Fair enough then; the NFLs official position is that offensive PI should have been called.
Joel Send a noteboard - 26/09/2012 04:45:58 AM
tate says he did not push off. we see how much *his* word is worth as well
Shields lost his footing and went down, which makes it look worse than it was, but the contact only occurred because Shields moved into Tate as the latter prepared to catch the ball. No one who moves into another player who is looking for the ball will get a PI call in their favor, whether they go fall or not.
shields lost his footing because tate pushed him. even the NFL head office acknowledges that much...
Not disputing, just asking.
"While the ball is in the air, Tate can be seen shoving Green Bay cornerback Sam Shields to the ground. This should have been a penalty for offensive pass interference, which would have ended the game. It was not called and is not reviewable in instant replay."
I disagree, but it is a judgement call, and the Leagues judgement, not mine, is that applicable. Yet I also note the League statement cites this rule near the end:
"Player Going to the Ground. If a player goes to the ground in the act of catching a pass (with or without contact by an opponent), he must maintain control of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground, whether in the field of play or the end zone. If he loses control of the ball, and the ball touches the ground before he regains control, the pass is incomplete. If he regains control prior to the ball touching the ground, the pass is complete."
I submit that had Jennings maintained control throughout the process of contacting the ground Tate would not have had the ball at the end of the play. In particular, it is not clear from the replay WHEN Jennings contacted the ground with anything other than his feet (and thus when he should have been considered down if, in fact, he were ruled to have intercepted the pass.) Even IF the catch were intercepted (which is obviously debatable because it is still debated,) a legal strip would REMAIN possible unless/until Jennings were ruled down.
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This message last edited by Joel on 26/09/2012 at 04:47:46 AM
/NFL: now that replacement refs have cost the packers a win, can we please get the real ones back? *NM*
25/09/2012 05:14:58 AM
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Link? Clip?
25/09/2012 05:27:07 AM
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Let's just say that Gruden used the word "Jobbed" in the live telecast. *NM*
25/09/2012 05:35:08 AM
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Here's a link.
25/09/2012 05:36:56 AM
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Yes and no; that is the link I referenced in my post.
25/09/2012 05:47:07 AM
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youtube link
25/09/2012 07:00:29 AM
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Thanks; that looks like a textbook case of simultaneous possession, which goes to the receiver: TD.
25/09/2012 07:29:28 AM
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pete carroll is a cheating douchebag, you cannot take his word for what happened
25/09/2012 10:59:33 AM
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I did not; I watched the clip: Simultaneous possession, which goes to the receiver.
26/09/2012 01:30:18 AM
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watch a better replay if you can
26/09/2012 02:38:17 AM
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Have now; still not convinced.
26/09/2012 04:01:23 AM
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also, the pass interference on tate that wasn't called is clear at 0:56 in that clip
25/09/2012 11:27:36 AM
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Tate was looking for the ball, and raised his hands to catch it, not push off Sam Shields.
26/09/2012 01:33:46 AM
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watch a better replay and get back to me on this one.
26/09/2012 02:36:43 AM
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Where did the NFL head office acknowledge that?
26/09/2012 03:52:36 AM
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in their official response to the whole incident....?
26/09/2012 04:14:52 AM
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Fair enough then; the NFLs official position is that offensive PI should have been called.
26/09/2012 04:45:58 AM
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Yeah, if one hand counts as possession
25/09/2012 05:15:37 PM
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Left hand between Jennings' arms and on the ball; right was outside Jennings' arm and on the ball.
26/09/2012 01:38:28 AM
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How have you not seen this play? Are you in a cave? *NM*
25/09/2012 03:57:55 PM
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No, I am in Norway, where NFL coverage is rather limited.
26/09/2012 01:40:07 AM
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While you can hardly blame the replacement refs because they are basically trainees...
25/09/2012 06:05:22 AM
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Now I really want to see this play.
25/09/2012 06:27:42 AM
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Re: Now I really want to see this play.
25/09/2012 02:48:56 PM
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I have still only seen the YouTube clip, but it looked like they both had both hands on the ball.
26/09/2012 01:58:27 AM
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You might appreciate learning that the Lingerie Football League fired some of these refs
25/09/2012 07:19:37 AM
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Tie goes to the receiver - the rule for decades. The Packers benefitted from worse calls last year
25/09/2012 11:31:47 AM
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you probably think greedo shot first too.....
25/09/2012 01:49:03 PM
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Possession doesn't mean squat until you land. Tate had it by then
25/09/2012 03:13:29 PM
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he had nothing until they landed and he tried to pull it away. everyone but you agrees on this *NM*
25/09/2012 03:25:43 PM
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Not so; Cannoli and I agree on pretty much every point involved in this play.
26/09/2012 02:17:01 AM
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They can't reverse that call.
25/09/2012 04:43:28 PM
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the only possible way was to rule it incomplete
25/09/2012 10:42:25 PM
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It was very obviously caught; you can't rule that incomplete.
25/09/2012 11:06:17 PM
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my philosophy is "interception = incomplete" but i think that's only for stats purposes
26/09/2012 12:32:43 AM
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Congrats Cannoli, you are the only person (thing?) in the country who thinks it's a TD *NM*
25/09/2012 03:53:18 PM
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I'm not even the only person in this thread, moron. *NM*
25/09/2012 04:07:48 PM
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Joel hasn't even seen the play, douchebag *NM*
25/09/2012 04:12:35 PM
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I have seen enough of it, and while I did not write Cannolis response, I easily could have.
26/09/2012 02:06:45 AM
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Slightly (very) loopy yet entertaining piece on why Ayn Rand is to blame for all of this.
25/09/2012 05:38:12 PM
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She hates revenue sharing, salary caps & the draft, too, but the Pack would be screwed without each.
26/09/2012 03:34:00 AM
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Here's the proof Cannoli is refusing to see
25/09/2012 05:54:07 PM
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Clearer shot, but stills do not allow us to see where Tates hands were at all times.
26/09/2012 02:10:25 AM
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you can't claim "good ol' strip" *AND* simultaneous catch -- which is it?
26/09/2012 02:35:41 AM
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I do not claim both: I claim simultaneous catch but IF not, then strip.
26/09/2012 03:51:47 AM
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you sure you saw the right replay?
26/09/2012 04:21:57 AM
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Think so, yeah.
26/09/2012 04:58:15 AM
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from another angle -- pun intended
26/09/2012 04:01:54 PM
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There are two separate issues: 1) Was it a simultaneous catch; 2) IF not, was it a strip?
27/09/2012 08:54:52 AM
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your opinion is against pretty much everyone in the world, so..... *shrug*
27/09/2012 03:55:33 PM
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Thanks; I did not expect you to give in so easily.
27/09/2012 10:14:30 PM
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did you even read that article???
28/09/2012 12:35:39 AM
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"his control wasn’t established again...."
28/09/2012 01:08:03 AM
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wow, what a thorough analysis you sent me either way, you're still wrong
28/09/2012 02:05:24 AM
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Worst calls are made all the time by the regular officials.
26/09/2012 01:23:57 AM
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yes, but not usually more than one per game, certainly not several in a single weekend.... *NM*
26/09/2012 02:39:56 AM
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