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I've been looking into this a bit... and you really do overstate things to suit your arguments darius_sedai Send a noteboard - 24/12/2009 06:15:44 PM
But wait, there's more. Ewgene makes an 8 foot gateway in LoC and is impressed with the size she managed to create. 8x8=64. 64 as a percentage of 144 = 44%.


First off this scene is in ACOS, and she is in no way impressed with it's size, jut notes that it's 8x8 ... there is no evidence of strain, or that she's in anyway holding anywhere near her maximum amount of saidar to use in it's weaving!

aCoS
A Morning of Victory

Weaving a gateway where he had been practicing the sword, a good eight feet by eight, she stepped through onto what seemed to be a ferry, floating in darkness that stretched forever. Skimming required a platform, and though it could be anything you chose to imagine, every sister seemed to have one she preferred.


Even IF your gateway model was in anyway accurate, you don't have enough evidence to actually apply it! We don't even know if Egwene is at her full potential yet, she's further along than Elayne and Aviendha, but that doesn't tell us she's reached her peak. Personally I think she's probably around 90% by TGS, but in the middle of the series she's probably more like 80-85% with Elayne and Avi being closer to 65-75%... but that's pure guess work. Given that most women seem to take as much as a decade to gain their full strength it seems likely that even those Forced still gain the final bits more slowly than the bulk of strength... Moiraine points out that she had the majority of her strength after 6 years of training, but it would be several more before she hit her peak.

Furthermore we know from The Fires of Heaven:
The Far Snows and A Short Spear

"Immediately the gateway began to narrow again, turning, but without thought Rand channeled, blocking it at half its former width." ...

"It seemed narrower than he remembered, too." ...

"Together they leaped into the grayness, Rand releasing the weave that had held the Seanchan in order to fill himself to bursting with saidin..."


So the Gateway Aviendha originally wove was at still about 4 feet across for them to be able to leap through it together ... and since it was less than half it's original size when Rand originally blocked it, it's safe to assume it was near enough 8 feet across to start.

Let's not forget that Aviendha was far below her potential at this time, she'd only been Channeling for a few months when she did this! Speaks loudly that if your theory is correct the women at this level can make far larger Gateways than we've seen thus far.

All we know with any kind of certainty is that Rand can make a 4pace x 4pace and no larger, we have no idea what a maximum saidar Gateway is ... could be smaller, could be larger, could be the same.

And as for Lanfear handling Egwene and Aviendha with contemptuous ease... they never even engaged her directly! She laid a reversed weave on them before they could do a thing! THAT is all about skill, not about strength or dexterity!
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
This message last edited by darius_sedai on 26/12/2009 at 04:28:52 PM
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I've been playing with some numbers since we've been having all of these OP strength debates - 20/12/2009 06:34:05 PM 1353 Views
There are 21 levels, not 100. More later. *NM* - 20/12/2009 07:23:18 PM 482 Views
RJ has said a number of times that the 21 level scale - 20/12/2009 07:35:25 PM 741 Views
Few glaring errors... - 20/12/2009 09:04:55 PM 930 Views
Re: Few glaring errors... - 21/12/2009 07:52:18 AM 886 Views
You don't get it, do you... - 21/12/2009 08:19:00 AM 836 Views
Didn't you claim that Eggy+Rom+Lel cannot match a male forsaken? Now they can match Lanfear? - 21/12/2009 04:14:32 PM 728 Views
That only strengthens my point. - 21/12/2009 06:23:39 PM 756 Views
No it does not. - 28/12/2009 02:45:42 AM 818 Views
What you are missing is that - 21/12/2009 06:46:04 PM 772 Views
I'm not missing it at all.. - 21/12/2009 06:58:04 PM 804 Views
Let's try matching that with the actual text - 22/12/2009 03:01:36 PM 777 Views
Not correct... - 22/12/2009 03:29:24 PM 871 Views
Believe as you like, I'm not here to convince you to otherwise, I'm stating how I read the evidence - 22/12/2009 06:01:24 PM 771 Views
You're reading the evidence wrong. - 22/12/2009 06:27:17 PM 753 Views
RJ also pointed out that Alivia's skill set as a weapon came in handy - 22/12/2009 07:40:35 PM 707 Views
I thought a power law distribution is much more likely, TBH - 20/12/2009 09:39:21 PM 837 Views
Yes. It essentially refers to a skewed histogram - biased to the lower end of the range... - 20/12/2009 09:53:18 PM 862 Views
Corrections - 21/12/2009 01:48:43 AM 885 Views
No... - 21/12/2009 07:47:58 AM 762 Views
True, the application of this model is inconsistent *NM* - 21/12/2009 02:34:26 PM 606 Views
yet RJ has said flat out that OP strength is on an Bell Curve. Meaning the majority of channelers - 21/12/2009 07:36:22 AM 748 Views
Perhaps... - 21/12/2009 07:52:13 AM 828 Views
I've always hated bell curves - 21/12/2009 03:56:26 PM 764 Views
The most logical answer is that the average AOL channeler was stronger than the current average... - 21/12/2009 06:36:07 PM 755 Views
and that in no way maps to any kind of Bell Curve - 22/12/2009 06:02:41 PM 640 Views
Why? - 22/12/2009 06:34:25 PM 772 Views
Can you provide the quote where RJ tells us the - 22/12/2009 07:45:04 PM 686 Views
Always go back to the evidence... - 22/12/2009 09:03:42 PM 835 Views
I'll respond when you can actually provide a few actual quotes to support any of this - 23/12/2009 03:20:44 PM 753 Views
Name an item you dispute and I will provide the quote.... - 23/12/2009 05:19:49 PM 733 Views
it's addressed below - 23/12/2009 05:23:58 PM 737 Views
I've been looking into this a bit... and you really do overstate things to suit your arguments - 24/12/2009 06:15:44 PM 780 Views
And in looking for quotes for another thread I came across this gem - 29/12/2009 09:54:34 PM 753 Views
Nice! It proves what I've been saying for ages... - 29/12/2009 10:13:41 PM 779 Views
Which is why I contend that they are about 80% of Lanfear - 29/12/2009 10:16:07 PM 755 Views
I wasn't trying to rip him a new one. - 22/12/2009 09:38:43 PM 666 Views
I don't think we have a representative sample of the mode in this population - 22/12/2009 08:35:23 PM 800 Views
Except that gateway size is used multiple times by characters to judge comparative strength... - 22/12/2009 09:21:07 PM 785 Views
Re: Except that gateway size is used multiple times by characters to judge comparative strength... - 22/12/2009 11:32:21 PM 900 Views
I agree that it's practically impossible to determine strength - 23/12/2009 03:19:49 PM 780 Views
How convenient. And by the way, it is NOT tied to a Talent. Anyone who is strong enough, can Travel. *NM* - 23/12/2009 04:36:24 PM 443 Views
This is true, however... - 23/12/2009 04:55:48 PM 807 Views
Aviendha's gateway size doesn't decrease. She is just less energy efficient in creating it... - 23/12/2009 05:30:17 PM 1075 Views
Aviendha is suffering from the second weave limitation - 23/12/2009 05:37:45 PM 848 Views
Conceded. My faulty memory is to blame in this case. But it doesn't change the rule... - 23/12/2009 06:01:33 PM 695 Views
I'll give you that there is a stength limitation to Traveling - 23/12/2009 06:06:41 PM 720 Views
Why do the characters in the books judge each other's strength on gateway size then? *NM* - 23/12/2009 06:08:17 PM 409 Views
Re: Why do the characters in the books judge each other's strength on gateway size then? - 23/12/2009 06:20:18 PM 738 Views
And there you have it...Thank you. - 23/12/2009 06:27:24 PM 732 Views
And linked with Romanda and Lelaine - 23/12/2009 06:34:42 PM 730 Views
Sorry. That's pure speculation on your part. *NM* - 23/12/2009 06:38:43 PM 419 Views
No more than yours is! - 23/12/2009 06:49:57 PM 757 Views
That entire passage is in the context of strength... - 23/12/2009 07:55:50 PM 643 Views
You need to re-read some of this stuff - 23/12/2009 11:01:15 PM 827 Views
Re: I don't think we have a representative sample of the mode in this population - 26/12/2009 12:38:43 PM 746 Views
Re: I don't think we have a representative sample of the mode in this population - 26/12/2009 06:37:50 PM 734 Views
Goodness - 31/12/2009 03:37:23 AM 763 Views
I'm working within the context of what we've been told by the author - 31/12/2009 03:43:31 AM 717 Views
Since you love Wiki so much - 31/12/2009 03:55:09 AM 727 Views
No you are not - 31/12/2009 03:58:28 AM 758 Views
Dude we're discussion works of fiction - 31/12/2009 04:08:12 AM 792 Views
Dumb Bell Distribution of Mongoloid Turings - 31/12/2009 04:36:50 AM 854 Views
Back to school AS, and you will be able to do this - 26/12/2009 12:34:39 PM 703 Views
The problem we're working with is that RJ says strength follows a Bell Curve distribution - 26/12/2009 03:29:26 PM 732 Views
And RJ knew his maths (and you don't) - 31/12/2009 03:22:09 AM 775 Views
I'm not the one who said OP strength followed a Bell Curve Distribution - 31/12/2009 03:34:55 AM 727 Views
You are the one who is MIS-USING his statement - 31/12/2009 03:44:26 AM 735 Views
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The pathos of Darius - 31/12/2009 04:26:15 AM 760 Views
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Re: Is Lanfear the strongest?(now) - 29/12/2009 04:21:47 PM 745 Views

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