the site, or rather the first 18 months, as I would read the posts but not register to post for nearly a year in 2000).

Oh, as for combined 2013 figures, don't forget there was a huge spike on the WoT MB for the first three weeks of January.

I had hoped for a BIT more AMoL traffic, but since TWoT has been the red headed stepchild here from the start I cannot say I am surprised.


Not as much that (although it exists) as the book itself was underwhelming in terms of discussion potential. Only so many ways one can voice disapproval over Sanderson's prose and structural choices ;)

Yeah, the other MBs have been trending up, at least relative to themselvs and the CMB, for a year or two. It definitely looks much bleaker on the CMB than elsewhere, but I remain concerned about how many non-wotmaniac RAFOlk there are, and the percentage of them who are primarily or exclusively WoTMB posters. I still think RAFO made a mistake not developing a load of WoT content as a true heir to wotmania, and using the narrow window of opportunity during the final volumes to establish RAFO in its own right. But done is done, as Thom Merrilin once said, and the final WoT book has hit the stores; for good or ill, that opportunity is gone beyond recall, and RAFO must sink or swim without it.


No, the other boards have trended down over the past year, although not by much compared to 2012 (I had just under a post a day on the Books board for 2012 and a bit less than that so far this year). I don't think the WoT content was much of a choice, considering Mike had agreed beforehand with Jason to have some of the WoT theory/chapter summary content moved to Dragonmount. That kind of discourages replication here.

But there's a larger issue than that that I'm reticent to discuss at length.

It's a listless hulk, but if you really want something to chew on in regards to "what if?", keep in mind that in the transition most of the wotmania Admin team were not retained here. Some, like myself, stayed around somewhat, but those who created the content on the WoT and OF MBs, with very few exceptions, are not active here any longer (some are at Westeros, though).

I still hope for the best, but have been increasingly convinced for a while this might prove a case of "be careful what you wish for." Shedding most wotmania Admins, Chat, WoT and "spec fic" (a term I still consider redundant) in general leaves little BUT a listless hulk. The CMB has about half RAFOs posts, and look at it. The WoTMB is next with about a third as many, but was only grudgingly included in RAFOs creation, and many will still be overjoyed to see it fade away with the last books release (90% of non-wotmaniac RAFOlk will not be pleased to see it go, which must be SOMEWHAT ominous.) The BMB, RAFOs focus, still lags slightly behind it, and the TV&MMB slightly behind that. It has about as many posts as The GMB and RPGMB combined, but that is only 27K. In 3.5 years.


If you delve deeper, you'll notice that the majority of the Books board posts are by 5-6 people. Slightly higher than that for the WoT MB. I suspect it's the same for the other boards. It would not surprise me if there are no more than 40-50 "regular" posters spread between all the MBs.

I will say the last time I checked the BMB and TV&MMBs share of RAFOs had grown significantly since the first year, but cannot be sure if that represents real growth or the CMB and WoTMBs rapid decline. I cannot help recalling the discussion a few months ago about whether maintaing the MB splits wotmania developed was wise even though RAFO has NOTHING like the same traffic. Reckon we shall see, but purging everyone and everything deemed undesirable has not exactly paid huge dividends thus far. We can preserve the interface with a different default color scheme (that was easy enough to remedy ;)) but there is a limit too how much of wotmania we can shake off our shoes and still maintain any but a superficial link to the past.


No, they've dropped (I've paid attention year to year). In 2011, for example, I had nearly 500 posts on the Books MB and that was barely in the Top 3. In 2012, I had around 350 and was the top poster.

The board splits I don't think is a major problem. The interface, however, is. If it's not "familiar" to people trying to decide which forum to join (provided that forums themselves aren't going the way of the dinosaur - Westeros, however, still seems to be as active as ever and I'm a regular on their Literature subforum), then why bother? There's no "book" hook anymore, the layout is atrocious and outdated, and the populace isn't exactly all that knowledgeable about current SF/F books as a whole. Why go here when Westeros, for example, has a more familiar layout, more features for "free," plus there are regular discussions of a wide range of books? During OF's heyday, I made sure there were regular interviews and it was a friendly place for the then-nascent book bloggers to post their reviews, mention contests, etc. Nowadays, leaving aside myself, there's only one prominent SF/F online reviewer, Adam/Werthead, who posts anything here; there is no incentive for the others to do so. I know I have to muster energy to hand-code HTML to replicate the look of my blog's reviews here; I don't have to do that elsewhere. It's just so user-unfriendly at this site.

On the other hand, shaking things off ones shoes is pretty much the exact opposite of preserving, let alone reliving, the past. Onward and upward, and hopefully we do not meet a Russian meteorite along the way. :)


Ha! Starting this week, I'm about to be a lot busier in my professional life, so there won't be much time for visits, much less reflections :P
Illusions fall like the husk of a fruit, one after another, and the fruit is experience. - Narrator, Sylvie

Je suis méchant.
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