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Just making sure you knew I wasn't mistaking your reply for a constructive one snoopcester Send a noteboard - 18/08/2010 12:08:41 PM
There was some sarcasm in there too. Did you catch that? :P


No.

Oh, they sure would. The media would gleefully cover them putting their foot in their mouth, and happily portray then as the next Hitler for expressing even a fraction of those sentiments. The sympathy would always remain with the Muslims though, and the implication would be that a good person would clearly denounce such people and their supporters.

Other than having to put up with listening to said people's crap so that the rest of us can snicker behind our hands at how outdatedly evil they are and how enlightened and progressive we are, I fail to see how the Muslims would be inconvenienced in any major way. The media giving such people a voice would clearly be on the Muslims' side, and would put strong pressure on the public to take their side as well.


This is all really getting away from the point - the ability of the people building the community centre a couple of blocks away from Ground Zero to get their message out to people likely to be angry about it. I some how doubt people like Palin and Newt Gingrich or people appearing on Fox News took the time to make clear what the other side of the story is and were never going to. So rather than blame it on the people behind building the community centre for not communicating their reasons, the sensible approach is to realise they weren't given the chance to because that is how it works (which one would think people on the right would be aware of, since they're happy to point it out all too often when it is the other way).
*MySmiley*

Robert Graves "There is no money in poetry, but then there is no poetry in money, either."

Henning Mankell "We must defend the open society, because if we start locking our doors, if we let fear decide, the person who committed the act of terror will win"
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Wait, wait WAIT! The location for the so-called "mosque at ground zero" is actually 2 blocks away?! Avendesora - 17/08/2010 03:19:02 PM 2370 Views
it's still too close!! IT'S TOO CLOSE I SAY LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 03:23:12 PM 1365 Views
*NM* ironclad - 18/08/2010 11:40:26 AM 579 Views
Yes, it is. Elaine - 17/08/2010 03:23:33 PM 1356 Views
Another stupid question...is it even actually a mosque? Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 03:28:37 PM 1208 Views
I've heard the same. nossy - 17/08/2010 03:30:36 PM 1137 Views
So Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 03:35:43 PM 1231 Views
blog link nossy - 17/08/2010 03:41:43 PM 1238 Views
that's correct *NM* damookster - 17/08/2010 03:51:38 PM 579 Views
it's both from what I've heard. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:00:54 PM 1144 Views
sort of like most churches, mosques and temples? *NM* random thoughts - 17/08/2010 04:04:12 PM 576 Views
mmm, i think more like... LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:08:55 PM 1104 Views
it is a community center with a mosque Aisha - 17/08/2010 04:28:08 PM 1002 Views
A memorial! Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:58:52 PM 1215 Views
it is a community center with a mosque Aisha - 17/08/2010 04:28:09 PM 1182 Views
my wife's church has a play ground and community center random thoughts - 17/08/2010 04:47:52 PM 1122 Views
okay, cool then LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:17:04 PM 1011 Views
I was just being nit picky random thoughts - 17/08/2010 05:44:36 PM 982 Views
Been hearing a lot on NPR nossy - 17/08/2010 03:32:42 PM 1213 Views
I could see it being insensitive if it were actually where the towers used to be. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 03:43:18 PM 1268 Views
Yeah. nossy - 17/08/2010 03:51:13 PM 1184 Views
precisely. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:02:44 PM 1084 Views
This could be part of the reason that most of the opposition doesn't seem to be coming from locals. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 03:53:06 PM 1192 Views
seriously, it's not like property is some ample commodity in NYC *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:03:24 PM 595 Views
you should probably keep in mind.... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:02:25 PM 1232 Views
So Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 04:06:18 PM 1282 Views
Ground Zero specifically refers to the north and south towers where the planes struck... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:26:40 PM 1211 Views
don't use that term at all. Say WTC. *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 12:27:32 AM 592 Views
I know. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:26:19 PM 1152 Views
it certainly has turned into a political land mine for Obama... damookster - 17/08/2010 03:54:03 PM 1159 Views
True nossy - 17/08/2010 04:02:04 PM 981 Views
unfortunately... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:05:08 PM 1095 Views
That's because they are pussies. nossy - 17/08/2010 04:10:59 PM 1242 Views
This is beginning to sound familiar. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:18:37 PM 1315 Views
with the senate majority leader weighing it I don't believe it is all how it is mostly on the right random thoughts - 17/08/2010 05:58:10 PM 1213 Views
Seems we disagree on that, then. Legolas - 17/08/2010 06:05:33 PM 1195 Views
hardly the first time random thoughts - 17/08/2010 06:56:33 PM 1169 Views
Well, since day 1 of this whole debate alot of the opposition has come from the right. Variant - 17/08/2010 10:50:49 PM 1161 Views
you assume it is pandering maybe they just agree with the majority random thoughts - 18/08/2010 02:30:53 AM 1147 Views
I'm not saying it's a partisan issue, but it has turned political for all the wrong reasons. Variant - 18/08/2010 04:18:49 AM 1274 Views
is the idea that it is not to close to ground zero the misinformation you are refering to? random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:09:17 PM 1112 Views
Well, it's not like they're literally on ground zero. Variant - 18/08/2010 08:54:08 PM 1246 Views
ground zero is defined as where the old WTC complex was random thoughts - 19/08/2010 12:23:32 PM 1123 Views
And anything within a 3 block radius apparently? Variant - 20/08/2010 04:44:25 AM 1153 Views
Guess which of them will be out of a job in January? Joel - 18/08/2010 01:22:49 PM 1129 Views
the only reason Obama won't be out of job is he isn't running random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:10:58 PM 1100 Views
Oh, I dunno if you could translate the current numbers into Obamas defeat. Joel - 18/08/2010 03:52:18 PM 1193 Views
Bush's numbers were much better in 04 then Obama's are now random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:11:31 PM 1214 Views
Perhaps so then. Joel - 19/08/2010 04:51:36 PM 1127 Views
it was a large event so two half blocks really is pretty damn close random thoughts - 17/08/2010 04:03:17 PM 1246 Views
Here's a map of the site for perspective Isaac - 17/08/2010 04:08:41 PM 1263 Views
so 2 blocks from the superblock then? LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:13:03 PM 1261 Views
I guess, superblock is an obscure term to this country lad Isaac - 17/08/2010 04:41:11 PM 1131 Views
It may not necessarily matter to people who are aware of that fact. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:13:12 PM 1109 Views
mk, well, to my mind (being from phoeni, 1 full city block is about 1 mile. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:15:49 PM 1171 Views
A mile is a serious exaggeration, surely. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:24:48 PM 1279 Views
Remember, I did say in Phoenix LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:27:43 PM 1168 Views
I really need to see Phoenix some day. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:32:40 PM 1209 Views
i still think houston is more spread out than phoenix moondog - 18/08/2010 08:21:10 AM 1198 Views
unless you go far enough west of course random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:30:45 PM 1062 Views
most of california is pretty spread out, city-wise. moondog - 19/08/2010 02:16:44 AM 1025 Views
true, I was think along the lines of San Fransico random thoughts - 19/08/2010 03:47:12 AM 1112 Views
Absolutely. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 05:28:38 PM 1168 Views
Yeah, and it seems to be about 10 autobuses in distance on Google Earth. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:29:43 PM 1070 Views
In NYC, generally 1 mile = 20 blocks *NM* BlackAdder - 17/08/2010 05:25:21 PM 631 Views
Okay. I guess i just forget how much larger Phoenix is *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:28:13 PM 515 Views
Google Earth says 500 feet between mosque and GZ *NM* Isaac - 17/08/2010 05:30:59 PM 537 Views
*edit* Just for reference... one mile = 5280 feet, 500ft = approx 1/10 of a mile. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 06:26:19 PM 1126 Views
Judging by Google Earth, the blocks inbetween both contain a single large building. (edit) Legolas - 17/08/2010 07:08:05 PM 1054 Views
Clarify: 500 ft between the mosque and the border of the area on the map? *NM* Avendesora - 17/08/2010 07:03:51 PM 552 Views
Probably, given my corner-to-corner result. *NM* Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 07:26:19 PM 557 Views
Yes, down West Broadway (contains old ground view from site) Isaac - 17/08/2010 07:31:58 PM 1295 Views
Personally, I think this supports Ave's point. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 04:16:15 PM 1212 Views
yes... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:29:51 PM 1226 Views
Right. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 04:31:29 PM 1174 Views
Believe me, honey. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:32:47 PM 1020 Views
Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 04:37:19 PM 1094 Views
You know what else is on Park Place? A strip club. Aeryn - 17/08/2010 11:58:56 PM 1074 Views
Really? I had no idea Isaac - 18/08/2010 12:06:27 AM 1162 Views
Re: Really? I had no idea Aeryn - 18/08/2010 12:24:54 AM 1208 Views
Hmm... Isaac - 18/08/2010 01:23:14 AM 1159 Views
I didn't even know I was responding to you. Aeryn - 18/08/2010 04:08:36 AM 1133 Views
Thanks Isaac - 18/08/2010 04:23:47 AM 1114 Views
It happens...? Joel - 18/08/2010 01:29:44 PM 938 Views
knowing there's a strip club and "walking those streets"; seems like you've "gotten around" moondog - 18/08/2010 02:03:14 AM 1141 Views
*NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 04:10:10 AM 550 Views
They're building on the hallowed ground of a Burlington Coat Factory! Vodalus - 17/08/2010 04:13:06 PM 1217 Views
how so? LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:14:17 PM 1039 Views
Maybe it's got something to do with Cordoba, Spain? Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:16:38 PM 1054 Views
From when the Moors conquered Spain Vodalus - 17/08/2010 04:18:18 PM 1262 Views
ah mk. fair enough then. *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:35:39 PM 670 Views
to clarify though snoopcester - 17/08/2010 04:50:19 PM 1066 Views
in that respect, I rather like the name *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:23:18 PM 594 Views
Yes, but you have to remember the mindset of those protesting. Vodalus - 17/08/2010 09:49:26 PM 1174 Views
Oh indeed snoopcester - 18/08/2010 10:20:45 AM 1177 Views
Oh, yeah. I foolishly assumed people would know that part. *NM* Vodalus - 18/08/2010 05:34:39 PM 559 Views
Sorry, but the card says it was "the Moops" so you must be wrong. Tom - 18/08/2010 03:56:11 PM 1131 Views
Aaaaaaaaagh Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:13:17 PM 1097 Views
*NM* Vodalus - 18/08/2010 05:31:20 PM 543 Views
Or a Christian conquest of Islam, surely. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:07:53 PM 1232 Views
Right on the button. *NM* Tim - 17/08/2010 04:19:39 PM 564 Views
Ezra Klein made a good point in the Washington Post... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:33:31 PM 1036 Views
Re: Ezra Klein made a good point in the Washington Post... Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:34:47 PM 1084 Views
it was a rhetorical question in his column damookster - 17/08/2010 04:43:25 PM 1189 Views
that is hardly the same thing random thoughts - 17/08/2010 04:56:43 PM 1143 Views
so suppose... damookster - 17/08/2010 06:06:03 PM 1078 Views
I am sure it will I just don't see the relevance random thoughts - 17/08/2010 06:57:41 PM 1193 Views
My question is, why would you want to put a mosque/community center/thing that close? StormCrow - 17/08/2010 04:39:05 PM 1127 Views
angry New Yorkers? damookster - 17/08/2010 04:45:01 PM 1219 Views
I was going to guess 4 protests to your earlier post. StormCrow - 17/08/2010 04:50:08 PM 1180 Views
We do not live in fear of what "a few crazy people" might do. *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 12:02:06 AM 529 Views
Re: angry New Yorkers? snoopcester - 17/08/2010 04:53:58 PM 1115 Views
I was wondering about that. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:56:28 PM 1208 Views
Re: I was wondering about that. snoopcester - 17/08/2010 05:05:50 PM 1165 Views
interesting map, thanks for posting it. *NM* Avendesora - 17/08/2010 05:55:06 PM 589 Views
That's a good point too and I didn't think about that. StormCrow - 17/08/2010 05:39:53 PM 1296 Views
I think what this position misses Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 05:01:52 PM 1332 Views
Ok, sure. StormCrow - 17/08/2010 06:09:33 PM 1223 Views
Hoboken? The_Muted_Grimaud - 17/08/2010 09:06:07 PM 1035 Views
Indeed. Not a serious suggestion about putting it there. StormCrow - 17/08/2010 09:13:35 PM 1029 Views
angry New Yorkers? Geez, we are more civilized than that, thank you. *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 12:01:12 AM 526 Views
not really *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 02:31:46 AM 452 Views
your opinion is noted. now go eff yourself. *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 04:11:25 AM 494 Views
that's pretty good BlackAdder - 18/08/2010 04:44:14 AM 1101 Views
That's right. Why resort to violence when a good rant will do? *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 06:09:27 AM 513 Views
and a heart fuck off to you but thanks for the ironic reply *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:18:25 PM 521 Views
How is it ironic? *NM* Camilla - 18/08/2010 03:43:50 PM 556 Views
How was his uncivilized response ironic? *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:18:17 PM 508 Views
Yes. Where is the irony? Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:20:57 PM 1055 Views
Re: How was his uncivilized response ironic? random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:23:25 PM 1063 Views
Aaah Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:31:02 PM 1118 Views
Re: Aaah random thoughts - 18/08/2010 05:30:07 PM 1067 Views
Re: Aaah Camilla - 18/08/2010 05:38:47 PM 1166 Views
To both of you: her. And she. *NM* Legolas - 18/08/2010 05:44:03 PM 533 Views
I knew that. *NM* Camilla - 18/08/2010 05:45:21 PM 518 Views
I'm not a New Yorker. Not impuning your civility either. StormCrow - 19/08/2010 02:45:55 AM 1305 Views
Because the building is cheap as hell, because they're mostly abandoned in those areas Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:25:13 AM 1133 Views
Something I'm confused on Isaac - 17/08/2010 04:59:41 PM 1380 Views
another thing to consider. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 05:02:38 PM 1074 Views
You'll have to explain to me what that has to do with what I said Isaac - 17/08/2010 05:10:21 PM 1092 Views
I don't think anyone is saying it's not "near" ground zero. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 05:12:52 PM 1197 Views
Of course you're confused. It was a tangental thought. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 06:06:29 PM 1138 Views
Fair enough, I can't really criticize others for going off on tangents since I do it so much *NM* Isaac - 17/08/2010 06:36:54 PM 543 Views
On that tangent though, an interesting article Isaac - 17/08/2010 07:50:44 PM 1167 Views
From what I understand, there's another mosque very close to the site Brian - 17/08/2010 05:06:26 PM 1259 Views
I understand there's also a strip club and a xxx movie rental shop within that same 2 blocks radius. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:09:26 PM 1143 Views
Looks like 2 or 3 blocks, I love Google Earth Isaac - 17/08/2010 05:17:01 PM 1196 Views
True but the buildings were not nocked down by radical strippers *NM* random thoughts - 17/08/2010 05:52:04 PM 542 Views
Joss Whedon purchased the rights to this movie already. *NM* StormCrow - 17/08/2010 06:29:34 PM 594 Views
*NM* Avendesora - 17/08/2010 06:38:27 PM 526 Views
Yep. Is true. *NM* Aeryn - 17/08/2010 11:59:31 PM 549 Views
What do strip clubs and dirty movies and gay bars have to do with 9/11? *NM* ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:33:59 AM 563 Views
Nothing, which is precisely the point. *NM* Legolas - 18/08/2010 12:37:52 AM 561 Views
Can you explain your point to me then? Because I'm not following it. ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:21:13 AM 1104 Views
The argument is that it's "hallowed ground" and therefore should be treated with "respect" Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:26:44 AM 1226 Views
No. That might be one argument, but hardly the only one. ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:31:14 AM 1215 Views
Pretty much what Greg said. Legolas - 18/08/2010 09:39:33 AM 1154 Views
then you are missing the point random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:02:49 PM 1234 Views
In all fairness... Variant - 18/08/2010 09:46:26 PM 1152 Views
these guys are not babes in the woods random thoughts - 19/08/2010 12:28:24 PM 1030 Views
I never said they were. Variant - 20/08/2010 04:56:53 AM 1166 Views
Respond/Double post. *NM* Variant - 20/08/2010 04:57:25 AM 487 Views
This whole debate disgusts me. Napoleon62 - 17/08/2010 05:24:56 PM 1321 Views
I'm not going to ask why. *NM* Avendesora - 17/08/2010 06:21:13 PM 525 Views
Agreed Camilla - 17/08/2010 08:10:34 PM 1267 Views
Yep, I see a lot of ugliness in this discussion ironclad - 18/08/2010 11:42:34 AM 1109 Views
Jon Stewart made good point last night Aisha - 17/08/2010 05:34:19 PM 1199 Views
but it's the CONCEPT!!! practical effect is not the POINT of political debate!! *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:53:30 PM 541 Views
which is why Obama was crazy to get anywhere this issue random thoughts - 17/08/2010 06:01:44 PM 1049 Views
He's damned if he does, and damned if he doesn't Brian - 17/08/2010 06:18:16 PM 1090 Views
that really isn't true random thoughts - 17/08/2010 07:09:29 PM 1160 Views
yah he really should have just stayed mum about it LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 07:37:03 PM 1137 Views
Ye gods, I agree with you AND CELIA! Joel - 18/08/2010 01:36:21 PM 1287 Views
double post random thoughts - 17/08/2010 06:01:44 PM 1114 Views
Hatemongers gotta hate. Beqi - 17/08/2010 07:43:17 PM 1141 Views
More than anything, I see this being a sensitivity issue.... Jeordam - 17/08/2010 07:43:45 PM 1114 Views
Avendesora - 17/08/2010 07:52:07 PM 1126 Views
Right on. Jeordam - 17/08/2010 08:09:44 PM 1077 Views
yah, it sounds like the builders aren't being very thoughtful in their PR. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 08:12:20 PM 864 Views
yah, it sounds like the builders aren't being very thoughtful in their PR. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 08:12:21 PM 1137 Views
The crux is they can't HELP stirring "up the grief and pain of the past. " Joel - 18/08/2010 01:49:21 PM 1203 Views
are you serious? Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:01:01 PM 1221 Views
I think you got the point right there. Beqi - 17/08/2010 08:08:21 PM 1113 Views
Yes, I am... Jeordam - 17/08/2010 08:14:27 PM 1120 Views
The point is your analogy does not hold Camilla - 17/08/2010 08:19:29 PM 1111 Views
Plus snoopcester - 17/08/2010 08:26:36 PM 1168 Views
Yes. That. *NM* Camilla - 17/08/2010 08:28:14 PM 1039 Views
we should all learn pool saftey from pigeons and sparrows. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 08:37:37 PM 1051 Views
Sicko! snoopcester - 17/08/2010 08:48:05 PM 1100 Views
Re: Yes, I am... Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:42:27 PM 1169 Views
Just to be a pain in the... StormCrow - 17/08/2010 09:10:11 PM 1140 Views
Aren't they? Jeordam - 17/08/2010 09:19:58 PM 1197 Views
You may be interested in... Legolas - 17/08/2010 09:23:48 PM 1282 Views
*nods* So I was right.... Jeordam - 17/08/2010 09:26:59 PM 1004 Views
actually, it depends on the extent of the burning. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 11:01:11 PM 1076 Views
That is probably not fair snoopcester - 17/08/2010 11:12:22 PM 1129 Views
I know! ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 03:06:25 AM 1142 Views
it's all relative. nossy - 18/08/2010 03:33:35 AM 1221 Views
Using a touch of hyperbole, perhaps? snoopcester - 18/08/2010 10:18:36 AM 1124 Views
I'm so proud of you for noticing! ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 10:48:14 AM 1194 Views
Just making sure you knew I wasn't mistaking your reply for a constructive one snoopcester - 18/08/2010 12:08:41 PM 1086 Views
I give constuctive replies where they are due ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:30:42 PM 1171 Views
snoopcester - 18/08/2010 12:33:57 PM 1117 Views
ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:41:27 PM 1181 Views
Hey Snoop... ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:47:13 PM 1181 Views
What the hell were these people smoking? Joel - 18/08/2010 02:14:44 PM 1293 Views
COMPLETELY unrelated point that I don't blame you for ignoring... beckstcw - 19/08/2010 04:25:31 AM 1066 Views
And yet that's very close to what MADD and SADD do. Joel - 18/08/2010 01:56:51 PM 1261 Views
you are right of course random thoughts - 17/08/2010 08:22:23 PM 1084 Views
Re: you are right of course Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:34:31 PM 1246 Views
I agree. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 08:46:07 PM 1045 Views
you could be correct but it still shows a lack of sensitivity random thoughts - 17/08/2010 09:34:46 PM 1265 Views
I don't disagree that it's a sensitivity thing LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 08:10:01 PM 1218 Views
Re: I don't disagree that it's a sensitivity thing *NM* Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:29:59 PM 496 Views
This. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 08:31:17 PM 1149 Views
So, you're saying muslims should leave nyc to show their sensitivity, right? BlackAdder - 17/08/2010 10:31:55 PM 1058 Views
so your saying you always speak in over the top rhetoric? random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:22:20 PM 971 Views
Well explain what the difference is, then BlackAdder - 18/08/2010 07:14:46 PM 1093 Views
not really sure how to start random thoughts - 18/08/2010 08:23:34 PM 1135 Views
THANK YOU ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:13:16 AM 1194 Views
Take deep breaths.. Variant - 18/08/2010 05:25:16 AM 1080 Views
Typing a post didn't really require all that much effort ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 06:13:15 AM 1186 Views
There are more important things in the world to worry about Ghavrel - 18/08/2010 08:51:35 AM 1168 Views
I do get angry over other things, you know ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 10:02:02 AM 1156 Views
Pretty much, yeah. Ghavrel - 18/08/2010 09:00:09 PM 1125 Views
I disagree, anger doesn't help in this debate, and it's only going to make things worse. Variant - 18/08/2010 10:56:30 AM 1168 Views
: Joel - 18/08/2010 02:52:51 PM 1247 Views
So what, the Americans supporting this mosque are "arrogant European pricks"? Legolas - 18/08/2010 10:12:51 AM 990 Views
Kind of a stretch for you to make that assumption ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 11:31:16 AM 1158 Views
I hadn't read that other exchange yet, it made more sense after that. Legolas - 18/08/2010 12:35:18 PM 1190 Views
My only real objection is the same old one over whether respect is an entitlement. Joel - 18/08/2010 02:21:19 PM 1029 Views
A mosque was built in the Pentagon months after 9/11 Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:23:11 AM 1188 Views
Here comes the "xenophobia card." ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:27:50 AM 1185 Views
Which is why there was a bombing at another mosque earlier this year Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:31:51 AM 1115 Views
So? ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:39:49 AM 1231 Views
Re: A mosque was built in the Pentagon months after 9/11 BlackAdder - 18/08/2010 01:28:44 AM 1234 Views
Re: A mosque was built in the Pentagon months after 9/11 Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:34:22 AM 1223 Views
I think a better parallel would be the new neighbors opening a pool store. Joel - 18/08/2010 01:40:42 PM 1190 Views
A guy on CNN made a really good point about this Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:46:54 PM 1226 Views
That analogy really isn't better than Jeo's, and I would think worse. *NM* Legolas - 17/08/2010 09:02:50 PM 549 Views
hmm yes but that black man hadn't killed his dog LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 09:22:15 PM 1140 Views
Re: hmm yes but that black man hadn't killed his dog Aisha - 17/08/2010 10:32:24 PM 1293 Views
precisely. Camilla - 17/08/2010 11:20:06 PM 1029 Views
Re: precisely. Aisha - 18/08/2010 01:32:09 AM 1124 Views
Re: precisely. Camilla - 18/08/2010 09:10:33 AM 1141 Views
not surprising that a guy on CNN made that point random thoughts - 17/08/2010 09:38:16 PM 1232 Views
Yeah this whole debate is pretty pointless to be completely honest BlackAdder - 17/08/2010 10:28:13 PM 1176 Views
An interesting point Vodalus - 18/08/2010 03:44:52 AM 1168 Views
In fairness, it's extremely hard to draw that line sometimes. Legolas - 18/08/2010 10:27:24 AM 1119 Views
well we have been shot at from enough mosque to make it hard to tell at times random thoughts - 18/08/2010 08:25:58 PM 1156 Views
I think this whole debate has made American look bad. Variant - 17/08/2010 10:58:23 PM 1106 Views
So what? ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:28:40 AM 1159 Views
Okay, so we're no longer the land of religous tolerance. Variant - 18/08/2010 04:09:24 AM 1309 Views
Were we ever? ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 04:18:16 AM 1296 Views
I guess not. Variant - 18/08/2010 04:25:03 AM 1255 Views
Re: I guess not. ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 05:56:49 AM 1141 Views
Re: I guess not. Variant - 18/08/2010 10:43:05 AM 1128 Views
Re: I guess not. ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:13:37 PM 985 Views
Re: I guess not. Variant - 18/08/2010 09:30:21 PM 1061 Views
Yes, we were. Joel - 18/08/2010 02:34:39 PM 1113 Views
How does this work, do you only look bad to a bunch of ass wipes, or does anyone who thinks you look Helene - 18/08/2010 09:38:28 AM 1058 Views
Olberman's Special Comment on this one hits the nail on the head Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:29:45 AM 1176 Views
love that the Olberman video, but Jon Stewart did an awesome job too. *NM* Aisha - 18/08/2010 01:32:59 AM 483 Views
Olbermann and Stewart are possibly the two best people alive *NM* Napoleon62 - 18/08/2010 02:39:48 AM 584 Views
they make the top of my list for people I wnat to catch an STD *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 08:27:27 PM 523 Views
Let me just say... Legolas - 18/08/2010 09:20:38 PM 1142 Views
Re: Let me just say... Camilla - 18/08/2010 09:22:12 PM 1125 Views
I didn't watch that particular video, so maybe, yeah. *NM* Legolas - 18/08/2010 10:11:22 PM 555 Views
Re: I didn't watch that particular video, so maybe, yeah. Camilla - 18/08/2010 10:45:54 PM 1164 Views
O'Reilly isn't as bad as he's made out to be. (edit) Legolas - 18/08/2010 11:10:33 PM 1165 Views
I'm pretty sure I agree with you. nossy - 18/08/2010 10:48:09 PM 1071 Views
Why is it weird? Legolas - 18/08/2010 11:00:20 PM 1140 Views
dayum! thats like the ultimate insult *NM* Aisha - 19/08/2010 03:37:53 AM 503 Views
Stewart is great, but Olberman? You can't be serious. *NM* damookster - 18/08/2010 11:23:17 PM 590 Views
I love that poem Camilla - 18/08/2010 12:26:58 PM 1271 Views
I used to be so Idealistic to think this was AMERICA. StarrBecca - 18/08/2010 01:44:38 AM 1219 Views
It is America ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:49:35 AM 1212 Views
the key phrase is "congress shall make no law...." moondog - 18/08/2010 02:23:53 AM 1244 Views
14th ammendment changed that *NM* Roland00 - 18/08/2010 04:51:08 AM 519 Views
14th ammendment established a state religion? moondog - 18/08/2010 08:14:11 AM 1060 Views
No, but the Equal Protection Clause extended much of the BoR to the states. Joel - 18/08/2010 02:50:31 PM 1163 Views
did you go the the Huffington Post school of law? random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:29:14 PM 1087 Views
No, but I've spent more time around lawyers than I care to admit. Joel - 18/08/2010 03:45:36 PM 1197 Views
the defendent doesn't always get a complete picture *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:25:36 PM 525 Views
The only time I was ever in a courtroom was as a spectator. Joel - 19/08/2010 04:33:56 PM 1176 Views
It was meant to be a short comment Roland00 - 19/08/2010 01:13:39 AM 1205 Views
we also have freedom of speech random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:25:52 PM 1058 Views
The connection is inevitable and, I think, deliberate. Joel - 18/08/2010 01:15:41 PM 1214 Views
Hmm snoopcester - 18/08/2010 02:26:17 PM 1071 Views
Bottom line is it may be in everyones interest to DISassociate Islam from 911. Joel - 18/08/2010 02:58:17 PM 1123 Views
No, bottom line is people need to be able to keep to thoughts in their brains at any given time *NM* Camilla - 18/08/2010 03:31:03 PM 515 Views
You mean retain both "I want to promote Islam" AND "Dude, Ground Zero is right THERE! *points*" Joel - 18/08/2010 03:36:34 PM 1088 Views
No Camilla - 18/08/2010 03:43:08 PM 1159 Views
They clearly are tied to it. Joel - 18/08/2010 03:59:45 PM 1169 Views
How long ago were the Crusades? Jeordam - 18/08/2010 03:48:53 PM 1071 Views
Re: How long ago were the Crusades? Camilla - 18/08/2010 03:52:23 PM 1101 Views
So wait... Jeordam - 18/08/2010 04:09:10 PM 1036 Views
Yes, Jerodam. Christians are good. All the rest are bad. I see it now. Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:10:47 PM 1121 Views
Stop freaking out Camilla. You are such a drama queen some times. Jeordam - 18/08/2010 04:15:06 PM 1074 Views
That is not drama. That is fed up. *NM* Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:16:32 PM 587 Views
You're not the only one who is fed up.... Jeordam - 18/08/2010 04:24:27 PM 972 Views
*giggle* Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:29:03 PM 1129 Views
We don't know that.... Jeordam - 18/08/2010 05:40:25 PM 1135 Views
We do nossy - 18/08/2010 05:49:33 PM 1232 Views
Re: You're not the only one who is fed up.... Helene - 18/08/2010 04:38:04 PM 1139 Views
This may be nitpicking, but I'll do it anyway because it's a widespread misconception... Legolas - 18/08/2010 04:30:20 PM 1087 Views
THANK YOU! Aisha - 18/08/2010 06:11:52 PM 1027 Views
Re: So wait... snoopcester - 18/08/2010 04:45:53 PM 1032 Views
I agreed with you at first - thought your first post was pretty insightful. nossy - 18/08/2010 05:46:02 PM 1111 Views
maybe it is actions that led to the crusades that never ended random thoughts - 19/08/2010 12:25:20 PM 965 Views
I have to agree with Jeo that that's unfair. Joel - 19/08/2010 02:47:23 PM 1299 Views
The Crusades were by Christendom as a whole*, 9-11 isn't similar for Islam by some way snoopcester - 18/08/2010 04:04:54 PM 1104 Views
Re: The Crusades were by Christendom as a whole*, 9-11 isn't similar for Islam by some way Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:11:34 PM 1094 Views
Depends whom you ask, when and where. Joel - 19/08/2010 03:06:18 PM 1052 Views
Right snoopcester - 20/08/2010 10:31:21 AM 1139 Views
Some people will always wonder about such things; we're still accused of "Crusading" today. Joel - 18/08/2010 04:07:02 PM 1097 Views
I don't disagree about the outreach, as such, but a remark... Legolas - 18/08/2010 04:37:52 PM 988 Views
It's as much a local issue as the theme park Disney wanted to build at Gettysburg. Joel - 19/08/2010 03:15:03 PM 1037 Views
Have you ever BEEN to Gettysburg? SilverWarder - 19/08/2010 05:21:18 PM 973 Views
A bit more background information Vodalus - 18/08/2010 05:30:04 PM 1261 Views
That's informative, thanks, but I'm not sure it really changes anything. Joel - 19/08/2010 03:27:05 PM 1038 Views
Step One: Manufacture controversey by means of misinformation (i.e. Mosque at Ground Zero) Vodalus - 19/08/2010 06:40:49 PM 1228 Views
To be fair snoopcester - 20/08/2010 10:38:01 AM 1181 Views
The location of this mosque is a horrid idea. Joel - 21/08/2010 05:34:58 PM 1031 Views
"Think of it as a center for muslim hippies." Jragghen - 18/08/2010 09:30:55 PM 1132 Views
Can I just say... LadyLorraine - 19/08/2010 01:45:38 AM 1040 Views
i have a side bar *NM* Aisha - 19/08/2010 03:36:10 AM 440 Views
you must have a teeny screen or a bad resolution LadyLorraine - 19/08/2010 05:03:57 AM 1088 Views
I know. Avendesora - 19/08/2010 12:20:11 PM 1131 Views
Roughly 2 football fields, yes. And around a corner SilverWarder - 19/08/2010 03:17:24 PM 1107 Views
Two hundred yards is nothing. Joel - 19/08/2010 04:44:34 PM 1078 Views
Sure it is - it's two large city blocks SilverWarder - 19/08/2010 05:15:46 PM 1129 Views
It's two fairly average city blocks, and not even that some places. Joel - 21/08/2010 06:07:33 PM 1076 Views
Well you can not like it if you choose SilverWarder - 25/08/2010 03:39:49 PM 1501 Views
You keep stating that this isn't about Islam. Libby - 20/08/2010 11:06:10 AM 1169 Views
That's because it's not. Joel - 21/08/2010 06:17:29 PM 1201 Views
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