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Now, then.... Joel Send a noteboard - 05/08/2010 02:09:34 PM
And not just for you. That said, I suspect the problem is more one of myopia than unions. Perhaps as simple as our old friend Mr. Alienation.

I guess it's just easy to blame the unions up here because they are one of a limited number of giants in the land. If the unions dislike something, it dies. Costco, Boeing, and Microsoft also share that status. Something about being a major provider of jobs and a major holder of liquid assets meant to be used on political campaigns.

Makes sense to me. Any place you have that kind of heavy hitter it makes for a very tilted playing field. Which is why the unions got smacked just as hard by Mcain-Feingold as corporate America did; when you put it that way it's a wonder it even made it out of committee, let alone became law. Not that it matters much now. How many laws or politicians do you think could survive opposition from, say, the oil companies or ranchers here? ;)
To a disturbing degree, many, most, Americans don't see themselves as part of a community anymore (after all, that's the root word in "communism" and we all know that's bad; all things collective are, as Ayn Rand wisely taught us. ;)) Hence the people gunning for your Senator are only looking at how this one vote stands to hurt them; the sacrifices that would otherwise be required of other groups aren't their concern. Of course, if the Legislature had simply decided to raise taxes enough that they didn't have to cut any services or jobs, they'd have a completely different demographic screaming for their heads for precisely the same reason.

Exactly... here in WA the only time the truly conservative voters get active is when taxes are raised. That's also when the independents and weak democrats shift to the right. If my Senator had voted for more taxes, she'd be facing a stronger opposition from the Right, as would many other incumbents.

Catch 22, which is why the state party did the sensible thing and let endangered legislators vote against it--but that was only possible if the REST of them voted for it.
They're not seeing all the positive things your Senator does that only affect them tangentially, or remembering all the times she was on their side, since that's ancient history now. Remember, in politics it's "what have you done for me lately?" Unions happen to be robust enough in WA, apparently, that they have the financial and political clout to single-handedly win elections, but I assure you that's not the case nationally. Last I checked (and that was the mid-nineties) national union membership was around 12% and falling due to the combined effects of shrinking US manufacturing, Taft-Hartley and applying RICO laws to unions as if they were AUTOMATICALLY organized crime. After all, the unions were enraged when Reagan fired striking air traffic controllers thirty years ago, but it didn't change anything (apart from the sudden spike in airplanes landing IN runways instead of ON them. )

The unions are very robust up here. All of the state workers in service roles are unionized, and we've got two or three of Boeing's largest plants, and most of the coastal towns were founded as mill towns... and you see the picture. Unions are very strong up here.

*nods* Stands to reason, I'm just not used to thinking of WA as a big manufacturing center (outside of Boeing, obviously. ) Same problem Michigan's been dealing with for decades; on the other hand, I don't think the popular Southern solution of letting manufacturers run rough shod over labor is a good alternative either. I'm not entirely sure what IS a good alternative, because it seems like most unions today are every bit as political and unresponsive to rank and file members as companies, which often leaves union members caught in the middle as much as anyone. It's all well and good to have collective bargaining, but if the union agrees to terms you don't like, what's your recourse? Print out resumes and start sending them to potential employers.
The fools doorbelled me yesterday... they'd sent two union members around with a kid trying to drum up resentment against my Senator. (First of all, you'd think they'd eliminate campaign staff for the opposition from their list of potential supporters....) When I asked questions about why they were opposing her, their answers became weaker and weaker the deeper I pressed. In the end, it boiled down to "well, we didn't agree with that last vote she made." Which is asinine because every Democrat in a reliable District was forced by party leadership to vote for the budget. The only ones let off were Dems in swing Districts who might lose their seats for the vote.

By that logic you'd think they'd be going after the state party as a whole and openly. Not hard to figure out why they aren't. What IS hard to figure out is why they're cutting their nose off to spite their face; it would serve them right if they end up with an anemic Dem, "liberal" or whatever candidate who gets the crap kicked out of them by a strong Republican in the general.
So, yeah, this time, in this place, it happens to be the unions, but other times and other places it's completely different groups doing exactly the same things for the same reasons. It may be a little more frantic up there because, frankly, US unions are running scared and have been for some time. For a generation the decline of US manufacturing has routinely made them choose between cuts to pay and benefits or unemployment, and as prices rise there's a limit to how much wages can fall before mere survival becomes impossible. Go someplace else and it's ranchers bitching about property taxes, or businesses bitching about regulation, or environmentalists bitching about LACK of regulation, or inner city residents bitching about inadequate school funding. And not one of them gives a dead rats ass about the problems of any of the others.

God love the independent spirit....

There's independent, and then there's selfish, short sighted and mercenary. Unions ought to know better though, since it's that kind of thinking that caused their membership to plummet; back when you were willing to pay a little more for what my union makes so that I could pay a little more for what YOUR union makes we had these things called "housewives" instead of these things called "latchkey kids. " Independence is a great thing, but we can't (couldn't) remain strong and successful as a nation of 300 million individuals. And we won't find our way again that way either; we get there together or not at all.
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Politics and the unions - 01/08/2010 12:17:01 PM 911 Views
Yet another fine example of how unions are detrimental to the nation. *NM* - 01/08/2010 02:14:54 PM 225 Views
Also of how the election system is dreadful, though. *NM* - 01/08/2010 03:41:32 PM 203 Views
I agree with both of you. - 01/08/2010 06:30:22 PM 546 Views
To paraphrase Winston Churchill... - 01/08/2010 06:52:39 PM 564 Views
The man was a genius. - 01/08/2010 06:56:54 PM 531 Views
The man was a ^%^%*^%#$$#$#**! ^%$#%$! $$#$#! ^%^%! ^%(*! &&&(&**&!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - 02/08/2010 06:40:32 AM 601 Views
Hehe... - 03/08/2010 04:39:24 AM 557 Views
Re: Hehe... - 06/08/2010 01:44:51 AM 615 Views
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I'm really not so sure of that. - 01/08/2010 07:18:54 PM 534 Views
This. - 03/08/2010 08:23:35 AM 525 Views
You get in bed with cats (unions), you wake up with fleas. *NM* - 01/08/2010 05:03:58 PM 236 Views
They're impossible to avoid here. - 01/08/2010 06:35:37 PM 569 Views
Re: They're impossible to avoid here. - 03/08/2010 08:24:57 AM 678 Views
That truly sucks, man, sorry. - 02/08/2010 05:32:03 AM 632 Views
Thanks... - 03/08/2010 05:02:19 AM 646 Views
Now, then.... - 05/08/2010 02:09:34 PM 1018 Views
civil service unions are the worst - 02/08/2010 05:58:13 PM 592 Views
hey now. northern california isn't that flaky - 02/08/2010 09:36:57 PM 464 Views
I always considered the bay port of northern califonria - 02/08/2010 10:19:17 PM 520 Views
well i only actually know my family up there - 02/08/2010 10:39:24 PM 513 Views
well of course I wasn't refering them - 03/08/2010 02:34:20 AM 517 Views
and - 03/08/2010 05:58:13 AM 549 Views
Mostly alive... - 03/08/2010 06:01:48 AM 507 Views

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