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But that is just simplistic and silly to complain about when it is a long standing possibility snoopcester Send a noteboard - 05/08/2010 03:46:59 PM
And from his viewpoint, it looks like: why ask them then? Why are people given the option of voting for something that is "against the constitution?"


The fact it took a court ruling and is now up for appeal shows it wasn't something anyone knew for sure until it happened - unless they ruled before it was voted on, which would be wasteful if it was judged constitutional then only ten people voted in favour of it. Plus it would delay it for a few years potentially while all the court cases are worked through - would the supporters have agreed to that?
Still though, if there is any blame around it then it really lies with those who proposed it who should have checked if it was at risk of being overruled first. The attempts to blame the court and the system just sounds like sour grapes at not getting their way to me.
*MySmiley*

Robert Graves "There is no money in poetry, but then there is no poetry in money, either."

Henning Mankell "We must defend the open society, because if we start locking our doors, if we let fear decide, the person who committed the act of terror will win"
This message last edited by snoopcester on 05/08/2010 at 03:48:48 PM
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Judge rules California's ban on same-sex marriage is unconstitutional ironclad - 04/08/2010 10:40:50 PM 1363 Views
Thank God. *NM* Ghavrel - 04/08/2010 10:52:30 PM 381 Views
Amen. *NM* Dannymac - 05/08/2010 02:09:24 AM 437 Views
Good news, but as the article says, it'll go all the way to the SC. Legolas - 04/08/2010 10:55:58 PM 713 Views
So then is that how we do it? Jeordam - 04/08/2010 11:01:19 PM 838 Views
Of course. ironclad - 04/08/2010 11:04:59 PM 745 Views
His point was ßelals Girl - 04/08/2010 11:40:14 PM 893 Views
Yeah but: What Ghavrel said below *NM* ironclad - 05/08/2010 08:01:02 AM 432 Views
And again... ßelals Girl - 05/08/2010 06:08:56 PM 592 Views
To quote my property professor: "Can I make you think like a Californian?" Tom - 05/08/2010 06:39:48 PM 664 Views
well that is sort of the idea of how democracy works snoopcester - 04/08/2010 11:06:57 PM 728 Views
I'm not the one who came up with the referendum system, you do realize. Legolas - 04/08/2010 11:11:13 PM 735 Views
The referendum system, in my opinion, has been a failure, especially in CA. Dreaded Anomaly - 04/08/2010 11:46:21 PM 819 Views
democracy has been a failure in CA. random thoughts - 05/08/2010 02:42:21 PM 604 Views
No. It just shows the problems of a crazy electorate. Tom - 05/08/2010 03:29:21 PM 721 Views
I think you made my point *NM* random thoughts - 05/08/2010 03:35:00 PM 400 Views
About Californians being crazy, yes. *NM* Tom - 05/08/2010 04:53:32 PM 374 Views
we vote fro way to much crap in general random thoughts - 05/08/2010 02:41:19 PM 665 Views
Yeah, I agree. Legolas - 05/08/2010 04:11:34 PM 658 Views
my one recent dealing with our criminal justice random thoughts - 05/08/2010 04:25:30 PM 696 Views
Yes, you still have to abide by the Constitution, even if a lot of people don't like it. *NM* Ghavrel - 05/08/2010 12:07:44 AM 385 Views
Amend the Constitution to alter the Fourteenth Amendment if you don't like it. *NM* Tom - 05/08/2010 01:09:51 AM 445 Views
just a devil's advocate position here, but.... moondog - 05/08/2010 04:23:43 AM 743 Views
Marriage is either an economic status regulated by law or a religious institution. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:13:17 AM 776 Views
There are certain things that should not be decided by a vote... Dannymac - 05/08/2010 02:02:45 AM 730 Views
I do agree with you on that. Hell yes, and on a subject like this in particular. nossy - 05/08/2010 02:17:24 AM 786 Views
Re: I do agree with you on that. Hell yes, and on a subject like this in particular. snoopcester - 05/08/2010 10:46:54 AM 778 Views
I understand it. nossy - 05/08/2010 03:06:40 PM 761 Views
I know you don't support proposition 8 snoopcester - 05/08/2010 03:29:34 PM 748 Views
nossy - 05/08/2010 03:34:01 PM 786 Views
But that is just simplistic and silly to complain about when it is a long standing possibility snoopcester - 05/08/2010 03:46:59 PM 668 Views
Oh, ees it? nossy - 05/08/2010 04:07:39 PM 806 Views
Well they knew the rules before they started the whole thing snoopcester - 05/08/2010 04:12:33 PM 645 Views
Why would you complain if you won? nossy - 05/08/2010 04:15:20 PM 736 Views
You could recognise that you won by the system working in a way you don't like? snoopcester - 05/08/2010 04:23:58 PM 617 Views
I'm sure that happens, in general. nossy - 06/08/2010 02:43:18 PM 603 Views
It seems to happen a lot nowadays snoopcester - 06/08/2010 03:06:33 PM 636 Views
It's so weird that you feel differently - there is only room for one opinion here! nossy - 06/08/2010 03:41:52 PM 563 Views
There is only room for one opinion and mine is the right one snoopcester - 06/08/2010 03:49:16 PM 684 Views
instead it should be decided by judges who answer to no one? *NM* random thoughts - 05/08/2010 07:12:59 AM 388 Views
The same judges who upheld our private right to bear arms. Tom - 05/08/2010 02:09:07 PM 765 Views
not when judges stop using the Constitution random thoughts - 05/08/2010 02:30:51 PM 740 Views
Sexual preference is not the right being protected. Tom - 05/08/2010 03:22:04 PM 809 Views
I know that the 14th amendment is routinely used in ways it was never intended. random thoughts - 05/08/2010 05:25:07 PM 719 Views
I realize that, but it is ultimately a good thing. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:31:19 PM 791 Views
I am really on the fence a bit on the whole issue random thoughts - 05/08/2010 06:00:59 PM 734 Views
I generally agree with you. Tom - 05/08/2010 06:33:56 PM 751 Views
let's take away the citizenship of all black people if that's the way you think moondog - 05/08/2010 09:06:23 PM 647 Views
Come now lets not be stupid random thoughts - 06/08/2010 05:31:18 PM 614 Views
sorry but your statement was completely ignorant. moondog - 06/08/2010 07:27:09 PM 733 Views
I will talk as soon as you stop spouting stupid rhetoric and say something relevant random thoughts - 06/08/2010 07:54:09 PM 697 Views
bullshit. you will personally attack me no matter what i say. moondog - 07/08/2010 02:04:04 PM 745 Views
Let's just be clear about which amendment is which. Dreaded Anomaly - 05/08/2010 11:50:57 PM 613 Views
but that still ignores intent and expands the law in ways not intnented when it created random thoughts - 06/08/2010 04:53:43 AM 672 Views
Yes, no, no, and no. Dreaded Anomaly - 06/08/2010 05:29:09 AM 707 Views
there are serious flaws in your thinking here random thoughts - 06/08/2010 06:18:13 PM 787 Views
Your assertions continue to lack support. Dreaded Anomaly - 06/08/2010 07:23:17 PM 814 Views
not all you just refuse to see things you disagree with random thoughts - 06/08/2010 08:36:32 PM 782 Views
...said the pot to the kettle Dreaded Anomaly - 06/08/2010 09:17:28 PM 851 Views
yes but a shiny stainless steel pot random thoughts - 09/08/2010 11:21:33 PM 897 Views
You continue to be wrong about history and the role of courts. Dreaded Anomaly - 10/08/2010 01:05:39 AM 1243 Views
If he's wrong, a lot of law scholars and Supreme Court Justices are wrong. Legolas - 10/08/2010 01:44:05 AM 700 Views
Brown vs. Board of Education, 'nuff said. *NM* Dreaded Anomaly - 10/08/2010 04:32:37 AM 384 Views
Actually, that only proves his point, if I understand correctly. *NM* Legolas - 10/08/2010 11:11:19 AM 412 Views
part oif the problem appears to be you completely missing the point random thoughts - 10/08/2010 01:23:19 PM 912 Views
let my simplify my argument random thoughts - 10/08/2010 01:42:47 PM 617 Views
There's a simple way to determine the degree to which that opinion is objective or subjective... Legolas - 06/08/2010 09:32:21 PM 647 Views
Since when is marriage a right? *NM* Jeordam - 05/08/2010 04:11:16 PM 374 Views
it may not be a "right"... LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 04:22:44 PM 648 Views
This is where the debate comes into play.... Jeordam - 05/08/2010 05:04:08 PM 663 Views
How much would it change the debate if it was nurture, really? Legolas - 05/08/2010 09:48:22 PM 681 Views
except this is not merely a matter of changing society LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 11:18:48 PM 727 Views
1948. *NM* jh - 05/08/2010 04:50:30 PM 370 Views
It's a benefit that is being extended selectively to one set of the populace. Tom - 05/08/2010 04:52:52 PM 731 Views
Hey, I'm single.... Jeordam - 05/08/2010 05:05:41 PM 644 Views
That's a specious argument and you know it. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:13:17 PM 717 Views
A homosexual has every opportunity as well..... Jeordam - 05/08/2010 05:23:56 PM 663 Views
Oh quit the bullshit already. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:29:15 PM 864 Views
Slow your role... Jeordam - 05/08/2010 09:08:54 PM 770 Views
Your religious beliefs have 100% to do with your position. Tom - 05/08/2010 09:43:23 PM 813 Views
Sorry, but what a nonsense. ironclad - 05/08/2010 09:27:17 PM 632 Views
hey that's it, jens! you solved the WHOLE PROBLEM!!! LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 11:24:29 PM 766 Views
ON TO WORLD HUNGER! ironclad - 06/08/2010 07:59:51 AM 659 Views
LET THEM HAVE CAEK. *NM* jh - 06/08/2010 02:29:56 PM 355 Views
Are you sure it's wise to feed people on a lie? *NM* Floffe - 06/08/2010 02:34:26 PM 446 Views
People are fed lies all the time LadyLorraine - 06/08/2010 09:30:37 PM 640 Views
Quite so, but I don't think it's commonly a mainstay of their diet *NM* Floffe - 06/08/2010 09:50:33 PM 384 Views
It is the only thing which is abundant enough for everyone to have some... *NM* jh - 06/08/2010 10:01:44 PM 625 Views
I agree with you Sareitha Sedai - 05/08/2010 05:06:40 PM 698 Views
That's not valid. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:26:50 PM 709 Views
I invite you to read the judge's conclusions, linked again inside. Dreaded Anomaly - 05/08/2010 11:43:44 PM 749 Views
Since 1948 Napoleon62 - 06/08/2010 04:01:02 AM 854 Views
gah. can. only. see. typo. *NM* nossy - 06/08/2010 03:43:21 PM 344 Views
I don't see any typo... *NM* Legolas - 06/08/2010 04:07:18 PM 402 Views
Open the link. *NM* nossy - 06/08/2010 04:47:04 PM 491 Views
Oh, right. Yeah, that does kinda detract from things. *NM* Legolas - 06/08/2010 04:48:47 PM 380 Views
I agree random thoughts - 05/08/2010 07:22:17 AM 722 Views
And Civil Rights lost the Democrats the South. Dannymac - 05/08/2010 03:44:56 PM 734 Views
but it was done by congress passing laws and the president signing those laws random thoughts - 05/08/2010 04:20:19 PM 683 Views
uhm, what? LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 04:24:43 PM 671 Views
those were mostly rulings up holding laws not stiking them down random thoughts - 05/08/2010 05:05:15 PM 741 Views
I was under the impression that the supreme court had a role in it snoopcester - 05/08/2010 04:31:51 PM 660 Views
but the court was not over turning the laws passed by congress random thoughts - 05/08/2010 05:11:06 PM 706 Views
No, like in this case, isn't it? snoopcester - 05/08/2010 05:24:19 PM 652 Views
I would say that is another case of judicial activism and shows the danger of the practice random thoughts - 05/08/2010 05:43:02 PM 619 Views
Which one is? I imagine from different view points both are. snoopcester - 06/08/2010 10:34:11 AM 620 Views
The law wasn't constitutional. Dannymac - 07/08/2010 06:17:04 AM 657 Views
well it will take a higher court to decide that random thoughts - 09/08/2010 10:46:15 PM 687 Views
Hard to believe it's the same governor who said "Gay marriage should be between a man and a woman." *NM* TaskmasterJack - 04/08/2010 11:05:45 PM 458 Views
Or "Iff it bleeds we can kill itt!" *NM* ironclad - 04/08/2010 11:14:45 PM 433 Views
Another step in the right direction. *NM* snoopcester - 04/08/2010 11:08:15 PM 453 Views
Link to the full court order inside: Dreaded Anomaly - 04/08/2010 11:43:29 PM 844 Views
The judge quoting Scalia in favour of gay marriage is fairly amusing. Legolas - 04/08/2010 11:50:47 PM 722 Views
What page was that on? Tim - 05/08/2010 11:25:49 AM 639 Views
Nah, it was way above page 109, in the findings of fact somewhere. Legolas - 05/08/2010 12:37:48 PM 743 Views
Oh, that is brilliant. Tim - 05/08/2010 01:12:21 PM 647 Views
Pretty much. Legolas - 05/08/2010 01:44:22 PM 774 Views
I've always wondered what basis there is for banning necrophilia if "it's disgusting" is invalid. Tim - 05/08/2010 01:51:19 PM 722 Views
because you cannot give consent when you are dead? Camilla - 05/08/2010 03:04:46 PM 710 Views
what if you give consent while you are still alive? random thoughts - 05/08/2010 03:21:59 PM 811 Views
Is it then illegal? Camilla - 05/08/2010 03:23:46 PM 729 Views
given I imagine the pro-necrophilia lobby isn't strong in numbers or influence snoopcester - 05/08/2010 03:33:11 PM 782 Views
Re: given I imagine the pro-necrophilia lobby isn't strong in numbers or influence Camilla - 05/08/2010 03:34:57 PM 825 Views
I would think it would be illegal even then random thoughts - 05/08/2010 03:34:31 PM 743 Views
Wikipedia to the rescue! Legolas - 05/08/2010 04:20:15 PM 869 Views
you would hope the other states would cover it under improper treatmentof human remains random thoughts - 05/08/2010 07:38:59 PM 688 Views
A dead body is just an object, not a person with rights. Tom - 05/08/2010 03:27:08 PM 731 Views
Yes, but Camilla - 06/08/2010 08:42:05 AM 684 Views
Absolutely not. Tom - 06/08/2010 03:21:14 PM 737 Views
not to mention necrophilia has a large potential to be hazardous to health. LadyLorraine - 06/08/2010 09:42:43 PM 784 Views
That was a very well written judgement. Tim - 05/08/2010 11:24:38 AM 737 Views
Tom - 05/08/2010 12:10:02 AM 732 Views
Totally agree. Rebekah - 05/08/2010 01:01:42 PM 776 Views
+1 *NM* LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 03:42:08 PM 398 Views
Irrelevant decision.....this was heading to SCOTUS from day 1 *NM* trzaska2000 - 05/08/2010 12:53:26 AM 413 Views
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