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Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention Cannoli Send a noteboard - 18/01/2010 01:00:23 PM
Even Angelmar? Even Hurin? On a purely clinical basis, I agree that the army has shown little in the way of good faith towards Rand - but that's only considering half the equation.
And the only half worth considering.

The Borderlanders have been protecting Randland for a Millennia. Finally, the Dragon is reborn and they expect some support, but until the end of KoD, there is none. Instead, they hear about more trouble to the south - the False Dragon Taim who had killed thousands of Saldeans has been made the HEAD of a legion of insane male channellers, all by order of the Dragon, the man they are relying on. The White Tower is split and offers no support, the other countries are reeling from the Seanchan and Aiel invasions, so isn't it logical for the Borderlanders to assume that the real threat isn't in Trolloc hordes (especially if 50 channelers can kill 100,000 Trollocs a la KoD), but rather in the dissension and division to the south.
I fully understand this, and have justified their position at length elsewhere. But if we have to excuse their ignorance, we have to give Rand the same benefit. He has no more way of knowing their good intentions than they have of knowing his.

If Rand was completely sane, he would immediately see this. But his astrologically-proportioned ego and paranoia are blinding him.
He is the one indispensible figure in the struggle against the Shadow. His ego is not out of proportion when this fact is taken into consideration. And it isn't paranoia if they really ARE out to get you. Everywhere Rand turns, people are lashing out at him in favor of their own interests. He gave the Borderlanders a chance. He owes them no more than that.

So instead of at least asking Hurin to bring him more information, he considers destroying an entire city and army camp. Not everyone in that camp is even a soldier - many are cooks, cleaners, wives (who we are told accompany their husbands in the case of Saldea), children, who have all been led their by trusted monarchs who have never done wrong by them.
Sucks to be them. It does not matter how trustworthy an individual is - if they lead you wrong, you still suffer the consequences. The German military had never been "done wrong" by their political leadership up until World War Two. Should they be excused their participation in the atrocities they committed? You don't get a pass for blindly following a leader when you step off a cliff, and people who decide to follow an army have to accept the risks that come with it. Rand did not invite any of them to come, and he is not responsible for their safety. Rather, it is the obligation of the rulers who choose to hide behind the skirts of all thos cooks and wives, rather than come to meet Rand in person and risk their own skins.

For Rand to jump instantly to feeling distrust, anger and fear towards the Borderlanders is more than just disconcerting.
Given all he has been through, and the degrees of betrayal and letdown he has experienced, NOT reacting that way would require superhuman virtue and tolerance.
Cannoli
“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Inde muagdhe Aes Sedai misain ye!
Deus Vult!
*MySmiley*
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Rand the psycho? - 06/01/2010 02:53:30 AM 1592 Views
I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:07:33 AM 991 Views
On Balefire - 06/01/2010 04:43:18 AM 990 Views
Good point - 06/01/2010 05:04:26 AM 1014 Views
On the nature of BaleFire - 06/01/2010 03:32:25 PM 919 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 04:59:12 AM 830 Views
Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:10:33 AM 949 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:20:02 AM 861 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 05:58:00 AM 831 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 11:46:13 AM 784 Views
Re: Wait! - 06/01/2010 03:55:01 PM 780 Views
I disagree - 06/01/2010 05:42:44 PM 742 Views
Re: I disagree - 06/01/2010 06:41:08 PM 768 Views
Re: I disagree - 07/01/2010 04:42:40 AM 749 Views
I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 07:30:56 AM 904 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 03:32:24 PM 813 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 09:52:47 PM 875 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 06/01/2010 11:19:56 PM 755 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:21:50 AM 849 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 12:56:26 AM 786 Views
Re: I doubt he meant 'in one go' as a single stream of balefire. - 07/01/2010 01:46:16 AM 797 Views
I agree with Templar - 09/01/2010 04:36:20 PM 775 Views
Re: I cannot follow your assumptions. - 06/01/2010 07:57:54 AM 884 Views
Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 02:36:42 PM 899 Views
Re: Rand crossed a line - 06/01/2010 04:16:12 PM 811 Views
But... - 06/01/2010 04:34:02 PM 924 Views
Re: But... - 06/01/2010 06:14:25 PM 738 Views
Doesn't Balefire remove your thread from the Pattern permanently? - 06/01/2010 02:55:38 PM 787 Views
No, RJ stated balefired people can be reborn. *NM* - 06/01/2010 03:26:00 PM 408 Views
But not in this turning of the Wheel. So they'd miss out on MANY lifetimes. - 06/01/2010 05:46:04 PM 802 Views
What? - 06/01/2010 06:20:56 PM 808 Views
Where did you get that? - 06/01/2010 07:09:38 PM 772 Views
No, balefire just kills you backwards in time. It is not super-death. *NM* - 06/01/2010 09:58:18 PM 447 Views
LOL ... super-death! - 06/01/2010 11:59:31 PM 752 Views
Hah! *NM* - 07/01/2010 12:06:07 AM 387 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:20 AM 760 Views
It makes me think of History of the World Part 1 - 07/01/2010 12:53:33 AM 736 Views
Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 06:51:15 PM 868 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 07:16:14 PM 790 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 08:58:40 PM 827 Views
Re: Yes it was. - 06/01/2010 10:47:11 PM 819 Views
let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:26:43 PM 805 Views
Re: let me ask the question in a different way - 06/01/2010 11:40:56 PM 803 Views
actually that quote supports my thoughts - 06/01/2010 11:50:40 PM 824 Views
Re: actually that quote supports my thoughts - 07/01/2010 12:10:07 AM 779 Views
Meh. I just think advocating mass-murder is the opposite direction RJ meant for this to take. - 07/01/2010 12:00:44 AM 835 Views
Sigh. What mass murder? - 07/01/2010 12:15:01 AM 722 Views
you are kidding right? - 07/01/2010 12:19:58 AM 812 Views
In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:14:32 PM 796 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 03:57:43 PM 801 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:13:21 PM 816 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 07:52:24 PM 757 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 08:56:43 PM 831 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:26:01 PM 762 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:30:45 PM 704 Views
Personally I'm kind of sick of Rand being the only person killing FS! - 07/01/2010 09:42:57 PM 882 Views
Re: In this book Rand was a wimp and a bully. - 07/01/2010 09:56:02 PM 816 Views
OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 07/01/2010 10:30:19 PM 792 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 01:53:25 PM 749 Views
Re: OK I'm sorry but this gets a huge ROFL :lol: - 08/01/2010 02:56:41 PM 806 Views
What might work... - 08/01/2010 12:35:17 PM 715 Views
Re: What might work... - 08/01/2010 11:38:09 PM 739 Views
Yes. Anakin Skywalker all over again - 06/01/2010 11:01:02 PM 891 Views
Meh - 06/01/2010 11:30:24 PM 738 Views
The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:33:32 PM 743 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:50:37 PM 821 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 06/01/2010 11:55:03 PM 766 Views
I do have to guiltily say, though, that if Rand had balefired the Seanchan and THEN became good... - 07/01/2010 12:03:20 AM 798 Views
*laughs behind hand* - 07/01/2010 12:05:54 AM 874 Views
Re: The worst part about his atrocities is his rationalizing them! - 07/01/2010 12:23:11 AM 742 Views
I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 12:52:25 AM 747 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 01:24:32 AM 812 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 03:33:52 PM 751 Views
Re: I don't think Rand or LTT (who has/have) little capacity for Healing - 07/01/2010 04:28:18 PM 896 Views
right cause all Generals are so well versed in medical conditions - 07/01/2010 09:44:09 PM 849 Views
Nice way to avoid the argument. - 07/01/2010 10:00:17 PM 805 Views
I'm just done talking in circles. You seem to think that because people - 07/01/2010 11:53:05 PM 837 Views
I concede - 07/01/2010 01:09:11 AM 731 Views
You weren't wrong overall, but there were some serious flaws in your reasoning. - 07/01/2010 02:43:17 AM 840 Views
Tee hee. - 07/01/2010 05:28:52 AM 787 Views
Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 06:23:09 AM 826 Views
Re: Morals are subjective anyhow, - 07/01/2010 03:23:59 PM 749 Views
I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 12:00:02 AM 823 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 09/01/2010 05:56:16 PM 981 Views
Re: I have religious beliefs and that is an absurd contention - 18/01/2010 01:00:23 PM 1089 Views
Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 11/01/2010 04:47:10 PM 717 Views
Re: Your assertions weaken your overall argument. - 18/01/2010 12:49:26 PM 757 Views

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