I dont know if this will help you understand what is going on there
Aisha Send a noteboard - 30/01/2011 02:45:41 AM
But my close Egyptian friends have family down there in the protests. In fact one of my best friends cousins who are lawyers helped organize the protest at Tahrir Square. They are NOT the ones looting. It is the secret police (in plain clothes) that is doing this to make the protesters look bad. Protesters as young as 13 years of age have made human shields around the museum and other places to stop the looting and other bullshit certain people are trying to pull (most of the looters that have been caught have police ID's). Its easy to sit here and judge and say that they should be protesting peacefully and not violently but even the peaceful protests were met with violence from the police. In Egypt you are not allowed to protest against the government, Period. This is a government that has tortured, killed and imprisoned its people for decades and the people have had enough.
The secret police I am talking beat a british journalist quite badly today and trashed his camera. there is video footage of a protester being shot in the back while running away from the police. These protesters are fucking heroes not animals like you seem to think.
Maybe these links will help you learn some more about the situation.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jan/26/egypt-protests
http://www.democracynow.org/blog/2011/1/29/live_from_the_egyptian_revolution_by_sharif_abdel_kouddous
I mean, I'm no fan of one party authoritarian states sustained by the military and corrupt businessmen, but if Mubarak is opposing people who torch buildings and storm hotels while guests huddle in hiding wondering where the police are it's hard for me to question his response. This isn't the people peaceably assembling to petition for a redress of grievances, it's a national riot. Virtually any Western democracy faced with indiscrimate violence, possibly even killing, though it's hard to be sure from the little chaotic info I've seen, would declare martial law, and with that in mind Mubaraks response so far doesn't seem too unreasonable. I have no illusions about his nobility, but let's keep things in perspective and recall that neither the Reign of Terror nor the Bolshevik Revolution significantly improved things for the oppressed; it just meant they were oppressed at least as much and more violently. The relevance I see to those terms, even in an advanced modern nation like Egypt, is precisely the sort of thing I have in mind when I suggest the Mid-East isn't capable of full participation in 21st Century international relations.
So, who wants to clue me in on what I'm missing here...?
The secret police I am talking beat a british journalist quite badly today and trashed his camera. there is video footage of a protester being shot in the back while running away from the police. These protesters are fucking heroes not animals like you seem to think.
Maybe these links will help you learn some more about the situation.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jan/26/egypt-protests
http://www.democracynow.org/blog/2011/1/29/live_from_the_egyptian_revolution_by_sharif_abdel_kouddous
This link has been updated near-continuously for a while now.
Yikes.
Yikes.
I mean, I'm no fan of one party authoritarian states sustained by the military and corrupt businessmen, but if Mubarak is opposing people who torch buildings and storm hotels while guests huddle in hiding wondering where the police are it's hard for me to question his response. This isn't the people peaceably assembling to petition for a redress of grievances, it's a national riot. Virtually any Western democracy faced with indiscrimate violence, possibly even killing, though it's hard to be sure from the little chaotic info I've seen, would declare martial law, and with that in mind Mubaraks response so far doesn't seem too unreasonable. I have no illusions about his nobility, but let's keep things in perspective and recall that neither the Reign of Terror nor the Bolshevik Revolution significantly improved things for the oppressed; it just meant they were oppressed at least as much and more violently. The relevance I see to those terms, even in an advanced modern nation like Egypt, is precisely the sort of thing I have in mind when I suggest the Mid-East isn't capable of full participation in 21st Century international relations.
So, who wants to clue me in on what I'm missing here...?
Aisha - formerly known as randschicka
This message last edited by Aisha on 30/01/2011 at 02:54:56 AM
If anyone's looking for up-to-date info on what's going on in Egypt
- 28/01/2011 08:08:31 PM
624 Views
Clarify: Democracy fans should favor the protesters because they have more violent thugs,right?
- 28/01/2011 11:37:48 PM
473 Views
and socialism fans should favor the violent dicator since he can bring order and subsidies
- 29/01/2011 12:16:37 AM
341 Views
He mainly seems to bring close diplomatic ties to the US and alternatives to the Muslim Brotherhood
- 29/01/2011 12:59:48 AM
492 Views
You might want to do a quick check on the political situation in Egypt at this time.
- 29/01/2011 11:37:02 AM
407 Views
I've done a quick one; it makes me question whether government by the protesters would be better.
- 29/01/2011 11:44:10 PM
377 Views
It's a fairly simple matter, really.
- 29/01/2011 11:52:41 AM
416 Views
The trouble with free elections is: They're free.
- 29/01/2011 11:53:22 PM
326 Views
A vote for dictatorship and against democracy it is. Just checking.
- 30/01/2011 12:08:41 AM
367 Views
I haven't cast a vote.
- 30/01/2011 02:02:11 AM
346 Views
Not one that counts no, but still.
- 30/01/2011 01:11:59 PM
812 Views
None of any kind.
- 31/01/2011 12:10:07 AM
387 Views
so you support tyranny of others if it makes things more comfortable for you?
- 30/01/2011 05:15:01 AM
388 Views
I oppose brutal oppression; I'm unconvinced either side in this will end it, thus I withhold support
- 30/01/2011 05:21:37 AM
332 Views
some times it is black and white
- 31/01/2011 12:37:36 AM
330 Views
I fully support their right to demand democracy; I don't expect they'll get it, whatever happens.
- 31/01/2011 01:45:23 AM
527 Views
You're not seriously expecting them to do their revolution American Revolution-style, are you?
- 29/01/2011 11:28:31 AM
392 Views
I think terrorizing innocents and torching buildings is a poor way to claim the moral highground.
- 29/01/2011 11:32:19 PM
394 Views
British Colonialism wasn't a walk in the park
- 30/01/2011 03:53:58 AM
346 Views
Comparatively speaking, yes, it really was. Or at least in the US - not always so much in Asia.
- 30/01/2011 10:42:53 AM
336 Views
Re: Comparatively speaking, yes, it really was. Or at least in the US - not always so much in Asia.
- 30/01/2011 02:32:52 PM
390 Views
You can't be serious.
- 30/01/2011 03:07:18 PM
325 Views
Pretty serious
- 30/01/2011 04:52:24 PM
481 Views
Re: Pretty serious
- 30/01/2011 05:11:50 PM
376 Views
This is ridicolous
- 30/01/2011 05:31:31 PM
436 Views
I wouldn't normally think this necessary with you, but okay: let's go back and see what I said.
- 30/01/2011 06:34:09 PM
406 Views
you forget that it was supposdely thier own citizens the British were abusing.
- 31/01/2011 12:39:33 AM
429 Views
Sure, but organized into hostile armies. A rather different matter, that. *NM*
- 31/01/2011 09:46:25 PM
149 Views
I dont know if this will help you understand what is going on there
- 30/01/2011 02:45:41 AM
363 Views
Yikes indeed
- 29/01/2011 03:57:25 AM
388 Views
Apparently Egypt blocked access to Facebook, Twitter and some other websites.
- 29/01/2011 11:38:46 AM
347 Views
Heh, her update was basically "Thanks for turning facebook back on, Egypt."
- 29/01/2011 06:36:49 PM
305 Views
There seems to be some big misconceptions about the Egyption crisis
- 31/01/2011 11:52:37 PM
624 Views