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Re: Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white? HyogaRott Send a noteboard - 19/04/2010 06:15:26 PM
I live in an apartment, It was the first thing I though of. :)

Yes, I am aware that Herbert was extremely interested in ecology and environmental issues. He spent alot of time learning what a desert is, what causes it, and how to alter it.

Perhaps I misunderstood your point, or framed my disagreement in the wrong way. I percieved you to be appraoching it in what I can best characterize... argh my brain isn't working well today and I know I am going to phrase it badly... change tracks..

The point I am and was trying to make is that Dune is not an environmentalist book as we define the term (conotatively, not denotatively) today, ie the Al Gore, tree-hugger, "we must all preserve the planet and minimize our carbon footprint" BS. The environmental issues of Dune is all about changing the natural state of the planet into something else we would prefer. The complete opposite of what "environmental" means in our current society.

Through his research Herbert was able to craft a rich detailed world for his story to occur in. The very richness of it allows us to see how it impacts and changes the paths of the characters. Other characters are forged in different environments. Once you get past the "environmental" surface though you discover that the environment is not really a message or theme of the book(s), it is the story the humans.

The "theme" is how the different environments forced them to become different from one another. How their forging makes what they do "right" in their eyes, and how all those verious perceptions conflict with one another without any black and white or moral absolutes. How in fact every person is really just a shade of moral grey. Though the novel is titled DUNE, it isn't about the planet, it is about the people. Thast is what makes the novel historically significant. That is what Herbert did that changed the Science Fiction genre.

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Frank Herbert, Dune Chronicles (series reviews within) - 16/04/2010 04:11:40 AM 1966 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 16/04/2010 06:09:49 PM 1083 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 12:08:06 AM 1270 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 02:33:38 PM 1200 Views
I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological" - 18/04/2010 12:13:14 AM 1199 Views
Re: I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological" - 18/04/2010 03:34:33 AM 1253 Views
Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white? - 18/04/2010 05:18:07 AM 1054 Views
Re: Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white? - 19/04/2010 06:15:26 PM 1089 Views
That was most of my issue. - 21/04/2010 12:12:56 AM 962 Views
Re: That was most of my issue. - 21/04/2010 06:33:14 PM 933 Views
Re: That was most of my issue. - 29/04/2010 11:38:26 PM 916 Views
Just because something plays a dominate role doesn't make it a theme - 21/04/2010 02:09:42 PM 1059 Views
A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present - 21/04/2010 11:21:38 PM 991 Views
Re: A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present - 22/04/2010 04:58:01 AM 970 Views
Good points - 22/04/2010 09:19:45 PM 1012 Views
Re: Good points - 22/04/2010 10:55:21 PM 959 Views
when you call it human ecology I come much closer to agreeing - 22/04/2010 02:16:58 PM 990 Views
Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic. - 19/04/2010 07:52:27 PM 1077 Views
Re: Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic. - 20/04/2010 07:04:40 PM 949 Views
You're not using "archaic" correctly - 20/04/2010 10:07:31 PM 944 Views
Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all. - 21/04/2010 01:46:50 AM 838 Views
doesn't that regulate the point down to interesting trivia? - 21/04/2010 02:36:38 PM 992 Views
Re: Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all. - 21/04/2010 06:23:24 PM 1072 Views
Funny the things people focus on - 21/04/2010 11:24:59 PM 963 Views
Re: Funny the things people focus on - 23/04/2010 05:28:54 PM 967 Views
People who see this as an ecological book are missing the point of the book - 16/04/2010 06:28:40 PM 1444 Views
Books can have more than one theme. Great books almost always do. *NM* - 16/04/2010 07:15:11 PM 472 Views
I agree with that I just never really the ecological theme to Dune - 16/04/2010 10:12:26 PM 1144 Views
Ecology goes more than one way - 17/04/2010 12:12:45 AM 1099 Views
There are several points to the book/series - 17/04/2010 12:11:38 AM 1164 Views
Everyone get something different from a book - 19/04/2010 07:01:51 PM 1346 Views
I believe those themes become more pronounced later in the series - 20/04/2010 10:09:36 PM 1111 Views
I remember having hated every single character of this book. Some random thoughts - 17/04/2010 05:08:25 PM 1291 Views
I hope you got to Darwi Odrade - 21/04/2010 03:44:27 PM 987 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 08:05:16 PM 1548 Views
I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 17/04/2010 10:22:27 PM 1347 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 18/04/2010 04:38:10 AM 1300 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 19/04/2010 04:04:43 AM 1225 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 22/04/2010 04:31:26 AM 986 Views
I thought all of Dune had begun as a serial in a SF magazine. *NM* - 22/04/2010 01:58:22 PM 417 Views
And Dune Messiah as well was serialized at first, in Galaxy *NM* - 22/04/2010 09:31:54 PM 421 Views
Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 19/04/2010 08:42:18 AM 1209 Views
Re: Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 21/04/2010 03:33:46 PM 934 Views
I didn't see that in Alia - 21/04/2010 11:27:22 PM 888 Views
One of my favorite series! - 21/04/2010 03:30:57 PM 888 Views
I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it - 21/04/2010 11:29:50 PM 809 Views
Re: I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it - 22/04/2010 04:02:26 PM 929 Views
His style doesn't appeal to me as much, unfortunately - 22/04/2010 09:17:21 PM 815 Views
You might want to track down his short stories one day... - 23/04/2010 02:06:09 PM 1043 Views
Children of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 22/04/2010 06:47:04 AM 1008 Views
See...I think I made a mistake in my reading of Dune - 22/04/2010 07:26:28 AM 983 Views
Depends - 22/04/2010 08:01:39 AM 891 Views
Re: Depends - 22/04/2010 11:12:15 PM 1237 Views
read something else - 23/04/2010 07:49:34 PM 877 Views
LA Times article on Dune (4/18/2010) - 23/04/2010 10:59:00 AM 838 Views
God Emperor of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 25/04/2010 02:03:37 AM 1115 Views
Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 28/04/2010 06:02:54 AM 851 Views
Re: Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 29/04/2010 03:26:28 PM 924 Views
I read the wiki synopses of those two books - 29/04/2010 09:44:07 PM 879 Views
Re: I read the wiki synopses of those two books - 10/05/2010 04:10:49 AM 1229 Views
Chapterhouse: Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 30/04/2010 02:31:10 PM 1035 Views
Re: Chapterhouse: Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 10/05/2010 01:24:33 AM 1078 Views

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