Active Users:1111 Time:23/11/2024 12:53:14 AM
Just a question Bramhodoulos Send a noteboard - 06/08/2011 07:18:09 PM
A benefit TO the environment seems like going too far, because that statement itself is an entry into the philosophical, but an increased survival rate is a metric for benefits IN the environment: The greater survival of organisms with a certain trait in a certain environment over that of organisms without it suggests a natural, mechanical and non-directed selection for such traits generally. Without guidance, traits that help an organism in a given environment come to predominate over those that either don't help or even harm organisms, because organisms with helpful traits live longer and breed more than others. The scientific test of the theory is whether we can observe the results it predicts over time: If we do, that's evidence the theory is valid; if not, that's counterevidence (bearing in mind, as always, that evidence does not necessarily reach the level of conclusive proof).

That's just one laymans limited understanding though, so take it for what it's worth; there's a reason I didn't leap up to give my opinion. ;)


I think I understood the TO/IN in the way you explain it and your explanation sort of agrees with what LadyLorriane tried to say.

The tautology problem does not go away with your way of explaining it though, since you don't tell us how we "know" what individuals will be selected, before they are selected. Yes, taking in mind that we are dealing with probability, rather than with absolute numbers.
If a new individual is born, even when given all the possible information about it's DNA and it's environment, (and given that this individual does not have an obvious and gigantic disability), how would you determine it's "benefit in the environment" or it's "chances to procreate" before it actually happens? My point is that you can only measure that afterwards and if it can only be measured afterwards, it cannot be predicted or tested.
Reply to message
Natural selection - 06/08/2011 03:51:26 PM 982 Views
selection for suitability - 06/08/2011 04:18:51 PM 633 Views
Thanks for your responce - 06/08/2011 04:41:20 PM 747 Views
I can't speak for LadyLorraine and won't try, but here's how I see it: - 06/08/2011 06:49:49 PM 679 Views
Just a question - 06/08/2011 07:18:09 PM 682 Views
Yes it can - 06/08/2011 07:41:59 PM 556 Views
But how? - 06/08/2011 07:52:10 PM 750 Views
Okay, I think I see what you're saying - 08/08/2011 05:30:43 PM 567 Views
Close - 08/08/2011 05:41:46 PM 759 Views
Re: Just a question - 06/08/2011 07:49:21 PM 770 Views
I'm not sure I understand you - 06/08/2011 08:20:44 PM 658 Views
All tautologies are truisms, but not all truisms are tautologies. - 06/08/2011 09:38:12 PM 682 Views
Then it is still a tautology - 06/08/2011 09:45:33 PM 695 Views
You can know it's beneifical to a particular individual, but it's harder to say for populations. - 06/08/2011 10:18:16 PM 790 Views
Maybe... - 07/08/2011 01:55:54 PM 641 Views
As I understand it - 06/08/2011 06:04:44 PM 624 Views
Better... - 06/08/2011 06:36:38 PM 609 Views
Actually - 06/08/2011 10:13:51 PM 689 Views
Re: Actually - 06/08/2011 10:37:33 PM 836 Views
Re: Actually - 06/08/2011 11:38:52 PM 756 Views
Oeh - 07/08/2011 01:54:19 PM 612 Views
Hmmm... there's some truth to that - 06/08/2011 06:36:35 PM 691 Views
Re: Hmmm... there's some truth to that - 06/08/2011 07:08:25 PM 705 Views
Re: Hmmm... there's some truth to that - 07/08/2011 12:46:23 AM 698 Views
The complexity of the problem makes it all but impossible to falsify... - 06/08/2011 08:26:06 PM 731 Views
The questions go deeper - 06/08/2011 08:38:31 PM 727 Views
Re: The questions go deeper - 06/08/2011 09:10:32 PM 702 Views
I think I know why you don't understand my question. - 06/08/2011 09:38:41 PM 733 Views
TalkOrigins addresses this at length. - 06/08/2011 11:14:52 PM 779 Views
Not very much, but interesting none the less - 06/08/2011 11:38:36 PM 776 Views
Re: Natural selection - 07/08/2011 03:00:30 AM 699 Views
Thanks a lot - 07/08/2011 01:38:39 PM 842 Views
2 things - 07/08/2011 04:00:35 PM 619 Views
Re: 2 things - 07/08/2011 04:33:00 PM 830 Views
Re: 2 things - 07/08/2011 05:48:26 PM 644 Views
My best guess - 07/08/2011 06:00:28 PM 678 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 06:37:58 PM 616 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 06:47:26 PM 765 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 07:02:27 PM 612 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 09:09:57 PM 732 Views

Reply to Message