Fine, we will start there: You may not think any American politician stupid or ruthless enough to advocate a wall with guards shooting at those approaching it, but less than a minute googling turned up a US Congressman and a city council candidate advocating just that (though I am unsure how a city council candidate in WA expects the power to put guards using lethal force on the border with Mexico, nearly 2000 miles from his jurisdiction.) Cain has not QUITE gone that far; he has only advocated an electric fence with "a sign on the other side saying, 'It will kill you -- Warning.'" When called on that comment later, Cain said it was just a joke--just as he did this past summer when people objected to him making the same statement. Reminds me of that Simpsons episode where Krusty ran for Congress: "It's a JOKE; when you give me that look, it's a joke! " Yeah, right; one can only make the same policy statement at so many political rallies before people are entitled to think it is a serious policy statement, even from someone who does not have anything against foreign doctors (but does not wish to be treated by one.)


Hey, East Germans (and other Warsaw Pact citizens) could legally cross from East to West Berlin, just as West Germans and other Western citizens could cross the other way, with the permission of the East German government. Granted, people headed west found that permission very difficult to obtain, but that is kind of the idea behind most of the anti-immigration legislation. Personally, I agree with most of Cains comment that he wants to "make it easy for people to come through the front door" and "shut off the back door so you don't have to sneak into America." Where I differ with him is that I do not think people HAVE to sneak into America because it is too easy to do so, but because we make it so expensive, time consuming and otherwise difficult that many consider illegal entry their only viable option. Oh, and in not wanting to kill people who make that choice; I think preventing illegal entry when possible and deporting illegal immigrants when it is not is a lot better option.


Obviously I should; you said you do not think any American politician would advocate guards shooting illegal immigrants even though it took me seconds to find a Congressman and another politician advocating just that, and Cain himself has twice said he wants a lethal electrified fence. Think what you like, but I am really not making up any of this.


Your point was clear, yes, but European polling on the two is not clear to me from your reference to it. The details matter and, IMHO, are applicable in this thread. I oppose gay marriage (but not civil unions,) both as an article of faith and because I oppose any government role in what is a matter of faith for me and many others. I do NOT support granting heterosexual couples legal recognition of their commitment while denying it to homosexual couples, because that is discriminatory. Likewise, I oppose illegal immigration; you may recall that I fully support deporting all illegal immigrants the moment they are apprehended. I do NOT support lethal walls or fences to prevent illegal immigration. Those are both far too extreme for me; they are discriminatory and compromise peoples civil rights (particularly the lethal border wall.) I certainly wish all the GOP presidential candidates agreed with me on that, but Cains statements alone demonstrate that is not the case.