Active Users:525 Time:06/04/2025 09:33:46 AM
Oeh Bramhodoulos Send a noteboard - 07/08/2011 01:54:19 PM
Well, as you can see I'm trying to keep up with several people at the same time and hopefully I'm not confusing your arguments with them and thereby answering questions you didn't ask.

But your example of C. difficile is interesting, for I think it actually proves my point.
You claim that they have objectively "low biological fitness" because they have a very low poplulation, especially compared to other bacteria.

This does not actually have anything to do with the gene pool, unless you would say that all species of bacteria share the same gene pool (and besides, bacteria have a different type of gene pool anyway, since they don't sexually reproduce).
None the less, your clasification of "having low biological fitness" is principally based on their low frequency, not based upon their internal genetical code, or their strong phenotype in and of itself, but only on their frequency.

Next you say that when anti-biotics are applied they are the only ones (or one of the very few) who can survive and therefor increase their numbers.
And once antibiotics are stopped things go back to normal.
You conclude: "That is an example of natural selection. It does not necessarily select for any particular characteristic."

Great, but that's my point!
My problem is not with the notion that nature selects, or that the survivers contribute more to the gene pool or anything, but my question is that if NS does not select for "any particular characteristic", how can that knowledge help us understand NS?

Now you can come with a specific example where NS does select for trait X, but the problem is that NS as a whole cannot be "tested". It can be (and if you ask me: must be) assumed, but I can't think of a non-tautologous formulation of NS that is explanatory.
Reply to message
Natural selection - 06/08/2011 03:51:26 PM 1075 Views
selection for suitability - 06/08/2011 04:18:51 PM 721 Views
Thanks for your responce - 06/08/2011 04:41:20 PM 838 Views
I can't speak for LadyLorraine and won't try, but here's how I see it: - 06/08/2011 06:49:49 PM 779 Views
Just a question - 06/08/2011 07:18:09 PM 767 Views
Yes it can - 06/08/2011 07:41:59 PM 641 Views
But how? - 06/08/2011 07:52:10 PM 838 Views
Okay, I think I see what you're saying - 08/08/2011 05:30:43 PM 654 Views
Close - 08/08/2011 05:41:46 PM 854 Views
Re: Just a question - 06/08/2011 07:49:21 PM 860 Views
I'm not sure I understand you - 06/08/2011 08:20:44 PM 764 Views
All tautologies are truisms, but not all truisms are tautologies. - 06/08/2011 09:38:12 PM 783 Views
Then it is still a tautology - 06/08/2011 09:45:33 PM 793 Views
You can know it's beneifical to a particular individual, but it's harder to say for populations. - 06/08/2011 10:18:16 PM 894 Views
Maybe... - 07/08/2011 01:55:54 PM 751 Views
As I understand it - 06/08/2011 06:04:44 PM 711 Views
Better... - 06/08/2011 06:36:38 PM 696 Views
Actually - 06/08/2011 10:13:51 PM 786 Views
Re: Actually - 06/08/2011 10:37:33 PM 925 Views
Re: Actually - 06/08/2011 11:38:52 PM 852 Views
Oeh - 07/08/2011 01:54:19 PM 703 Views
Hmmm... there's some truth to that - 06/08/2011 06:36:35 PM 798 Views
Re: Hmmm... there's some truth to that - 06/08/2011 07:08:25 PM 798 Views
Re: Hmmm... there's some truth to that - 07/08/2011 12:46:23 AM 792 Views
The complexity of the problem makes it all but impossible to falsify... - 06/08/2011 08:26:06 PM 818 Views
The questions go deeper - 06/08/2011 08:38:31 PM 813 Views
Re: The questions go deeper - 06/08/2011 09:10:32 PM 800 Views
I think I know why you don't understand my question. - 06/08/2011 09:38:41 PM 820 Views
TalkOrigins addresses this at length. - 06/08/2011 11:14:52 PM 876 Views
Not very much, but interesting none the less - 06/08/2011 11:38:36 PM 869 Views
Re: Natural selection - 07/08/2011 03:00:30 AM 796 Views
Thanks a lot - 07/08/2011 01:38:39 PM 941 Views
2 things - 07/08/2011 04:00:35 PM 701 Views
Re: 2 things - 07/08/2011 04:33:00 PM 921 Views
Re: 2 things - 07/08/2011 05:48:26 PM 734 Views
My best guess - 07/08/2011 06:00:28 PM 765 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 06:37:58 PM 707 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 06:47:26 PM 863 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 07:02:27 PM 709 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 09:09:57 PM 819 Views

Reply to Message