It depends what she does next. It was really a tactical thing and politics can excuse the hypocrisy
Cannoli Send a noteboard - 13/01/2010 04:20:06 AM
After the reunification of the Tower, Egwene told the Salidar Hall that they must apologise for breaking the Tower before she'd let them back in, and she told the Tower Hall that they were a disgrace for allowing Elaida free reign.
Was Egwene sanctimonious, pious, out of place, arrogant etc with this? I'm undecided about it, and I think there are valid arguments for both sides. I also think she's lucky they didn't box her ears or tell her to get lost in this scene, but I guess they were all shocked by the Seanchan, and caught up in their unique circumstances.
The attacking stance is obviously that Egwene was wrong to do this. Here are some reasons why she wasn't wrong...
1. She's right. The people in Salidar did break the Tower and the Tower Sitters did allow Elaida to become a tyrant. Egwene is merely telling the truth. Any member of the White ajah could have done the same.
2. Egwene is not a hypocrite because she isn't truly part of the Salidar camp. She was not present during the breaking of the Tower and played absolutely no part in it. She did not organize a rebellion against Elaida and she was forced into her position under the penalty of stilling. She therefore has the right to berate the Salidar Hall.
But she exacerbated and accelerated the course of the rebellion. When they were hesitant about taking further steps along the path, it was always Egwene (or her eventual minions, before she showed up) pushing them to take the next step.- Setting out on actual campaign from Salidar
- Confronting outsiders with the fact of their war
- Formally declaring war
- Traveling to Tar Valon to bring on the actual fight
- Attacking Tar Valon's defenses
All of which were solely the doing of Egwene, who either used her authority to make a unilateral decision or else manuevered the Hall or the faction leaders into going along with her agenda. If rebellion IS that bad, she was the single person with the best chance to end it, and never did.
3. She's the Amyrlin - of all ajahs and of none. Like a member of the gray ajah sorting out a feud between two lords, Egwene can be an external critic without being hypocritical.
Even if an accurate statement of her position, her direct involvement in affairs negates that nuetrality.As far as charges of hypocrisy go, that's politics and how the game is played. If she uses her edge gained from this distasteful and dishonest manuevering for good, it can be lived with. Expecting great moral behavior from Egwene is a bit much at this point. On the other hand, if she goes on to promote the cause and supremacy of these miscreants to the outside world, that is a whole other kettle of fish.
4. She's being politically sensible. She's making everyone say sorry as surely as a mother makes her two fighting sons say sorry to one another after a fight. If everyone is sorry, then everyone is forgiven, and wounds heal faster.
Let's hear it... was she wrong?
Let's hear it... was she wrong?
I go with the last. In addition, she was maintaining the moral high ground. By scolding them, she keeps them off-balance and less likely to question or oppose her in the future. Much like when she reprimanded Romanda after the war declaration passed, and turned around and smacked down Lelaine to prevent her from thinking she had any sort of advantage over Romanda. By finding things to reprimand both sides, she prevents either from thinking they have won or that they have a claim to Egwene's loyalty or support. It's excellent tactics, and the sort of thing I normally deplore in political leaders - it comes all to close to being Elaida all over again. As I said in the subject, it depends how she carries on. If she takes this superior position and uses it only to expedite measures against the Shadow and prevent the sort of short-sighted, petty, tradition-over-sensible-tactics mentality all too typical of Aes Sedai, especially the politicians of the bunch, from derailing matters, all well and good. But if she uses it to ram her own agenda through because she can, to advance the Tower's interests over the Dragon Reborn's or the normal people, or to prop up this same pack of idiots she was calling out and showing up throughout tGS, then we have a problem.
What all of this means, is Egwene has now got enough rope to hang herself. The last two books, we'll see how she does.
Cannoli
“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Inde muagdhe Aes Sedai misain ye!
Deus Vult!
*MySmiley*
“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Inde muagdhe Aes Sedai misain ye!
Deus Vult!
*MySmiley*
Was Egwene wrong to berate both Halls after the reunification?
12/01/2010 05:13:59 PM
- 6783 Views
She was right, as long as she never mentions it again
12/01/2010 05:19:38 PM
- 711 Views
I didn't expect it, but it was absolutely the right thing for her to do.
12/01/2010 06:13:42 PM
- 701 Views
She was absolutely right and I love to hear good beratings.
12/01/2010 06:49:56 PM
- 656 Views
Like you'd say anything else. *NM*
13/01/2010 04:22:13 AM
- 264 Views
If the berating sucked, I would have complained. But it was pretty good to hear/read. *NM*
13/01/2010 04:33:29 PM
- 301 Views
Re: Was Egwene wrong to berate both Halls after the reunification?
12/01/2010 06:58:40 PM
- 623 Views
Reasonable in terms of power politics, but still somewhat deceitful.
12/01/2010 07:06:33 PM
- 675 Views
Re: Was Egwene wrong to berate both Halls after the reunification?
12/01/2010 07:20:30 PM
- 719 Views
I doubt it.
12/01/2010 09:58:40 PM
- 579 Views
It was a political move. It was the right political move, but not "morally" right.
12/01/2010 08:03:27 PM
- 602 Views
It was very clear where her sympathies lie. A lot of it was superficial.
12/01/2010 10:41:09 PM
- 700 Views
She didn't mention/berate the 300+ AS who ignored this whole facade of a plotline.
13/01/2010 01:27:02 AM
- 602 Views
it's not like they were there to berate! *NM*
13/01/2010 04:10:49 AM
- 240 Views
Wait until they come back and she slams them for "ignoring the Tower in its hour of need." *NM*
13/01/2010 04:20:55 AM
- 246 Views
She should
13/01/2010 04:22:13 AM
- 639 Views
They probably had more important matters than the privileges of a tiny group of powerful women.
14/01/2010 12:11:04 AM
- 606 Views
right, they were very very busy doing a whole lot of nothing
14/01/2010 12:13:06 AM
- 537 Views
Keeping an eye on the transition between rulers of the most powerful country IS more important
18/01/2010 12:19:17 PM
- 713 Views
they've been coming and going for months ... with no indication of what they are really up too
19/01/2010 06:24:27 AM
- 567 Views
What part of "keeping an eye on" suggests action or interference?
22/01/2010 01:38:52 PM
- 575 Views
It depends what she does next. It was really a tactical thing and politics can excuse the hypocrisy
13/01/2010 04:20:06 AM
- 669 Views