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Its still a game... Jeordam Send a noteboard - 02/02/2010 05:09:42 PM
Graendal would never expect Rand to simply balefire her whole palace out of existence. When Rand sent his messenger, Graendal figured that Rand wanted to "play", while he actually just planned to use brute force.

I agree...there's no reason why she would expect to get nuked. But there is absolutely no reason to believe that she wouldn't have a fast way to get out of dodge.

This is the point of Rand's analogy of two people sitting on a table, one thinks the game starts, but the other just punches the opponent in the face.

But see...Rand did more than sit at that table. He played the first piece & then *waited* for her reaction. There is, what, 20 minutes...maybe more...between when the guy left Graendal & Rand nukes the palace. Are you saying that she couldn't have gotten out of there in that time?


Any other interpretation, namely that Graendal outsmarted Rand, while he was trying to outsmart her, gives the Forsaken too much credit and the Dragon Reborn too less credit.


Not at all. Just because the vast majority of the Forsaken are complete incompetants, doesn't mean that Graendal is. In the grand scheme of the Forsaken, I would put her at the very top of them all when it came to raw brain power. Her only other competitor in the whole thing would be Ishmael, but he's always been a bit too philosophical. Don't look at the titles of the people, but look at who they are. Graendal in and of her own right was an accomplished person who dealt with problems of the mind which channeling couldn't heal. That's *huge*. She was accomplished outside of her channling abilities. How many others can say that among the Forsaken?

So over to Rand. Yes, he's got Lews Therin in his brain, but its not as though the transition is smooth or even...real? Instead, you have the sheep herder & the past life of an awsome man. I think that you give him too much credit in thinking that he could completely out think one of the greatest minds from the Age of Legends. After all...it can be very much said that Graendal actually does know Rand/LT better than he knows himself.

~Jeordam
ex-Admin at wotmania (all things wot & art galleries)
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
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So your name is Graendal.... Jeordam - 01/02/2010 09:18:00 PM 1675 Views
one of the reasons I'm at a loss with her death ... along with the lead-up being clumsy *NM* darius_sedai - 01/02/2010 09:36:29 PM 704 Views
She very well... Jeordam - 01/02/2010 11:13:50 PM 947 Views
Exactly how I feel ... to the letter! *NM* darius_sedai - 01/02/2010 11:17:57 PM 564 Views
Re: She very well... jiggy - 02/02/2010 08:42:17 AM 876 Views
Ha! "Graendal actually kills Asmodean". A very bold claim. *NM* Etzel - 02/02/2010 10:51:40 AM 602 Views
Bold like saying that water is wet.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 05:46:54 PM 593 Views
I am now split with a 80% belief it's Graendal and 20% that it's Moghedien *NM* RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 06:11:47 PM 393 Views
Moghedien.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:15:41 PM 686 Views
The a'dam doesn't limit your ability to enter T'A'R RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 06:36:26 PM 642 Views
Yeah..... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:46:50 PM 845 Views
Re: Yeah..... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 07:42:59 PM 636 Views
This brings up a very intersting question... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 09:30:49 PM 854 Views
Re: This brings up a very intersting question... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 09:57:24 PM 651 Views
Moghedien? Really? fionwe1987 - 02/02/2010 07:56:33 PM 723 Views
when was Semirhage in an a'dam? *NM* darius_sedai - 02/02/2010 08:48:27 PM 390 Views
Re: Moghedien? Really? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 09:03:54 PM 645 Views
Egwene was faintly forkrooted, not heavily. Fanatic-Templar - 02/02/2010 10:24:55 PM 644 Views
It was heavy enough to nullify her ability almost completely by TGS RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 10:38:04 PM 559 Views
That's still extremely faint. Fanatic-Templar - 02/02/2010 11:07:10 PM 642 Views
Re: That's still extremely faint. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2010 03:34:06 PM 689 Views
Re: Moghedien? Really? fionwe1987 - 03/02/2010 01:02:13 AM 588 Views
Re: Moghedien? Really? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2010 03:31:21 PM 804 Views
The chance that Moggy killed Asmo is actually 0 % Etzel - 02/02/2010 09:32:03 PM 715 Views
*nods* Jeordam - 02/02/2010 09:36:04 PM 547 Views
Well, I completely disagree, but that's another discussion. *NM* Etzel - 02/02/2010 07:07:05 PM 374 Views
Yes, I agree. *NM* RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 03:26:13 PM 512 Views
As bad as Sammael's death. *NM* Kieran - 03/02/2010 02:00:02 AM 370 Views
The lead up was clumsy because her death scene was rather forced. Libby - 09/02/2010 11:11:21 PM 797 Views
Yes, pretty much. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 01/02/2010 11:21:31 PM 696 Views
Couple of flaws in that reasoning Lord Haart - 02/02/2010 07:56:35 AM 976 Views
Graendal already has a massive inverted ward around the palace. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 03:23:44 PM 747 Views
Come on now.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 04:58:34 PM 892 Views
IMO Sareitha Sedai - 02/02/2010 05:58:10 PM 698 Views
This could go either way.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:14:21 PM 841 Views
RE: Strength and Compulsion RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 06:31:13 PM 847 Views
I never figured that Verin was weak....or even middling. Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:57:11 PM 724 Views
Re: I never figured that Verin was weak....or even middling. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 07:51:15 PM 713 Views
Verin was using her angreal when she compelled. *NM* fionwe1987 - 02/02/2010 08:00:50 PM 420 Views
Danke for clarification. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 08:15:39 PM 577 Views
The thing is... Etzel - 02/02/2010 09:39:18 AM 704 Views
Its still a game... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 05:09:42 PM 734 Views
I could buy... Etzel - 02/02/2010 07:16:43 PM 682 Views
Please, Artsapat - 02/02/2010 10:42:00 AM 690 Views
*ha* Jeordam - 02/02/2010 05:10:41 PM 639 Views
My name is Graendal? My parents will be so confused. TaskmasterJack - 02/02/2010 02:19:26 PM 662 Views
So what would you say... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 05:12:09 PM 638 Views
Wow. Sareitha Sedai - 02/02/2010 06:00:11 PM 701 Views
Never underestimate.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:08:42 PM 621 Views
"Oh, no... Rand is totally going to balefire me!" *NM* TaskmasterJack - 03/02/2010 08:50:26 PM 358 Views
A conclusion with an explanation built around it. Fanatic-Templar - 02/02/2010 10:22:29 PM 739 Views
Hah! RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 10:38:38 PM 566 Views
I miss Diomedes . *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 02/02/2010 11:07:45 PM 331 Views
So...like the theory of Macro Evolution? People seem to believe that..... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 11:22:41 PM 731 Views
... Fanatic-Templar - 03/02/2010 01:23:06 AM 638 Views
Ok...I'm just saying... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 04:00:46 PM 813 Views
I don't mean to make any generalisations about you, and I'm sorry if that's what I sounded like. Fanatic-Templar - 04/02/2010 12:24:34 AM 673 Views
That's ridiculous rAndy aL - 02/02/2010 11:39:41 PM 686 Views
Hold on now.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 11:51:32 PM 844 Views
Re: Hold on now.... Lord Haart - 03/02/2010 02:52:07 AM 673 Views
Re: Hold on now.... darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 08:59:44 PM 703 Views
Re: Hold on now.... Lord Haart - 04/02/2010 04:44:31 AM 612 Views
Your theory breaks down because of something Brandon said. Logain - 03/02/2010 03:49:58 AM 622 Views
Kind of Lord Haart - 03/02/2010 04:10:04 AM 694 Views
I disagree. Gher - 03/02/2010 05:31:39 AM 569 Views
But how many previously unseen weaves have had such huge implications? Lord Haart - 03/02/2010 01:29:15 PM 845 Views
Two things come to mind... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 03:50:38 PM 766 Views
I don't really think this is relevant Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 05:03:51 PM 683 Views
There's a difference.... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 06:01:30 PM 734 Views
I know there is. You're the one who brought up the weaves being picked apart Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 06:37:40 PM 712 Views
*grins* Jeordam - 03/02/2010 06:42:54 PM 727 Views
But again... Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 06:59:18 PM 647 Views
sure we do darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 07:03:40 PM 591 Views
Each of them was at the very least confused/disoriented afterwards. Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 07:14:24 PM 576 Views
But here's the thing... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 07:36:42 PM 689 Views
I think we disagree with what "subtle" means here. Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 07:46:20 PM 616 Views
Kerb was more subtle than most, but we've seen subtler. Gher - 04/02/2010 05:16:33 PM 815 Views
Re: Each of them was at the very least confused/disoriented afterwards. darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 07:37:58 PM 567 Views
... Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 07:42:07 PM 646 Views
Re: ... darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 07:59:26 PM 611 Views
But Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 08:04:27 PM 711 Views
I think it would be obvious if Ituralde was acting different darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 08:18:50 PM 859 Views
Hrm Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 08:36:12 PM 795 Views
It happens in WH when they go to tell her that Moridin is N'B darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 08:43:11 PM 658 Views
Thanks *NM* Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 08:47:29 PM 367 Views
Now try and not lynch me... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 04:08:11 PM 688 Views
But that's not how it happened BlackAdder - 03/02/2010 08:18:59 PM 677 Views
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