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That's a logical rationale, and might even be accurate, but in this case I want hard evidence. Joel Send a noteboard - 13/01/2011 09:03:32 PM
We really can not prove why any creature evolved the way it did since we can't demonstrate evolution in the lab. I have seen speculation but like most things in this field it is nothing more then that and there is not reason why an expert’s speculation would be better then mine or maybe even yours.

There is no real difference in simple math and girls do as well if not better then boys at arithmetic and multiplication. They also do well in some complex math things like geometry proofs. It is the higher levels of math where the real differences show up and the higher you go the bigger those differences become.

The best theory I have seen is the only real difference comes in with spatial thinking. We know that men and women even seem to navigate differently with women using land marks and men more often relying on maps in their heads. In a hunter gather society where weak little humans were hunting things like mammoth and wooly rhinoceros there would have been enormous evolutionary pressure to be good at since being bad got you killed and your kids starve.

If you assume males were the primary hunters (and only screwball left sociology professors try to argue otherwise) then the ability to handle spatial issues would help the males much more then it help the females. The females were more likely to travel shorter distance and since they were aiming for stationary targets they would have been more likely to return by the same path. Land mark navigation.

Males on the other would have traveled much further to find animals then follow them looking for opportunities to pick off weaker straggles from a large herd. Once they started hunting they would have used multiple men driving the animal to a desired location to kill it. That requires spatial skills to both plan and execute, be in the wrong place and your trampled, let it get away and your status as a hunter drops. Once you attack spatial skills come into play with angles of attack and such.

Like I said that is all just a theory and unprovable since we don’t even know how they hunted but it does give a viable explanation.

That may seem odd coming from me, but it's precisely because I know determination and experience will enable most people to produce a plausible rationale for even the most absurd proposition. A friend of mine from HS used to talk about a fellow Plan II student at UT whose senior thesis was an Aristotelian DISproof of gravity; logically airtight, and completely ridiculous--and even the author knew it. We might not have observed speciation in the lab, but we have observed specialization, and that approach seems like it offers the possibility of evaluating whether there's a sexually based difference beween mathematical ability. Or it might not, but it seems worth exploring. Forming a theory is only part of the equation; testing that theory is just as vital.
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Looks like the feminist movement wasn't as successful as it appears - 11/01/2011 06:21:01 PM 2146 Views
I think you're extrapolating a bit too much - 11/01/2011 06:45:38 PM 1225 Views
I don't trust the figures. - 11/01/2011 06:50:24 PM 1246 Views
While I don't 100% agree with the article, some feminists annoy me no end. - 11/01/2011 06:47:03 PM 1255 Views
My wife told me just this weekend I need to stop pressuring her to have a career - 11/01/2011 06:52:11 PM 1237 Views
Re: My wife told me just this weekend I need to stop pressuring her to have a career - 12/01/2011 01:36:14 AM 1238 Views
Yeah, got one like that, too. - 12/01/2011 02:17:17 AM 1241 Views
yeah prett much anything gross that isn't in a diaper is my job - 12/01/2011 05:12:11 AM 1171 Views
It's not just that choice though. - 11/01/2011 07:12:48 PM 1302 Views
It feels more hypocritical coming from feminists than "traditionalists". *NM* - 11/01/2011 07:17:24 PM 656 Views
For you maybe. - 11/01/2011 07:27:52 PM 1230 Views
there is definitely some SAHM snobbery - 11/01/2011 08:43:21 PM 1195 Views
Well. - 11/01/2011 09:34:42 PM 1258 Views
I agree. I would also like to add, if I may... - 12/01/2011 01:27:59 AM 1222 Views
all 25 of them? - 12/01/2011 05:14:56 AM 1187 Views
Pffft, look it up a bit. You might find info on the national propaganda radio (NPR) site. - 12/01/2011 12:47:33 PM 1228 Views
It's a difficult dynamic even under the best of circumstances, when both partners have chosen it. - 12/01/2011 02:25:20 PM 1091 Views
I agree, it's very difficult. - 12/01/2011 03:14:59 PM 1111 Views
it is nuanced - 12/01/2011 03:06:39 PM 1162 Views
Re: it is nuanced - 12/01/2011 04:58:36 PM 1169 Views
You are spot on. As usual. About everything. *NM* - 12/01/2011 01:42:18 AM 694 Views
- 12/01/2011 02:25:59 PM 1140 Views
I have to admit that this bothers me. - 11/01/2011 07:33:09 PM 1248 Views
I don't expect people to understand my choice necessarily. - 11/01/2011 09:36:52 PM 1257 Views
In addition... - 12/01/2011 05:39:25 PM 1129 Views
I guess you think the same of me then. - 11/01/2011 09:48:31 PM 1122 Views
Another one? - 12/01/2011 06:01:43 AM 1157 Views
Re: Another one? - 12/01/2011 12:33:58 PM 1184 Views
~never mind~ *NM* *NM* - 12/01/2011 04:42:47 PM 756 Views
I'm going to answer you anyway. - 12/01/2011 04:54:18 PM 1243 Views
not to mention - 12/01/2011 05:11:42 PM 1184 Views
In addition - 12/01/2011 05:23:25 PM 1137 Views
you don't want kids? - 12/01/2011 05:46:25 PM 1111 Views
bleck - 12/01/2011 11:14:25 PM 1137 Views
again not the vibe I get from you - 12/01/2011 11:38:26 PM 1114 Views
Hehe. - 13/01/2011 12:15:06 AM 1168 Views
Not selfish. - 13/01/2011 02:45:43 AM 1151 Views
You don't have to be a doctor to contribute to the world - 12/01/2011 05:27:26 PM 1197 Views
Poor Aeryn - 12/01/2011 05:29:47 PM 1126 Views
I replied before she edited - 12/01/2011 05:41:53 PM 1076 Views
Am I at least absolved from having to respond? - 15/01/2011 06:11:27 AM 1172 Views
Certainly. *NM* - 15/01/2011 09:40:09 AM 692 Views
The primary issue... - 12/01/2011 05:52:42 PM 1104 Views
*NM* - 12/01/2011 05:54:29 PM 618 Views
What Rebekah said... - 15/01/2011 07:55:34 PM 1107 Views
Me too! - 11/01/2011 09:43:57 PM 1194 Views
Re: Me too! - 12/01/2011 01:23:39 AM 1197 Views
I have a fiancee like that. - 12/01/2011 02:14:53 AM 1114 Views
I feel so fortunate to be a stay at home mom. - 12/01/2011 11:32:37 PM 1097 Views
My commentary on the whys and wherefores of this stuff would be way too politically incorrect - 11/01/2011 07:56:24 PM 1260 Views
I think all of that makes sense - 11/01/2011 08:36:39 PM 1171 Views
In this particular case I don't disagree with you. - 11/01/2011 09:28:13 PM 1090 Views
I'm not sure why either sex should surpass the other in math. - 12/01/2011 02:34:09 AM 1081 Views
men have more physical strength period - 12/01/2011 05:30:14 AM 1099 Views
There's a lot more to running (especially marathons) then leg strength. - 12/01/2011 05:41:11 AM 1093 Views
When you talk about reasons men "should" be better at math - 12/01/2011 03:47:53 PM 1155 Views
Re: When you talk about reasons men "should" be better at math - 12/01/2011 04:32:38 PM 1053 Views
Re: When you talk about reasons men "should" be better at math - 12/01/2011 04:41:42 PM 1132 Views
Both, really; the latter is a consequence of the former. - 12/01/2011 05:21:28 PM 1028 Views
I'm trying to understand your position - 12/01/2011 05:28:43 PM 1101 Views
try string theory, it makes more sense than Joel logic - 12/01/2011 05:57:27 PM 1035 Views
Now you've got it. - 12/01/2011 06:40:50 PM 1190 Views
Okay, that's fair. *NM* - 12/01/2011 06:42:30 PM 605 Views
Glad we were able to reach an understanding. - 13/01/2011 10:02:47 PM 1085 Views
Re: I'm trying to understand your position - 13/01/2011 08:12:05 PM 1131 Views
we know the brain of women works differently then the brains of men - 12/01/2011 05:40:15 PM 1141 Views
What evidence I'm aware of seems inconclusive. - 12/01/2011 06:46:50 PM 999 Views
There are theories but of course they are unprovable - 12/01/2011 10:50:08 PM 1097 Views
That's a logical rationale, and might even be accurate, but in this case I want hard evidence. - 13/01/2011 09:03:32 PM 1033 Views
here is some evdience to argue that it is not society but biology - 13/01/2011 08:43:43 PM 1146 Views
I think you did like I always do and forgot to give us a way to click your link. - 13/01/2011 09:56:52 PM 1133 Views
oops - 13/01/2011 10:07:55 PM 1159 Views
Seems like that's an argument for both views, in a way. - 13/01/2011 11:14:11 PM 1052 Views
You can use anything to prove what you want if you are willing to spin it hard enough - 14/01/2011 02:57:29 PM 1277 Views
I used YOUR article to "prove" what it says outright. - 15/01/2011 05:35:27 PM 1241 Views
I would also like to say this: - 11/01/2011 09:33:23 PM 1109 Views
Of course - 12/01/2011 01:47:14 AM 1147 Views
Re: Of course - 12/01/2011 04:57:11 PM 1142 Views
"Night" is also almost invariably feminine, in my experience. - 12/01/2011 07:58:12 PM 1160 Views
Re: "Night" is also almost invariably feminine, in my experience. - 12/01/2011 08:15:59 PM 1153 Views
It's true for Arabic and hence, one suspects, Hebrew. - 13/01/2011 07:43:21 PM 1070 Views
I'm glad YOU think it's fun... - 13/01/2011 10:05:07 PM 1127 Views
Re: I would also like to say this: - 12/01/2011 09:15:28 AM 1140 Views
Re: I would also like to say this: - 12/01/2011 12:27:14 PM 1135 Views
No - 12/01/2011 12:28:48 PM 1046 Views
Re: No - 12/01/2011 12:35:56 PM 1010 Views
Re: No - 12/01/2011 12:37:33 PM 1129 Views
Re: No - 12/01/2011 12:43:36 PM 1121 Views
Re: No - 12/01/2011 12:47:56 PM 1157 Views
Since this has become too complicated - 12/01/2011 12:54:54 PM 1157 Views
Re: Since this has become too complicated - 12/01/2011 12:56:20 PM 1149 Views
Re: Since this has become too complicated - 12/01/2011 04:55:50 PM 1063 Views
The two are used as different psychological concepts. - 12/01/2011 02:24:58 PM 1104 Views
Again, used incorrectly. - 12/01/2011 03:34:22 PM 1085 Views
Re: Again, used incorrectly. - 12/01/2011 04:00:59 PM 1162 Views
Exactly. *NM* - 12/01/2011 04:53:03 PM 615 Views
It really doesn't surprise me - 12/01/2011 12:36:19 AM 1123 Views
Have you left a memo at the Feminist Movement's Office? - 12/01/2011 12:46:45 AM 1156 Views
Actually, the feminist movement was completely successful. - 12/01/2011 01:42:44 AM 1158 Views
Well put. *NM* - 12/01/2011 02:10:56 AM 608 Views
I was playing a bit but I agree that the feminist in the past accomplished a lot - 12/01/2011 05:34:04 AM 1151 Views
NOW is just a left-leaning PAC. - 12/01/2011 03:16:52 PM 1111 Views
Now if only others were so rational about it. - 17/01/2011 05:55:57 AM 2138 Views
Nevermind, Tom beat me to it. - 12/01/2011 01:54:07 AM 1087 Views
Mmm. I don't think you understand the feminist movement. You have been reading to many things - 12/01/2011 01:56:20 AM 1148 Views
I was refering to groups like NOW - 12/01/2011 05:40:46 AM 1087 Views
Gotcha. - 12/01/2011 11:53:29 PM 1082 Views
I was being a tad bit trollish with my title - 13/01/2011 01:47:30 AM 1053 Views
I'm not sure that follows, at all. - 12/01/2011 02:06:41 AM 1056 Views
they never mention their study methods - 12/01/2011 02:14:15 PM 1135 Views
Gosh, look what you started. - 12/01/2011 03:00:23 PM 1136 Views
somebody need to start something it is pretty dead around here *NM* - 12/01/2011 03:16:54 PM 632 Views
Seriously *NM* - 12/01/2011 09:56:56 PM 602 Views
I agree that it would be awesome to hang with my kid every day and not have to work. - 12/01/2011 11:33:25 PM 1151 Views
that part would be great - 12/01/2011 11:40:49 PM 1126 Views
I could do it every day. - 13/01/2011 12:52:56 AM 1040 Views
Me too... - 13/01/2011 02:45:49 PM 1174 Views
So here's the question. Why don't men have a "choice" to opt-out? - 15/01/2011 06:13:28 AM 1144 Views
They do. - 15/01/2011 09:42:29 AM 1083 Views
read further up the thread - 15/01/2011 10:49:08 AM 1166 Views
I really wish that were more socially acceptable. - 15/01/2011 07:58:57 PM 1177 Views
I feel I have that choice. - 16/01/2011 12:08:48 AM 1099 Views
They most certainly do. - 18/01/2011 04:39:09 PM 1221 Views
This sounds awful to me. - 13/01/2011 04:27:08 AM 1127 Views
Re: This sounds awful to me. - 14/01/2011 02:47:36 AM 1137 Views
Yikes. - 14/01/2011 11:13:39 PM 1113 Views

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