Don't later models require proton decay primarily because Pati-Salam opened the door, even if the vanilla form doesn't REQUIRE it? That reduces the likelihood of other GUTs that don't also require it. I'm certainly open to them, just not aware of any save the grandaddy of all GUTs. Saying such unconceived alternatives likely lurk somewhere sounds like my argument for withholding judgement on exotic dark matter.
If you think that position tenable we may need to retrace our steps a bit. 


The two cases are not easily comparable, because the current states of evidence are very different. Also, saying the correct GUT might not yet be conceived is like saying that the correct exotic dark matter particle might not yet be conceived. GUTs and exotic dark matter are both classes of theories; saying we don't know the right one in the class isn't the same as saying we should look in another class.
Your point on the difference in the evidence for each is valid. You've convinced me that the evidence strongly supports exotic dark matter; I don't think it irrefutable, but no more convincing refutation exists, nor is it likely to emerge, which is a form of supporting evidence in itself. There's no evidence against it, which also helps immensely, and is something most GUTs only wish they could say. As long as they keep predicting proton decay at levels experiment proves impossible, Pati-Salam remains the best by default, and we may be approaching a point where simply warping the theory to allow longer lived protons won't be enough, because if the half-life is so high it CAN'T be experimentally detected (bearing in mind that an experiment that can't be replicated is worthless) even a valid GUT will have left the realm of science. With that in turn in mind the distinction of exotic dark matter and GUTs as equal classes of theories also seems valid, though it also means they both raise the same potential problem that invalidating any or all known theories can't invalidate the class unless it involves invalidating some necessary common attribute.
In general, proton decay is a prediction of GUTs because they do away with conservation of baryon number. (You're right that Pati-Salam has this implicitly, though not explicitly.) It may just be that proton decay is very very suppressed, so the experimental half-life bounds of ~10^34 years would be acceptable. Some newer GUTs (utilizing supersymmetry, for example) make predictions that fit the experimental half-life bound. Supersymmetry corrections make the electromagnetic, weak, and strong forces all unify at a single point. Supersymmetry also predicts a new stable particle (the lightest supersymmetric particle) which could be a dark matter candidate.
I assume it goes without saying at this point that eliminating conservation of baryon numbers would put us back at square one on MACHOs.

I'm not sold on all of that, though I admit it has some appeal. No direct evidence yet exists. If supersymmetry is correct, we should find evidence of it at the LHC. Because of the dearth of evidence, however, this is an area where current hypotheses may just be off in the wrong direction. If that's the case, whatever actual evidence we get from the LHC should serve as a course corrector.
And that is very much as it should be. I like a neat creative theory as much as the next guy, and am all for simplifying the big questions whenever possible, but the data has to tell the story on its own. If a verifiable theory's valid, doing experiments in the area it addresses will sooner or later prove it whether anyone wants to or not. If it's not, the same experiments will prove that, too. That's THE reason why I don't want to rule out anything, however unlikely, until/unless it becomes impossible, and likewise not accept as fact anything, however probable, until/unless it becomes irrefutable. I don't really think reputable scientists need to be TOLD that, per se, but sometimes it's hard to see the forest for the trees, so a periodic reminder couldn't hurt.

Honorbound and honored to be Bonded to Mahtaliel Sedai
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!
LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!

LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
Exciting video about the universe
28/04/2011 10:14:55 AM
- 1173 Views
I still think dark matter's just non-luminous matter without a convenient light source to reflect.
28/04/2011 10:34:21 PM
- 885 Views
We've just about ruled out the idea that dark matter is just non-luminous "ordinary" matter.
28/04/2011 11:44:34 PM
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I'm aware of the Bullet Cluster, though admittedly not much more than that.
29/04/2011 01:52:49 AM
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Re: I'm aware of the Bullet Cluster, though admittedly not much more than that.
29/04/2011 02:56:32 AM
- 862 Views
Re: I'm aware of the Bullet Cluster, though admittedly not much more than that.
30/04/2011 05:02:49 PM
- 797 Views
Re: I'm aware of the Bullet Cluster, though admittedly not much more than that.
30/04/2011 08:56:35 PM
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Re: I'm aware of the Bullet Cluster, though admittedly not much more than that.
02/05/2011 01:28:30 AM
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Re: I'm aware of the Bullet Cluster, though admittedly not much more than that.
04/05/2011 04:18:18 AM
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There's such a thing as knowing when you're licked, and I believe I am.
07/05/2011 02:04:53 AM
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Re: There's such a thing as knowing when you're licked, and I believe I am.
09/05/2011 11:28:48 PM
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Re: There's such a thing as knowing when you're licked, and I believe I am.
14/05/2011 05:36:45 AM
- 697 Views

Re: There's such a thing as knowing when you're licked, and I believe I am.
17/05/2011 02:09:40 AM
- 777 Views

Re: There's such a thing as knowing when you're licked, and I believe I am.
19/05/2011 04:55:21 AM
- 703 Views

Re: There's such a thing as knowing when you're licked, and I believe I am.
24/05/2011 09:32:27 PM
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The Pati-Salam model was the one I had in mind.
24/05/2011 10:34:04 PM
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Re: The Pati-Salam model was the one I had in mind.
24/05/2011 11:08:01 PM
- 937 Views
Re: The Pati-Salam model was the one I had in mind.
25/05/2011 01:27:10 AM
- 746 Views
Re: The Pati-Salam model was the one I had in mind.
31/05/2011 09:16:18 AM
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Apologies for the delay; internet's been spotty and I've been busy lately.
10/06/2011 12:09:04 AM
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Re: Apologies for the delay; internet's been spotty and I've been busy lately.
14/06/2011 03:38:18 AM
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Also, re: lensing from ordinary matter:
29/04/2011 05:18:47 AM
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This seems like another example of what confuses the issue.
30/04/2011 05:25:04 PM
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Re: This seems like another example of what confuses the issue.
30/04/2011 08:56:40 PM
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That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
02/05/2011 01:29:03 AM
- 845 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
04/05/2011 04:18:24 AM
- 808 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
07/05/2011 02:05:02 AM
- 978 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
09/05/2011 11:29:36 PM
- 748 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
14/05/2011 05:35:56 AM
- 1038 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
17/05/2011 02:09:55 AM
- 650 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
19/05/2011 02:47:25 AM
- 992 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
24/05/2011 09:46:30 PM
- 771 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
25/05/2011 12:20:10 AM
- 1068 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
31/05/2011 09:16:22 AM
- 873 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
10/06/2011 12:04:06 AM
- 1114 Views
Re: That discussion seems to reduce to "as little new and exotic physics as possible".
14/06/2011 03:38:12 AM
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Re: I still think... (apparently, there is a 100 character limit on subjects, and yours was 99)
28/04/2011 11:57:15 PM
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Seems to happen to me a lot; sorry.
29/04/2011 12:56:14 AM
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None of this reflects on the actual facts of dark matter.
29/04/2011 01:32:52 AM
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I concede my grasp (or grope) is a somewhat superficial laymans, yes.
30/04/2011 04:30:28 PM
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Re: I concede my grasp (or grope) is a somewhat superficial laymans, yes.
30/04/2011 08:56:44 PM
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Re: I concede my grasp (or grope) is a somewhat superficial laymans, yes.
02/05/2011 01:28:58 AM
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Re: I concede my grasp (or grope) is a somewhat superficial laymans, yes.
04/05/2011 04:18:27 AM
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I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
07/05/2011 02:05:09 AM
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Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
09/05/2011 11:32:17 PM
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Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
14/05/2011 05:36:24 AM
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Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
17/05/2011 02:10:03 AM
- 764 Views
Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
19/05/2011 04:33:06 AM
- 1020 Views
Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
24/05/2011 09:59:38 PM
- 766 Views
Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
24/05/2011 11:19:43 PM
- 718 Views
Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
24/05/2011 11:33:58 PM
- 679 Views
Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
25/05/2011 12:55:36 AM
- 780 Views
Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
31/05/2011 09:16:24 AM
- 729 Views
Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
10/06/2011 12:09:13 AM
- 900 Views
Re: I don't object to changing my mind, but can take more convincing than I really should.
14/06/2011 03:38:05 AM
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Might help if you clarified where your skepticism is at
29/04/2011 02:32:07 AM
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Potentially either, or a combination of the two.
30/04/2011 02:36:50 PM
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It's hard to discuss without knowing your objections a bit more clearly
30/04/2011 04:58:03 PM
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My primary objection is that alternatives to dark matter seem to have been ruled out prematurely.
02/05/2011 01:29:14 AM
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