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Re: But that means she's dead Heiko Send a noteboard - 26/01/2010 05:31:25 AM
In my opinion, the greatest argument in favor of Graendal being alive is pretty simple, though I dunno if anyone has mentioned it yet.

Graendal knows firsthand (through her experience with Sammael) that Rand does NOT ally with Forsaken (or any perceived enemy, for that matter). Were Rand to send an emissary to Graendal (as he did), she would know that he had no intention of talk or allegiance - Rand was letting the nobles know of his intentions, not asking for approval. That SHOULD have tipped her off immediately.

So Graendal receives a direct emissary of Rand in her, according to Rand and co., long-forgotten palace (though preciously known to all several books prior...). She Compels said emissary and, after an INCREDIBLY short amount of time, sends him back on his merry little way.

Iono... If Graendal is actually dead, then I... well, the Last Battle is already over.


If she Compels the emissary, then she's dead since the Compulsion disappears.


Assuming it was Graendal who Compelled him, yes.
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Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story. - 25/01/2010 05:18:23 PM 2732 Views
I think Graendal's death was a great scene - 25/01/2010 05:26:51 PM 1465 Views
The scene itself was great. The rest is crap. - 25/01/2010 05:37:44 PM 1264 Views
After reading 12 WoT books... - 25/01/2010 05:46:31 PM 1364 Views
You also ignored... - 25/01/2010 08:15:34 PM 1374 Views
and of course, the obvious theme - 25/01/2010 09:02:56 PM 1181 Views
Bah! - 25/01/2010 11:49:33 PM 1331 Views
It's possible that this was mainly written by BS - 26/01/2010 12:03:03 PM 1299 Views
I agree that the set up for her death was rather lame - 25/01/2010 06:14:07 PM 1531 Views
I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. - 25/01/2010 06:18:30 PM 1329 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. - 25/01/2010 06:44:34 PM 1265 Views
well one of her major character parallels is Josef Mengel - 25/01/2010 06:54:43 PM 1085 Views
Can you think of any way that would explain the Compulsion vanishing? - 25/01/2010 07:52:40 PM 1081 Views
that's kind of my whole point - 25/01/2010 08:43:19 PM 1014 Views
Uh, not actually at all really - 25/01/2010 09:07:52 PM 1316 Views
*shudders* - 26/01/2010 02:27:35 AM 1183 Views
*shrugs* - 26/01/2010 08:47:21 AM 1223 Views
None of those "easy explanations" could work - 26/01/2010 07:14:16 AM 1117 Views
my entire problem with the scene is that it just felt too open ended - 26/01/2010 08:58:37 AM 1208 Views
Can't she knot it to disapate after being examined once? - 26/01/2010 03:43:55 AM 1045 Views
Do we have evidence that this is possible? - 26/01/2010 03:44:48 AM 1213 Views
why would Graendal do that anyway? - 26/01/2010 04:26:38 AM 1212 Views
Re: why would Graendal do that anyway? - 03/02/2010 02:52:32 AM 1159 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. - 26/01/2010 02:03:51 AM 1278 Views
I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. - 26/01/2010 07:38:40 AM 1029 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. - 26/01/2010 08:49:00 AM 1223 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive. - 26/01/2010 09:19:35 AM 1009 Views
- 26/01/2010 11:42:04 AM 1217 Views
Didn't Balthamel and Aginor leave corpses? - 26/01/2010 04:35:19 PM 1198 Views
Re: Didn't Balthamel and Aginor leave corpses? - 26/01/2010 07:06:01 PM 1074 Views
Re: - 26/01/2010 04:44:06 PM 1188 Views
He was balefired by a direct stream in front of at least two credible witnesses. - 26/01/2010 04:10:13 PM 1186 Views
Me, Too. - 28/01/2010 08:00:09 PM 1183 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead. - 25/01/2010 08:56:16 PM 1295 Views
I believe she's dead - 25/01/2010 09:06:37 PM 1132 Views
Re: I believe she's dead - 25/01/2010 09:09:58 PM 1179 Views
I don't think she would have taught anyone - 25/01/2010 09:18:03 PM 999 Views
The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene! - 25/01/2010 11:54:02 PM 1300 Views
Re: The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene! - 26/01/2010 01:22:57 AM 1052 Views
Stop passing judgments... - 26/01/2010 02:05:21 AM 1241 Views
But your theories are becoming increasingly farfetched - 26/01/2010 04:21:21 AM 1112 Views
I repeat that I find her "death" monumental... - 26/01/2010 07:16:13 PM 1088 Views
Re: I repeat that I find her "death" monumental... - 26/01/2010 07:23:29 PM 1125 Views
Dude, then you derailed the thread... - 26/01/2010 07:31:55 PM 1033 Views
Not really - 26/01/2010 07:35:06 PM 1133 Views
Re: Not really - 26/01/2010 07:45:20 PM 1195 Views
Re: Not really - 28/01/2010 04:27:17 PM 1119 Views
Re: Stop passing judgments... - 26/01/2010 04:40:37 PM 1087 Views
*NM* - 26/01/2010 05:00:10 PM 599 Views
Everyone can see residues- only a select few can "read" them - 26/01/2010 07:42:19 AM 1148 Views
no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place - 26/01/2010 08:51:31 AM 1049 Views
Re: no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place - 26/01/2010 11:37:26 AM 1177 Views
read the whole quote - 26/01/2010 04:35:17 PM 882 Views
LOL! You read the whole quote - 26/01/2010 07:00:41 PM 998 Views
the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together. - 27/01/2010 12:40:09 AM 1070 Views
Re: the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together. - 28/01/2010 04:28:21 PM 1209 Views
I don't see any flaws. - 25/01/2010 09:14:44 PM 1249 Views
But... - 25/01/2010 11:44:49 PM 1003 Views
Re: But... - 26/01/2010 01:14:51 AM 1143 Views
That is what I thought ... - 26/01/2010 01:24:18 AM 1055 Views
That still doesn't make sense. - 26/01/2010 02:23:12 AM 1234 Views
But, having a clean up guy does make sense. - 26/01/2010 03:02:13 AM 1269 Views
But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy! - 26/01/2010 03:35:44 AM 1119 Views
Re: But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy! - 26/01/2010 04:12:41 AM 1049 Views
Nonsense. - 26/01/2010 07:50:04 AM 986 Views
Dude, read what I said please... - 26/01/2010 07:21:52 PM 1164 Views
Re: Dude, read what I said please... - 26/01/2010 09:28:25 PM 1146 Views
Kerb had no initiative... he was under too heavy a Compulsion to think for himself - 27/01/2010 12:45:47 AM 1034 Views
I think he had some, albeit probably not a whole lot - 27/01/2010 01:03:44 AM 1089 Views
Nynaeve and Elayne were under a weaker compulsion... - 27/01/2010 03:10:52 AM 909 Views
We don't know that, exactly - 27/01/2010 03:50:44 AM 982 Views
If you cannot provide an answer... - 27/01/2010 03:10:40 AM 1061 Views
Seriously? - 27/01/2010 03:55:57 AM 1082 Views
Maybe... - 27/01/2010 11:08:10 AM 1049 Views
Messenger was running around being obvious. Noone would suspect Kerb though. Case Closed. *NM* - 26/01/2010 11:08:16 AM 747 Views
Thank the creator you're not in the police then. *NM* - 26/01/2010 07:22:29 PM 689 Views
Ok, in more detail: - 26/01/2010 08:16:30 PM 1165 Views
I'm tired of making this point... - 26/01/2010 08:39:22 PM 902 Views
Re: I'm tired of making this point... - 26/01/2010 08:44:51 PM 1081 Views
Thoughts - 26/01/2010 01:05:45 AM 1001 Views
But that means she's dead - 26/01/2010 01:20:19 AM 1041 Views
Re: But that means she's dead - 26/01/2010 05:31:25 AM 1138 Views
Nope. Ramshalan was just "collecting taxes" or something. - 26/01/2010 11:10:25 AM 981 Views
Re: Nope. Ramshalan was NOT just "collecting taxes" or something. - 26/01/2010 05:41:17 PM 1056 Views
By, the way, if I understand this correctly... - 26/01/2010 04:49:45 PM 1217 Views
Indeed... - 26/01/2010 05:13:53 PM 1229 Views
Re: Indeed... - 26/01/2010 07:04:40 PM 1049 Views
I'm not arguing she's alive, but... - 26/01/2010 07:29:42 PM 1068 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... - 26/01/2010 07:58:41 PM 1051 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... - 26/01/2010 09:42:52 PM 867 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... - 27/01/2010 03:26:46 AM 1082 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... - 27/01/2010 04:05:23 AM 1191 Views
That's not fair - 27/01/2010 04:09:38 AM 1030 Views
I agree about the 'awesome' part . - 27/01/2010 05:41:00 AM 1009 Views
I just think it's funny that what you call omniscience has been done by the Forsaken before. - 27/01/2010 02:02:44 PM 1002 Views
But Graendal was the victim of a greater plot. - 27/01/2010 05:30:28 PM 1106 Views
So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal. - 27/01/2010 05:57:20 PM 1169 Views
Give me one example. Just one. *NM* - 27/01/2010 06:52:44 PM 714 Views
Ishamael plans millennia ahead by sowing the seeds for the Black Ajah, the Seanchan and the current - 28/01/2010 01:57:39 PM 1165 Views
Not even comparable. - 28/01/2010 06:31:06 PM 937 Views
Re: Not even comparable. - 28/01/2010 07:50:38 PM 1052 Views
Could you please take the effort to read my posts? - 28/01/2010 10:45:01 PM 1003 Views
Re: Could you please take the effort to read my posts? - 29/01/2010 03:49:43 PM 1051 Views
Re: Could you please take the effort to read my posts? - 29/01/2010 06:40:43 PM 1035 Views
And, just to double post: - 27/01/2010 07:12:17 PM 819 Views
Re: And, just to double post: - 27/01/2010 08:25:45 PM 1083 Views
Nice answer. - 28/01/2010 12:10:27 AM 1142 Views
Re: Nice answer. - 28/01/2010 01:55:16 PM 1073 Views
Hilarious. - 28/01/2010 06:36:22 PM 1179 Views
Re: Hilarious. - 28/01/2010 07:15:20 PM 1078 Views
Re: Hilarious. - 28/01/2010 07:41:29 PM 1085 Views
Re: Hilarious. - 28/01/2010 07:53:34 PM 939 Views
Re: Hilarious. - 28/01/2010 10:55:57 PM 1118 Views
That's because you didn't look at other posts. - 29/01/2010 03:37:08 PM 1069 Views
Moridin's main directive was.. - 29/01/2010 03:57:41 PM 1105 Views
Re: Moridin's main directive was.. - 29/01/2010 04:50:16 PM 1145 Views
Preventing order wasn't accomplished... - 29/01/2010 05:12:22 PM 1105 Views
I disagree. - 29/01/2010 05:28:59 PM 1501 Views
You expect me to search every post you've made on this forum, ever? - 29/01/2010 06:50:49 PM 1027 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... - 27/01/2010 01:00:42 AM 1055 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... - 27/01/2010 03:26:56 AM 1102 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but... - 27/01/2010 05:35:39 AM 1075 Views
I don't see a flaw - 27/01/2010 06:24:44 AM 1163 Views
Re: I don't see a flaw - 27/01/2010 04:18:27 PM 1110 Views
Let's give you one logic path for Millisair being poisoned. - 27/01/2010 05:47:04 PM 1097 Views
Spot on. *NM* - 28/01/2010 04:09:26 AM 705 Views
I don't think there's a flaw, I think you misinterpret Graendal's plans - 27/01/2010 06:57:44 PM 1081 Views
Good point on Ituralde - he may still be Compulsed in ways we're yet to discover. *NM* - 28/01/2010 04:11:15 AM 687 Views
Compulsion is limited - 28/01/2010 04:30:24 PM 1060 Views
Re: Compulsion is limited - 28/01/2010 06:35:05 PM 1193 Views
Re: Compulsion is limited - 28/01/2010 08:26:37 PM 968 Views
Re: Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story. - 27/01/2010 09:11:32 PM 1057 Views
There's really no further purpose for her character. - 09/02/2010 10:52:58 PM 1141 Views

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