Your argument fails.
Fetus lives inside another conscious living person. Living people do not live inside another conscious living organism. Earth's atmosphere is not a conscious living organism.
A different question - what about the self-defense, stand your ground viewpoint? You have the right to evict a home invader, even if they would freeze to death or starve otherwise. You use deadly force to someone who threatens you with bodily harm.
And innocent - everyone is innocent. Are they not? I don't understand why that's important. The woman who died was innocent also. Pregnant women are innocent.
I understand and accept that you put the moral emphasis on the mother, I just don't agree with you.
Stand your ground does not apply if your invite someone into your home. The VAST majority of abortions are performed after voluntary sex. When you choose to have sex, you choose to risk pregnancy, that is how it works. Innocent of what? The child is not yet capable of independent performance of action, and thus can be nothing but innocent. Whereas the mother has had a lifetime to make bad (whatever moral evaluation you wish to apply) choices/actions. Again, check a dictionary.
It's odd the place a higher moral value on a creature incapable of reasoning or action, as if being unconscious were a virtue. It's the opposite - consciousness and reason are how we define humanity.
Next, I absolutely do no accept the risk of pregnancy when I have sex. I need to have sex for my physical and mental well being, to be happy and fulfilled in life, it is absolutely essential. It is against my religion to be celibate or pregnant.
Further, when I get into the car, I do not accept the risk of dying in an accident. And driving is much more of an option than having sex. When I eat, I do not accept the risk of getting e.coli. Especially in the way you seem to mean "accept the risk" - not be given a chance to mitigate or control the consequences. I do not relinquish control over my life because I had sex.i still have a right to choose how I live.
But back to the "innocent plant" viewpoint, I find it very curious. Do plants have higher value than humans because they are unable of independent action or thinking?
Furthermore, (giving you further cause to disagree with me) I don't believe that their should be a rape exemption. Why do we execute the baby, when we won't execute the rapist?
At the time that the rapist has a part of his body inside of mine, I am justified to use any method including deadly force, to defend the sanctity of my body, to protect it from unwelcome invasion.
An unwanted pregnancy is also an unwelcome invasion. And no, by having sex, I didn't open up my body to anything else that might come. If you use your credit card at a store, you do not give them permission to charge it again without your authorization, even though the risk is there. When I eat a sandwich which might have tapeworm eggs on it, even if i know there's a risk, I do not consent to carrying tapeworms in my body. And even though the tapeworm is innocent, I have a right to protect my body, before and after the invasion.
woman dies after doctors deny her a life-saving abortion
14/11/2012 06:58:31 PM
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this is so terribly sad. keeping abortions legal is important. *NM*
14/11/2012 07:09:00 PM
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Well, I guess to expedite the process of argument and counter-argument, I'll post an article an
14/11/2012 07:28:01 PM
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you're right, i should have posted the actual article instead of an editorial. thanks!
14/11/2012 08:14:42 PM
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so terrible... i will never understand how this crap is considered "pro-life." *NM*
15/11/2012 01:15:56 AM
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Maybe this is more a testament to the quality of care in that hospital than an arguemnt for abortion *NM*
15/11/2012 01:49:00 PM
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Can you elaborate?
16/11/2012 04:07:48 PM
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Do you have access to her medical charts?
16/11/2012 08:44:45 PM
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The infection was from the fetus inside of her. That is not disputed.
16/11/2012 10:14:52 PM
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This wasn't pro-life, but more a case of anti-thinking
15/11/2012 06:28:55 PM
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but the pro-life (or anti-abortion) argument was the reason they gave for not allowing an abortion
15/11/2012 10:00:14 PM
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Once you know for certain that the mother is dying, it is too late.
16/11/2012 04:11:25 PM
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Statistically speaking...
15/11/2012 07:03:51 PM
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Psst.
15/11/2012 09:43:35 PM
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Re: Statistically speaking...
15/11/2012 10:56:35 PM
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Where's the due process?
15/11/2012 11:35:39 PM
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First, prove that the fetus is a "ONE".
16/11/2012 04:14:34 PM
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That argument is specious
16/11/2012 08:36:07 PM
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But you cannot call another living person an "environment." Only for parasites.
16/11/2012 10:16:18 PM
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Yes I can, look up the word environment
17/11/2012 11:49:55 AM
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No, I do not accept the risk of pregnancy.
20/11/2012 01:41:07 PM
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Win some, lose some
15/11/2012 11:29:32 PM
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Some facts for you - from the article Stephen linked in his reply above, and from general knowledge.
16/11/2012 09:38:32 PM
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That is the most rational argument put forth thus far, HOWEVER
17/11/2012 07:06:58 PM
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Wow.
17/11/2012 07:28:23 PM
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Nah, I don't *try* to insult anyone (most of the time) , though I seem to do so fairly regularly. *NM*
18/11/2012 07:41:43 PM
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Re: That is the most rational argument put forth thus far, HOWEVER
17/11/2012 08:07:19 PM
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Nice decision to turn to insults. Print out your post and let it join your head, up your ass.
18/11/2012 07:50:18 PM
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The difference between Ireland and the UK is about 0.006%
17/11/2012 08:31:45 PM
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It illustrates that the "life of the mother" argument is rare to the point of irrelevance. *NM*
18/11/2012 07:45:36 PM
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And yet this case makes it irrefutably relevant. *NM*
20/11/2012 05:18:23 PM
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No, it really does not. Because the situation is so rare as to not be worth even discussing...
21/11/2012 03:24:01 PM
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In your opinion - in mine, and I suspect others here, it is not.
22/11/2012 12:03:20 AM
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I am not debating opinion, you can't debate opinion, I am trying to point out facts.
22/11/2012 05:29:24 PM
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