It completely surprised me that Rand would really balefire a whole palace and thus showed that Rand became very unscrupulous in his war against the Shadow. That Rand came up with the idea to prove Graendal's death with balefire & Compulsion was also very clever.
It was.
If Nynaeve hadn't find Graendal's spy in time, and if she hadn't successfully dispelled the Compulsion to get the name of Graendal's hiding place, Rand wouldn't have learned where Graendal is. Graendal isn't that stupid, but - like the other Forsaken - she is also far from the genius that some readers consider her to be. Therefore she was outsmarted by Rand.
Again, you make no sense. If Graendal's plan hinged on no one being able to dispel her compulsion, then she wouldn't have needed to have the messenger killed.
If it hinges on Nynaeve no finding Kerb, that again makes no sense. Why have Kerb poison the merchant in the first place? Had Nynaeve not gone that night, the merchant would have died in a few days. Then what? Rand would have gotten suspicious.
Kerb poisoning the merchant is what gets me. Either its a ploy by Graendal, or else either RJ or Brandon came up with a really cheap way to let Nynaeve find the hiding place, and did not put any thought into it at all.
Graendal doesn't have to be a genius at all to not make this kind of mistake. It stank of idiocy the very first time I read it, and I make no claims to being a genius.
Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story.
- 25/01/2010 05:18:23 PM
2750 Views
I think Graendal's death was a great scene
- 25/01/2010 05:26:51 PM
1481 Views
The scene itself was great. The rest is crap.
- 25/01/2010 05:37:44 PM
1280 Views
After reading 12 WoT books...
- 25/01/2010 05:46:31 PM
1379 Views
I think playing too many games just messes up with the integrety and solidness of the books ...
- 26/01/2010 09:46:16 PM
2771 Views
I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
- 25/01/2010 06:18:30 PM
1339 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
- 25/01/2010 06:44:34 PM
1276 Views
well one of her major character parallels is Josef Mengel
- 25/01/2010 06:54:43 PM
1098 Views
Can you think of any way that would explain the Compulsion vanishing?
- 25/01/2010 07:52:40 PM
1100 Views
that's kind of my whole point
- 25/01/2010 08:43:19 PM
1026 Views
None of those "easy explanations" could work
- 26/01/2010 07:14:16 AM
1138 Views
my entire problem with the scene is that it just felt too open ended
- 26/01/2010 08:58:37 AM
1213 Views
Can't she knot it to disapate after being examined once?
- 26/01/2010 03:43:55 AM
1059 Views
Do we have evidence that this is possible?
- 26/01/2010 03:44:48 AM
1222 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
- 26/01/2010 02:03:51 AM
1292 Views
I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive.
- 26/01/2010 07:38:40 AM
1044 Views
- 26/01/2010 11:42:04 AM
1228 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive.
- 26/01/2010 08:49:00 AM
1247 Views
Re: I'm glad you think Be'lal is alive.
- 26/01/2010 09:19:35 AM
1025 Views
Moiraine probably learned it while researching with Adealas and Vandene. *NM*
- 26/01/2010 04:57:09 PM
849 Views
- 26/01/2010 11:42:04 AM
1228 Views
He was balefired by a direct stream in front of at least two credible witnesses.
- 26/01/2010 04:10:13 PM
1199 Views
Re: I agree and have my own additional notes as to why I don't think she is dead.
- 25/01/2010 08:56:16 PM
1312 Views
I believe she's dead
- 25/01/2010 09:06:37 PM
1148 Views
Re: I believe she's dead
- 25/01/2010 09:09:58 PM
1193 Views
Besides, if it wasn't Graendal, it implies that she knew of Rand's plan, which is not feasible *NM*
- 26/01/2010 02:01:41 PM
637 Views
The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene!
- 25/01/2010 11:54:02 PM
1320 Views
Re: The compulsion did not disappear immediately. Read the damned scene!
- 26/01/2010 01:22:57 AM
1070 Views
Stop passing judgments...
- 26/01/2010 02:05:21 AM
1259 Views
But your theories are becoming increasingly farfetched
- 26/01/2010 04:21:21 AM
1131 Views
I repeat that I find her "death" monumental...
- 26/01/2010 07:16:13 PM
1107 Views
Re: I repeat that I find her "death" monumental...
- 26/01/2010 07:23:29 PM
1137 Views
Dude, then you derailed the thread...
- 26/01/2010 07:31:55 PM
1041 Views
*NM*
no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place
- 26/01/2010 08:51:31 AM
1069 Views
Re: no she said she wouldn't risk strength and skill in the same place
- 26/01/2010 11:37:26 AM
1195 Views
read the whole quote
- 26/01/2010 04:35:17 PM
893 Views
LOL! You read the whole quote
- 26/01/2010 07:00:41 PM
1006 Views
the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together.
- 27/01/2010 12:40:09 AM
1085 Views
Re: the risk she won't take is strength and skill residing together.
- 28/01/2010 04:28:21 PM
1224 Views
I don't see any flaws.
- 25/01/2010 09:14:44 PM
1260 Views
But...
- 25/01/2010 11:44:49 PM
1013 Views
Re: But...
- 26/01/2010 01:14:51 AM
1152 Views
That still doesn't make sense.
- 26/01/2010 02:23:12 AM
1246 Views
But, having a clean up guy does make sense. 
- 26/01/2010 03:02:13 AM
1282 Views
- 26/01/2010 03:02:13 AM
1282 Views
But the clean up guy would require another clean up guy!
- 26/01/2010 03:35:44 AM
1131 Views
Nonsense.
- 26/01/2010 07:50:04 AM
999 Views
Dude, read what I said please...
- 26/01/2010 07:21:52 PM
1181 Views
Re: Dude, read what I said please...
- 26/01/2010 09:28:25 PM
1165 Views
Kerb had no initiative... he was under too heavy a Compulsion to think for himself
- 27/01/2010 12:45:47 AM
1051 Views
I think he had some, albeit probably not a whole lot
- 27/01/2010 01:03:44 AM
1105 Views
Messenger was running around being obvious. Noone would suspect Kerb though. Case Closed. *NM*
- 26/01/2010 11:08:16 AM
753 Views
Thank the creator you're not in the police then. *NM*
- 26/01/2010 07:22:29 PM
692 Views
Ok, in more detail:
- 26/01/2010 08:16:30 PM
1174 Views
Thoughts
- 26/01/2010 01:05:45 AM
1015 Views
Nope. Ramshalan was just "collecting taxes" or something.
- 26/01/2010 11:10:25 AM
993 Views
Re: Nope. Ramshalan was NOT just "collecting taxes" or something.
- 26/01/2010 05:41:17 PM
1064 Views
By, the way, if I understand this correctly...
- 26/01/2010 04:49:45 PM
1229 Views
I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 26/01/2010 07:29:42 PM
1078 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 26/01/2010 09:42:52 PM
884 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 27/01/2010 03:26:46 AM
1091 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 27/01/2010 04:05:23 AM
1202 Views
That's not fair
- 27/01/2010 04:09:38 AM
1040 Views
I agree about the 'awesome' part 
.
- 27/01/2010 05:41:00 AM
1017 Views
.
- 27/01/2010 05:41:00 AM
1017 Views
Does anybody have a link to it? (nothing on Google). I'm intrigued. *NM*
- 27/01/2010 08:27:13 AM
647 Views
It was on Wotmania. Someone copied all the theories, but I don't recall whom. *NM*
- 27/01/2010 08:31:00 AM
780 Views
I just think it's funny that what you call omniscience has been done by the Forsaken before.
- 27/01/2010 02:02:44 PM
1015 Views
But Graendal was the victim of a greater plot.
- 27/01/2010 05:30:28 PM
1123 Views
So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal.
- 27/01/2010 05:57:20 PM
1187 Views
Re: So your response is that Ishamael/Moridin is omniscient, not Graendal.
- 28/01/2010 04:05:21 AM
1208 Views
Give me one example. Just one. *NM*
- 27/01/2010 06:52:44 PM
719 Views
Ishamael plans millennia ahead by sowing the seeds for the Black Ajah, the Seanchan and the current
- 28/01/2010 01:57:39 PM
1187 Views
Not even comparable.
- 28/01/2010 06:31:06 PM
948 Views
Re: Not even comparable.
- 28/01/2010 07:50:38 PM
1059 Views
Could you please take the effort to read my posts?
- 28/01/2010 10:45:01 PM
1014 Views
And, just to double post:
- 27/01/2010 07:12:17 PM
831 Views
Re: And, just to double post:
- 27/01/2010 08:25:45 PM
1107 Views
Nice answer.
- 28/01/2010 12:10:27 AM
1157 Views
Re: Nice answer.
- 28/01/2010 01:55:16 PM
1086 Views
Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 06:36:22 PM
1195 Views
Re: Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 07:15:20 PM
1085 Views
Re: Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 07:41:29 PM
1100 Views
Re: Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 07:53:34 PM
950 Views
Re: Hilarious.
- 28/01/2010 10:55:57 PM
1134 Views
That's because you didn't look at other posts.
- 29/01/2010 03:37:08 PM
1084 Views
Moridin's main directive was..
- 29/01/2010 03:57:41 PM
1118 Views
Re: Moridin's main directive was..
- 29/01/2010 04:50:16 PM
1159 Views
Preventing order wasn't accomplished...
- 29/01/2010 05:12:22 PM
1124 Views
I disagree.
- 29/01/2010 05:28:59 PM
1509 Views
I will stop our discussion here; the posts are already pushed too far to the right of my display. *NM*
- 29/01/2010 06:14:29 PM
582 Views
*NM*
- 29/01/2010 06:14:29 PM
582 Views
You expect me to search every post you've made on this forum, ever?
- 29/01/2010 06:50:49 PM
1043 Views
Re: I'm not arguing she's alive, but...
- 27/01/2010 01:00:42 AM
1065 Views
I don't see a flaw
- 27/01/2010 06:24:44 AM
1177 Views
Re: I don't see a flaw
- 27/01/2010 04:18:27 PM
1123 Views
Yup, I'm tired of seeing arguments that ignore the need to back up their own claims.
- 27/01/2010 05:47:16 PM
1088 Views
I don't think there's a flaw, I think you misinterpret Graendal's plans
- 27/01/2010 06:57:44 PM
1094 Views
Good point on Ituralde - he may still be Compulsed in ways we're yet to discover. *NM*
- 28/01/2010 04:11:15 AM
693 Views
Re: Graendal's death would imply a major logical flaw in the story.
- 27/01/2010 09:11:32 PM
1077 Views