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That's understandable but I consider doing so dangerous Isaac Send a noteboard - 05/02/2013 09:03:27 PM
i feel like i already give too much personal information out on this site so i will definitely not be giving specifics on this one. the general point i was trying to get across is the reason i take the budget battles personally, and i will leave it at that.


I can sympathize with giving out too much data here, and I am not trying to pry, merely as I said I can't rebut something without details, and I feel you exceeded what is normal acceptable for anecdotal personal reference requiring no rebuttal.

i consider subverting democracy pretty serious stuff. i don't believe in the death penalty though, so we will have to forgo the pikes for now :) but in all seriousness, i think changing the rules to not only favor the GOP but favor them in states where they have a history of winning before obama is beyond sore grapes loser and pushing into "enemy of the state" territory. if the proposal that went through VA and is working its way into PA, OH, MI and FL were pushed in states like TX, TN, KY, GA, AL and others maybe the case could be made that it is not deliberately trying to subvert the system from within.


The issue is that each state controls it's EV distribution, and they have reason to want it to have maximum impact. I'm from Ohio, as you know, it is in my state's best interest to keep itself a block, but I would rather we did not and I think most Ohioans would agree. Virginia is a swing state though, not a blue state, and any non-total allocation of EV is a good thing in my eyes. My biggest feeling is that now that everyone has felt some burn form both ends of the electoral, or at least deep worry beforehand, it may be possible to have a national discussion on the subject that goes deeper then "No change vs Popular only", and tying it to redistricting, another overdue conversation, would seem wise.

i still hold to the position that taking the economy hostage in an effort to cut entitlement programs at the expense of working families and the unemployed to give rich people more tax breaks is hardly "healthy and normal" opposition to the president's policy goals.


Hard to say we're holding hostage something most dems are convinced we totally oppose without sounding like hypocrites. I don't accuse the left of holding the coal industry hostage because I know they specifically want to maim or kill it, not use it as a bargaining chip. NASA, broad bipartisan support, can be a hostage, or the GI Bill. I would like to cut rich people's taxes, I am willing to not do that if something equally juicy is offered, that's bargaining, not hostage taking. Of course I also believe people who take hostages should be killed on principle too, like traitors, so we may be disagreeing about the flavor of the word.

as far as VAWA, i don't mind if you disagree with its applications. what i take offense to is when eric cantor says it can only apply to women who are not native americans, immigrants and gay. those are three groups whose history proves they need protection from violence, but cantor wants them excluded. why?


It's expanding VAWA, is it what it is. The left is saying it is a renewal, and a renewal probably would have passed untouched, but it isn't a renewal when you expand something's powers. VAWA does need examination though. As to immigrants, you left off something important, the GOP explicitly objects to illegal immigrants in the provision, not immigrants. As to the Native Americans, I will explain that. The adaptation would give Tribal Authorities jurisdiction over non-Native Americans on Tribal lands. I do not believe I could support allowing a tribal authority to hold a trial on someone accused of rape while visiting a casino. I won't rule it out at all, but that is not something to be done casually and jurisdiction needs serious consideration, but delay over concerns of the impact of changes apparently merits accusation of hostage taking. You're implying racism here but to be honest I don't think you ever looked at the GOP argument, just the accusations at us.

perhaps so. i know we are probably both wasting our time in this back and forth and it still doesn't change anything in the grand scheme of things. for that reason, i am going to give you the last word if you want to take it. i will read whatever you post in reply, but i won't be responding here again.


I appreciate the last word, I've tried not to take unfair advantage of that and will not hold you to it if you feel obliged to respond. So you know though, I do not consider this wasted breath, my goal is not to change your mind on party affiliation merely to convince you that the GOP is not acting as the vast dark, treacherous, irrational apparatus you're convinced it is. I feel I've cast light on some of our actions indicating they are logical and rational even if you disagree about them being right, and that is sufficient for me.
The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
- Albert Einstein

King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
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That's understandable but I consider doing so dangerous - 05/02/2013 09:03:27 PM 492 Views
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