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Oh, but they know that; in many cases, they exult in it. Joel Send a noteboard - 14/05/2011 06:06:01 AM
It's in the spirit of the joke about the man who went to Heaven and gets a tour from St. Peter. They walk past church after church, and the man looks in and sees people singing and praying, and then they sneak past the doors of the next church. "That's the Baptist church," says St. Peter. "They think they're the only ones here."

Heh, nice, though the Baptist Churchs course over the years is saddening. What would Roger Williams (let alone Christ) say?

The Orthodox Church is far less legalistic than the Catholic Church because it recognizes that there is much we cannot understand with our limited faculties (we see through a glass and dimly). It will take doctrine up to a certain point and after that it will declare that the matter is a "Divine Mystery" and attempt no further explanation. This kept the Orthodox Church from lots of silly doctrines (like Limbo).

IMHO that would keep a lot of people from silly doctrines while preserving all vital ones. That's not to say the great mysteries shouldn't be considered, because they provide perspective on both God and man, but the latters limitations make conclusions speculative, and thus unsuitable for inviolable doctrine as such. If one comes to conclusions of which they are certain one is obviously bound to observe them as a matter of conscience, but enforcing them on others is presumptuous. In a way, that's what I think has happened with this ordination issue; people are not only free but obligated to follow their conscience (I don't ever expect God to ask me if I did what Paul or Moses told me) but not to teach it, not unless there's a firm doctrinal basis that doesn't seem possible in this case (quite the opposite).
Another advantage it has is that it has an unbroken line of faith from the earliest churches (Orthodox churches still stand in many of the cities Paul wrote to), through the Roman Empire and Byzantine period all the way to the present, without any Latin innovations. If you want to find a Church that just DOES NOT CHANGE ANYTHING EVER FOR ANY REASON, it's the Orthodox Church. The priests still wear the style of robes and hats that were worn in the era of Constantine the Great, the same a capella music is sung with the same rules, the order of the Divine Liturgy has not changed one iota (a very literal statement for those who retain the original Greek of the first Christian communities), and doctrine has not changed. The world may change, but not the Orthodox Church.

Which can be both good and bad. It's important to distinguish between forms and substance; the former is largely irrelevant but the latter is literally sacrosanct. If I were to pick a denomination it would probably be that one, but I realize that a lot of the appeal is that it's always affirmed some doctrines I like that are almost or entirely absent from Roman Catholic and Protestant Churches, and there's the rub: Given greater familiarity with Orthodox doctrine I'm sure I could find plenty of things to confirm my non-denominationalism. :P "Christian" ought to be the highest label to which Christs followers can aspire, it was good enough for the Antioch church and even Paul agrees. ;)
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Presbyterian Church (USA) passes Amendment 10-A. - 11/05/2011 05:39:29 PM 1335 Views
*NM* - 11/05/2011 06:10:26 PM 284 Views
I am happy to see this. *NM* - 11/05/2011 07:22:59 PM 317 Views
Homosexuals must die! - 11/05/2011 08:25:25 PM 999 Views
I agree! This sort of behavior can NOT be excused!!! - 11/05/2011 10:38:16 PM 654 Views
Yay!!. - 11/05/2011 10:38:51 PM 828 Views
Glad to hear it. *NM* - 11/05/2011 10:46:39 PM 382 Views
Well done. *NM* - 11/05/2011 11:07:22 PM 323 Views
What's the language? Did they at least TRY to give a doctrinal justification? - 12/05/2011 02:10:46 AM 836 Views
Thank you for that rousing argument against married priests. - 12/05/2011 03:36:51 AM 824 Views
Why ARE you letting women into the priesthood? - 12/05/2011 04:16:50 AM 771 Views
Because Episcopalians don't listen to the Bible much. - 12/05/2011 05:47:03 AM 714 Views
That's just fine as far as I'm concerned - 12/05/2011 02:23:44 PM 713 Views
Yes, I suppose a church could go that route. - 14/05/2011 07:38:02 AM 681 Views
I'm not attempting to impose a dichotomy on the Bible. - 14/05/2011 03:25:30 PM 740 Views
I don't even know what following the Bible in its entirety means. - 14/05/2011 09:09:10 PM 914 Views
As an exercise, I tried to think of how I would justify allowing homosexuals as clergy. - 14/05/2011 04:19:43 PM 718 Views
Wow. - 20/05/2011 10:15:21 AM 748 Views
Thanks (I'm actually OK with women priests though). - 12/05/2011 07:09:11 AM 792 Views
It's more a question of interpretational standards. - 12/05/2011 02:29:43 PM 683 Views
Agreed. - 14/05/2011 01:17:45 AM 768 Views
They did so, via negativa. - 12/05/2011 04:22:17 PM 862 Views
Your church has a constitution?! - 12/05/2011 03:36:41 AM 723 Views
My Church has a congress! *NM* - 12/05/2011 03:37:52 AM 366 Views
Haha no way! *NM* - 12/05/2011 03:46:32 AM 319 Views
We have a General Assembly and a Moderator. - 12/05/2011 04:18:34 PM 815 Views
I had no idea the US was based on that system. - 12/05/2011 06:22:58 PM 646 Views
It is pretty common practice - 12/05/2011 06:54:02 PM 686 Views
Oh I'm sure it is with newer churches. - 12/05/2011 10:49:11 PM 742 Views
I'm happy to hear this, personally. I also wonder how you reconcile this with the Bible. - 12/05/2011 04:11:31 AM 908 Views
Every direct reference to homosexuality in the Bible is a reference to rape. - 12/05/2011 04:12:43 PM 739 Views
Every single word that you wrote in your response is complete bullshit. - 12/05/2011 05:50:07 PM 850 Views
Knock off your eisegesis, try some exegesis - 12/05/2011 07:02:45 PM 790 Views
I'm trying to figure out just what your "gifts" are, because I don't see any. - 12/05/2011 07:30:39 PM 761 Views
Oh, is that how we're playing this, then? - 13/05/2011 06:29:31 PM 757 Views
Re: Oh, is that how we're playing this, then? - 13/05/2011 07:02:35 PM 737 Views
I'm not playing. I'm pointing out some glaring errors on your part. - 13/05/2011 07:25:08 PM 680 Views
Danny will correct me if I'm wrong, but... - 13/05/2011 09:55:14 PM 866 Views
Danny persistently refuses to say that - 13/05/2011 10:13:55 PM 792 Views
You're a fucking moron. *NM* - 15/05/2011 11:11:08 PM 350 Views
You make a very important but too often overlooked point. - 14/05/2011 01:54:40 AM 820 Views
??? the bible was harsher on homosexulaity than on rape - 12/05/2011 06:56:43 PM 714 Views
Read Judges. - 12/05/2011 07:17:29 PM 715 Views
Another example... - 12/05/2011 09:19:52 AM 655 Views
That's what people said about churches opposing slavery. - 12/05/2011 04:06:26 PM 713 Views
I rest my case *NM* - 12/05/2011 04:48:32 PM 313 Views
That is a false dichotomy and we both know it. - 14/05/2011 02:07:19 AM 714 Views
If you claim to follow the entire Bible, then you are completely correct. - 12/05/2011 06:04:38 PM 632 Views
On the contrary, this move will take some butts out of the seats. - 12/05/2011 07:16:22 PM 692 Views
We both know that isn't the case - 12/05/2011 07:55:41 PM 801 Views
Whatever your issue is, get over it. - 13/05/2011 06:17:26 PM 675 Views
You'd be a lot more effective... - 13/05/2011 06:45:31 PM 776 Views
You haven't adequately expressed your theology - 13/05/2011 07:28:54 PM 771 Views
Cool cool. I have a question on a semi-related note, about Protestant Gospels - 12/05/2011 05:33:49 PM 761 Views
No Protestant denomination has added so much as a word to the Bible - 12/05/2011 05:58:16 PM 640 Views
So, everyone hates Judith, then? - 12/05/2011 06:40:11 PM 700 Views
The Catholics and Eastern Orthodox Churches accept Judith as part of Scripture. - 12/05/2011 07:51:27 PM 676 Views
Does the Eastern Orthodox Church also segregate deuterocanonical works like Roman Catholicism does? - 14/05/2011 02:19:03 AM 983 Views
The Eastern Church bases everything on the Septuagint. - 14/05/2011 02:34:41 AM 727 Views
That sounds appealing, and makes sense. - 14/05/2011 02:44:56 AM 749 Views
Oh, I just enjoy calling Protestants "heretics" to remind them not everyone agrees with them. - 14/05/2011 03:25:42 AM 687 Views
Oh, but they know that; in many cases, they exult in it. - 14/05/2011 06:06:01 AM 693 Views
Since I haven't gotten around to asking yet... - 13/05/2011 07:14:01 PM 666 Views
Re: Since I haven't gotten around to asking yet... - 15/05/2011 03:18:23 PM 1079 Views

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