Active Users:1201 Time:22/11/2024 09:42:55 PM
That seems more like Gores old "I do not believe in unilateral disarmament" argument. Joel Send a noteboard - 11/11/2011 08:58:44 AM
I cannot recall an instance of a corporation lobbying for the government to have more power; their record is one of lobbying for just the opposite.


Corporations regularly support regulations and lobby for news ones, sometimes with the best of motives too... even barring obvious good/bad like pushing for a new regulation that might constrain competitors, a coal, solar, or nuclear power corporation might cheerfully encourage and lobby for noise/safety regulation on windmills, and they as a group minus coal might be only too happy to favor carbon taxes and restrictions, minus coal. Various light bulb manufacturers can and have pressed for restrictions on classic bulbs in favor of CFL and raised dread specters and pushed for regulation on LEDs as some contain tiny amounts of lead. A paper recycling plant might favor and lobby for increased restrictions on timber harvesting, ditto can recyclers on the mining industry, as in both cases their own cost remain the same but their products are more competitive. Clothing, shoes, building materials all have various alternatives which might be considered more or less 'green' and increased regulation of that nature allows those in say, cotton or wool, to be more competitive with synthetic fibers or even leather, with cows farting so much carbon. I can cite you examples if you'd like, though I tihnk you'd concede the point as common sense. Even companies who will themselves, as opposed to their competitors, be hit with a regulation might favor it if they can raise their prices initially to cover the new fees then streamline compliance and never get around to lowering prices appropriately, "Oh, your phone bill will cost $2.00 more a month for compliance with regs" and down the line as they streamline that cost to, say, $1.50, keep that fifty cents or benefit as a smaller competitor who streamlines can't cut down below, say, $1.75, becomes less competitive... so yes corporations often do favor regulation increases. Nor would this always be sinister, some company with ethics might replant trees after they harvest them and take efforts to minimize ecological damage and soil erosion, voluntarily or because of local regs, but a competitor of theirs with less ethics or less restrictions might not, and they'd naturally favor regs requiring the same efforts they put in, particularly since they'd have already streamlined compliance and their competitor will likely see a large temporary cost increase above what they themselves pay to comply.

If you are unfamiliar with it, that was Gores response when challenged to explain why he used (a lot of) soft money during the 2000 campaign even as the Clinton administration pushed to restrict soft money: It is unethical but legal, and competitors will continue using it so long as that remains true, so idealistically refusing to follow suit only disadvantages oneself without reforming the system. Ironically, the same type of argument often discourages companies from ceasing unscrupulous behavior that is the industry norm: If it is legal to dump toxic waste in the nearest river, a company subjecting itself to the expense of responsible disposal only incurs a cost not born by its competitors without improving industry standards at all. The argument is obviously very self-serving, and industries lobbying for regulations against alternatives undermine the larger industry argument against all regulation in much the same way Gore undercut his argument against soft money.

Consequently, while industries do occasionally push for greater regulations on each other (irrespective of my inability to recall a specific instance,) I contend that is the exception rather than the rule. When it does occur, it is invariably a case of an industry flexing its inherent power via government means; removing the government means would preserve that power, which would continue being employed in the myriad other forms already extant. beetnemesis core premise (or rather, the one linked) that government is simply a tool for enacting regulations on behalf of corporations, and that restricting the former would thus restrict the latter, is unsound. The best evidence for that is, once again (and as you well know,) that the principal critics of government regulation are those same corporations. That they on occasion use their lobbyist influence to target each other in no way lessens their general hatred of regulation or the enthusiasm with which they would abolish it entirely if they could.

The caveat to that is that large corporations HAVE been able to abolish enforcement against any industry large enough to finance a lobby, and there the argument has more merit. Small businesses are very much burdened by regulation, often unfairly, because they lack the immunity their larger competitors enjoy. Those businesses obvoiusly do not lobby for regulations of any kind, because they lack the surplus capital to lobby for anything, which is precisely the problem. Essentially, they meet the regulatory burden large corporations shirk in much the way the middle class meets the taxation burden the upper class shirks. In both cases, the groups evading their legal responsibilities can therefore easily convince those who cannot evade them that no such responsibility should exist, but in neither case does the ability of a small powerful elite to ignore the law validate their contention that the law itself is wrong.
Honorbound and honored to be Bonded to Mahtaliel Sedai
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.

Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!

LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
Reply to message
Great visual summary of the differences between the Tea Party and Occupy Wall Street - 31/10/2011 02:59:18 PM 861 Views
I hear OSWers suggest dumping the Constitution about as often as Tea Partiers suggest fixing govt. - 31/10/2011 08:01:39 PM 643 Views
That's a touch questionable - 31/10/2011 09:49:09 PM 589 Views
The subject line? I disagree (obviously. ) - 31/10/2011 11:23:57 PM 750 Views
Re: The subject line? I disagree (obviously. ) - 01/11/2011 12:29:50 AM 740 Views
Re: The subject line? I disagree (obviously. ) - 11/11/2011 08:29:52 AM 776 Views
I think that this image actually is the best- short and to the point - 01/11/2011 01:24:23 AM 632 Views
LIKE *NM* - 01/11/2011 01:46:22 AM 191 Views
Very, very good. *NM* - 01/11/2011 12:01:17 PM 210 Views
I like that one. *NM* - 01/11/2011 12:54:45 PM 211 Views
I disagree. - 03/11/2011 08:44:54 PM 523 Views
That's just wrong, factually in error from the get go - 03/11/2011 09:47:28 PM 538 Views
That seems more like Gores old "I do not believe in unilateral disarmament" argument. - 11/11/2011 08:58:44 AM 512 Views

Reply to Message