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Re: I'm satisfied by that explanation. Gher Send a noteboard - 07/10/2011 07:45:29 PM
Those are really good answers. Both that telling someone now doesn't necessarily use up their chance, and that you want to tell them now because you want to and because you believe they will be happier and more fulfilled in this life as a result, regardless of the afterlife.

Oh Gosh it's not about what I've done and my worth. It's almost funny, that's almost exactly backwards. I was christian for a fairly decent period of time and I made a choice to turn away from Christ, as you'd say it. Not a decision made lightly or suddenly.

My behavior didn't change, it's not like a story from a teen bible study group where the lapsed christian uses drugs and risky behavior to fill the void in his/her soul. Couldn't be further from the truth. In fact, I've never ever tried any recreational drugs. I have drank alcohol but not much and not very often. I almost never drank in high school and rarely in college and now I'm probably in the heyday of my drinking days but realistically I have alcohol an average of once a month.

Hahaha, I just googled what else mormons don't allow and guess what- I would have no problem with a coffee ban because I don't drink it anyway. I'm also not gay so I'd have no problem with not being gay. I have had premarital sex but I mean, I'm 25- if I hadn't at this point it would certainly be my new year's resolution to fix that. Oh! Also- I almost never curse and I don't like it when I'm around people that do. If I feel comfortable and I want to spend more time with someone who curses a lot I'll ask him or her to try to curse less. [And I dislike it for many reasons- for one thing people don't realize you're angry or upset unless you curse but that's a whole other topic]

Not that I think any of the above define a person's "worth"! I've only addressed those points because that's what came up with google. The point is, it's not about anything I've done that makes me unworthy or scared. The point is I simply don't believe. I just cannot be sincere in praying to God or asking for forgiveness/help. If it's real- if there is an all powerful God out there- I don't love him with any part of my heart.

Numerous edits because I tried to fix the quote thing and then I thought of the cursing thing.


I'm sorry, my question was badly worded. I didn't mean to come off as so holier-than-though or condescending. It was just your use of the phrase, "Not that it would help me..." that got my attention. I've heard that a lot, people thinking they've done something terrible and don't "deserve" forgiveness, that's it's just not for them. That is never true.

And I'll just leave off by saying: If you want to believe, and want to be sincere, fake it for a while. Pretend like you believe. If you don't feel sincere when you pray, just try to be sincere. I think if you show the desire, it helps. And not because you find what you wanted to find.

Just my thoughts.
"And it breaks my heart to look around, and see the unimpressed; who can't believe the emperor is dressed"~Fastball
2-7-1
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Mormons CaptainHammer - 03/10/2011 05:46:10 AM 2460 Views
Questions. Kuke - 03/10/2011 11:13:25 AM 1201 Views
Ooh! Ooh! Kuke - 03/10/2011 11:18:38 AM 1068 Views
I don't watch it. Gher - 04/10/2011 01:34:53 AM 1078 Views
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Re: Questions. CaptainHammer - 03/10/2011 01:31:13 PM 1008 Views
I don't understand why they would be called drinks, if they were not meant to be drunk. aerocontrols - 03/10/2011 03:28:48 PM 1103 Views
Why did I look up what Quorn is? I didn't need to know that. *NM* beetnemesis - 03/10/2011 02:04:20 PM 655 Views
Wyld Stallyns!! aerocontrols - 03/10/2011 03:26:54 PM 986 Views
STATION! *NM* Two Wongs - 03/10/2011 11:00:35 PM 590 Views
Re: One of the best replies, ever, on the internet. *NM* Gaps - 06/10/2011 02:43:07 AM 640 Views
....did we just get door-to-door'd...ONLINE?!?! *NM* LadyLorraine - 03/10/2011 11:34:19 AM 612 Views
Nope. Gher - 04/10/2011 01:32:43 AM 1052 Views
there's no real point to it LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 02:37:24 AM 2074 Views
We could use an evil cackling smilie, we do have some other evil ones Isaac - 04/10/2011 02:49:12 AM 1011 Views
wasn't going to argue... *NM* LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 02:57:00 AM 584 Views
Do you ever giggle at the name "Moroni?" Ghavrel - 03/10/2011 11:39:55 AM 1119 Views
There are Mormon literalists? Seriously? *NM* Legolas - 03/10/2011 03:02:18 PM 600 Views
In fairness, I wonder the same about Christian literalists. *NM* Ghavrel - 03/10/2011 07:57:19 PM 626 Views
Yeah, but if you're gonna believe absurdities... Legolas - 03/10/2011 09:02:32 PM 1108 Views
Are you trying to suggest that "Reformed" or some other brand of scientology is plausible? Joel - 04/10/2011 04:28:40 PM 1071 Views
Actually, no. It'd be like laughing at... Hosea. Or Nemeiah. It's just an old name. Gher - 04/10/2011 12:30:57 AM 1032 Views
I know they don't have multiple wives anymore, so no misconception there ironclad - 03/10/2011 01:23:50 PM 1036 Views
There are Fundamentalist "Mormons" who do... Danu - 03/10/2011 11:32:56 PM 957 Views
Don't get me wrong by the way, I've met wonderful Mormons ironclad - 04/10/2011 12:22:03 PM 1015 Views
Question: Why are you such a faggot? *NM* Urza - 03/10/2011 02:23:45 PM 506 Views
Answer: because it's the only way he could return your burning love for him. Nate - 03/10/2011 03:24:23 PM 728 Views
Oh dont be such a fuddy duddy. Urza - 03/10/2011 10:42:06 PM 640 Views
Better a faggot than a fuckwad. Cheers fuckwad! *NM* everynametaken - 04/10/2011 01:27:20 AM 627 Views
Well, I suppose you'ld be the one to know. *NM* Urza - 04/10/2011 01:54:35 AM 556 Views
Really? You really just pulled a "takes one to know one"? *NM* Kronin al'Sulc - 04/10/2011 04:19:22 PM 658 Views
Re: You embarrass yourself. *NM* Gaps - 04/10/2011 01:56:02 AM 510 Views
I'll tell you whats embarresing... Urza - 04/10/2011 02:08:02 AM 846 Views
That is hilarious. Nate - 04/10/2011 03:10:50 AM 729 Views
Goodness.. Urza - 04/10/2011 03:20:30 AM 661 Views
Re: Nate - 04/10/2011 03:28:25 AM 697 Views
You know, my mother had a saying. Urza - 04/10/2011 03:39:32 AM 737 Views
I think it's safe to say ... Nate - 04/10/2011 04:09:17 AM 635 Views
I'm not sure which would be sadder... Legolas - 04/10/2011 11:32:55 AM 772 Views
*NM* ironclad - 04/10/2011 12:19:01 PM 594 Views
Re: You flatter me. *NM* Gaps - 04/10/2011 01:31:01 PM 620 Views
OK, you need to delete the "Re:" You're using it incorrectly beetnemesis - 04/10/2011 01:55:53 PM 652 Views
"Re" doesn't have to mean "reply", it can also mean "regarding". Legolas - 04/10/2011 02:01:31 PM 677 Views
Re: Re: Gaps - 04/10/2011 02:06:58 PM 679 Views
Re: Re: Stephen - 04/10/2011 02:12:57 PM 648 Views
Re: Also. Gaps - 04/10/2011 02:08:15 PM 689 Views
you are still using it incorrectly. *NM* LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 02:09:48 PM 632 Views
He's doing it on purpose though. Nate - 04/10/2011 03:31:39 PM 759 Views
Re: Yeah, it's just a shtick... Gaps - 04/10/2011 03:47:17 PM 650 Views
Those were the good old days. Nate - 04/10/2011 04:02:33 PM 666 Views
*NM* TaskmasterJack - 04/10/2011 10:02:30 PM 573 Views
I agree, it's driving me nuts *NM* ironclad - 04/10/2011 02:36:45 PM 562 Views
That's not quite right, actually. Nate - 04/10/2011 03:25:54 PM 586 Views
Disagree. *NM* TaskmasterJack - 04/10/2011 10:04:09 PM 594 Views
Considering that "CaptainHammer" is LDS, I'd rather doubt he's gay. Great Lord of Chaos - 04/10/2011 02:32:56 AM 627 Views
Re: Considering that "CaptainHammer" is LDS, I'd rather doubt he's gay. Urza - 04/10/2011 02:37:41 AM 656 Views
Heh. Oh, Ryan. Kronin al'Sulc - 04/10/2011 04:36:43 PM 768 Views
*sigh* to all of you above.... LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 03:06:21 AM 671 Views
I thought that was "Do not talk about /b/"? *NM* Great Lord of Chaos - 04/10/2011 03:12:52 AM 653 Views
i don't know, but if THAT is the first rule... LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 03:41:20 AM 624 Views
Please explain why you think we should consider you Christians. Tom - 03/10/2011 04:33:06 PM 1197 Views
you know, that does make me wonder though LadyLorraine - 03/10/2011 04:58:21 PM 1091 Views
We're not as immovable as we are sometimes portrayed. Dannymac - 03/10/2011 05:27:17 PM 1071 Views
"Even Christ didn't do that"? I can't agree. Legolas - 03/10/2011 09:00:34 PM 1058 Views
I conceded your last point. Dannymac - 03/10/2011 10:14:28 PM 952 Views
Point of Anal Retentive Dissent: Joel - 04/10/2011 03:54:00 PM 974 Views
That concept is alien to the Christian theological understanding, however. Tom - 03/10/2011 10:18:55 PM 1066 Views
I understand what both you and Danny are saying LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 12:19:57 AM 1010 Views
Oh, that's very simple Tom - 04/10/2011 04:02:24 AM 1029 Views
I honestly don't know what it would take. Dannymac - 04/10/2011 07:41:55 AM 1028 Views
thank you, both of you LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 01:46:05 PM 1015 Views
I love the Nicene Creed. It is such an excellent encapsulation. Rebekah - 03/10/2011 06:07:53 PM 1104 Views
Agreed. Joel - 04/10/2011 04:44:49 PM 978 Views
The absolute best part about your post (plus the best thing about Mo's/LDS's) Jeordam - 03/10/2011 09:02:17 PM 1050 Views
Glad you enjoyed it Tom - 03/10/2011 10:10:39 PM 1137 Views
Though they can cause interesting changes in patterns. Dannymac - 03/10/2011 10:16:55 PM 1068 Views
We believe that Jesus Christ is the Savior of all mankind, and the only way back to God. Gher - 04/10/2011 01:29:30 AM 1126 Views
If you think the Book of Mormon was well-written, there is really little left to discuss. Tom - 04/10/2011 03:57:08 AM 1297 Views
I never said well-written, I said complex. Gher - 04/10/2011 07:04:24 AM 1175 Views
Ignore facts all you want to. Tom - 05/10/2011 01:07:35 AM 1069 Views
Re: If you think the Book of Mormon was well-written, there is really little left to discuss. CaptainHammer - 04/10/2011 07:24:27 AM 1267 Views
Woah nelly. Ghavrel - 04/10/2011 10:04:33 AM 1070 Views
I have to "Wow" as well... racist much? LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 01:52:48 PM 1000 Views
Re: I have to "Wow" as well... racist much? CaptainHammer - 04/10/2011 04:42:47 PM 1106 Views
oh well that makes it all better... LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 04:54:14 PM 1111 Views
Exactly ironclad - 04/10/2011 06:00:54 PM 1011 Views
Was the twin banging and the gay wedding the same event? Joel - 04/10/2011 06:36:03 PM 1091 Views
Yikes. Even for religion, that's more than a little crazy. Nate - 04/10/2011 03:47:56 PM 1083 Views
I don't think there's much of a difference in crazy as opposed to other more mainstream religions. Vivien - 04/10/2011 07:08:06 PM 1055 Views
A difference exists if only in continued unabashed affirmation of a rather distasteful doctrine. Joel - 04/10/2011 11:06:51 PM 1042 Views
Then why can't women be priests? Or enter the altar? The curse on Eve is very much in place. *NM* Aeryn - 05/10/2011 12:27:04 AM 566 Views
OK, within the Mormon context I can see that point. Joel - 05/10/2011 12:33:52 AM 992 Views
They can in quite a few denominations. *NM* Ghavrel - 05/10/2011 06:12:35 AM 619 Views
Whoops! You meant in LDS specifically. My mistake. *NM* Ghavrel - 05/10/2011 06:14:05 AM 581 Views
Right now I am not making an absolute statement but a relative one. Vivien - 05/10/2011 08:37:50 PM 838 Views
Yes, that is kind of the problem. Joel - 06/10/2011 12:13:27 AM 1011 Views
Oh, you didn't know? Joe Smith said black people are cursed for following Satan. Tom - 05/10/2011 01:10:35 AM 1034 Views
I guess this is a variation on Hams punishment; Ghav, at least should know better than to be shocked Joel - 04/10/2011 04:13:59 PM 979 Views
it's not that we're surprised because it's "novel" LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 04:19:16 PM 1020 Views
It is not NECESSARILY racist. Joel - 04/10/2011 04:39:33 PM 1037 Views
Sure, except ... Nate - 04/10/2011 04:50:53 PM 1069 Views
Well, the funny thing is Christian doctrine presupposes everyone, along with their ancestors... Joel - 04/10/2011 06:31:13 PM 961 Views
Yeah, circular logic is fun, isn't it? Tom - 05/10/2011 01:09:25 AM 993 Views
It it is nigh impossible to be a "non-Nicene Christian." Joel - 04/10/2011 03:12:06 PM 1074 Views
I think we've had this discussion before. Gher - 06/10/2011 05:54:39 PM 1069 Views
Arianism is a bad comparison for arguing LDS=Christian. Joel - 06/10/2011 11:45:36 PM 952 Views
Wikipedia confirms what I already thought: you're off base with the monophysitism. Legolas - 07/10/2011 12:06:40 AM 1308 Views
I had not realized it was that late, but used it only as an example of multitudinous controversies. Joel - 07/10/2011 01:03:56 AM 1403 Views
Monophysites, miaphysites, monothelites, etc. certainly accept the consubstantiality of God/Christ Larry - 07/10/2011 11:58:05 AM 998 Views
Virtually everyone has a more sound Christology than Mormons. Tom - 07/10/2011 06:45:45 PM 1054 Views
Your ideas intrigue me and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter. Joel - 08/10/2011 05:30:38 PM 1066 Views
I can see that with the Monothelites (can see their appeal, in fact,) but not Monophysites. Joel - 07/10/2011 09:43:27 PM 967 Views
Tempting as it is to prove Joel wrong (since he so frequently is), I need to take issue with this. Tom - 07/10/2011 06:59:13 PM 1049 Views
I was just saying there were competing views. Gher - 07/10/2011 07:49:26 PM 1434 Views
Oh, there were definitely competing views, just not competing Christian views. Joel - 07/10/2011 09:26:22 PM 949 Views
That sounds really nice. Vivien - 04/10/2011 06:38:29 PM 1029 Views
Why wait though? Joel - 05/10/2011 12:12:21 AM 1198 Views
So that Vivien can avoid reading and thinking about the stuff that you just wrote. *NM* Aeryn - 05/10/2011 12:28:23 AM 545 Views
Ack, not reading and thinking111 Joel - 05/10/2011 12:36:11 AM 1018 Views
I really want an answer from a mormon. Vivien - 05/10/2011 08:48:49 PM 1049 Views
Good luck with that; just because I can see no explanation save that I offered does not preclude one Joel - 06/10/2011 07:03:50 AM 956 Views
Yeah, that's what I thought. Gher - 06/10/2011 05:43:57 PM 950 Views
I'm satisfied by that explanation. Vivien - 06/10/2011 08:51:15 PM 1191 Views
Re: I'm satisfied by that explanation. Gher - 07/10/2011 07:45:29 PM 1031 Views
Oh no you idn't... *waves finger and weaves head* everynametaken - 04/10/2011 03:53:07 AM 861 Views
....i don't know what you look like LadyLorraine - 04/10/2011 03:54:56 AM 992 Views
Shoot, my Mick Jagger strut is way better than my angry hispanic girl head/finger bob and weave. *NM* everynametaken - 05/10/2011 04:58:53 AM 680 Views
Took the words right out of my mouth, repeatedly. Joel - 04/10/2011 12:49:13 PM 1193 Views
Off-Topic Larry - 05/10/2011 01:14:16 AM 964 Views
Hmm Tom - 05/10/2011 02:03:13 AM 1153 Views
True Larry - 05/10/2011 02:13:00 AM 945 Views
I think of Protestantism in terms similar to a Xerox copy. Tom - 05/10/2011 04:57:42 AM 1059 Views
Maybe Xeroxes of abridged texts and dumbed down theology Larry - 06/10/2011 02:26:58 AM 1170 Views
I like that analogy - an echo chamber! *NM* Tom - 08/10/2011 10:44:04 PM 588 Views
Re: Off-Topic CaptainHammer - 05/10/2011 02:56:50 AM 1186 Views
Uhh... Larry - 05/10/2011 03:08:49 AM 986 Views
The people at the Nicene Council and the other councils were not prophets. CaptainHammer - 05/10/2011 04:59:50 AM 1100 Views
And you know that because... why, again? Joel - 05/10/2011 07:13:53 AM 1029 Views
Tough Crowd. Dannymac - 03/10/2011 04:44:31 PM 1142 Views
No questions. Have a nice day. TaskmasterJack - 03/10/2011 11:40:58 PM 991 Views
Why don't they have anything approaching a formal theology? *NM* Dan - 04/10/2011 03:58:16 AM 670 Views
Re: Why don't they have anything approaching a formal theology? CaptainHammer - 04/10/2011 05:23:12 PM 1101 Views
Danny is right, it is a pretty tough crowd, but better tough than weak and whitewashed. everynametaken - 04/10/2011 04:02:16 AM 1027 Views
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