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OK, the Tower AS don't fall into a bell-curve, then. BlackAdder Send a noteboard - 18/12/2009 10:34:16 PM
That still doesn't mean that the average strength is clustered around 50.

You're assuming a discontinuous range then. That has absolutely no basis in fact. There is not one shred of proof that certain strengths between the lowest and highest strengths cannot exist, which is what you're implying by having 5 and 20 in your list, but not 10, 15, etc.

At some point, you have to make distinctions between channellers, so, yeah, it is discontinuous range. There are only 1000 AS, but an infinite number of possible strengths.

It's possible for the mean to not be 50 and still conform to a bell curve.

Yes necessarily. the mistake you're making is that you think the bell curve distribution is a hypothesis based on random statistical sampling of all channelers. In that case, it is indeed possible that you'll have no person occupying certain strength scales, which will shift the mean.

In this case however, RJ has declared that all his imaginary characters follow this law. And has given absolutely no indication that there are levels which no human can occupy between the minima and the maxima of the range.

Yeah, that's good, but again, there are only a finite number of channelers. It's quite possible that the Pattern chose to weave weak ones for a while, then recently spun in a lot of strong people. That does not mean that the population of channelers in RL will fall into the bell shape. Only if all the possible channelers are spun out can we say for sure that the population of RL channelers falls into a bell shape. The Wheel itself is quite capable of skewing the population.

Summary: In RJ's distribution, yes, the mean would be 50, but that accounts for all possible channelers, not just those that we see in one universe in Randland. It's possible that the current population of channelers is skewed an not in a bell shape due to extenuating circumstances (e.g., Tarmon Gaidon)
This message last edited by BlackAdder on 18/12/2009 at 10:38:18 PM
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The relative strength in the Power of Nynaeve vs Cadsuane vs Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha - 17/12/2009 03:32:03 PM 8259 Views
I assume you're referring to EFFECTIVE strength here... - 17/12/2009 04:27:53 PM 1596 Views
Re: I assume you're referring to EFFECTIVE strength here... - 17/12/2009 05:05:18 PM 1584 Views
Fair enough but the problem is... - 17/12/2009 05:13:39 PM 1389 Views
There's one thing that does suggest Lanfear is very dextrous... - 17/12/2009 05:49:14 PM 1506 Views
Re: Fair enough but the problem is... - 17/12/2009 08:08:27 PM 1075 Views
Re: The relative strength in the Power of Nynaeve vs Cadsuane vs Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha - 17/12/2009 04:52:56 PM 1483 Views
Alivia's rings and chains angreal multiplies strength by 4 times or more... - 17/12/2009 04:57:17 PM 1364 Views
Indeed, and not only that - 17/12/2009 05:10:46 PM 1069 Views
Re: Alivia's rings and chains angreal multiplies strength by 4 times or more... - 17/12/2009 06:07:39 PM 1143 Views
Moiraine at 45 strength is way too high. She can't be that high. *NM* - 17/12/2009 07:44:50 PM 750 Views
why? - 17/12/2009 07:57:37 PM 1191 Views
Re: why? - 17/12/2009 08:11:13 PM 1268 Views
I don't think there is one scale you can put both men and women on is the point - 17/12/2009 08:21:21 PM 1235 Views
and yet RJ does - 17/12/2009 08:27:39 PM 1143 Views
Re: and yet RJ does - 17/12/2009 09:49:20 PM 1023 Views
Re: and yet RJ does - 18/12/2009 04:20:16 AM 1112 Views
No more liberty than you are taking assuming only a woman like Graendal could do it! - 18/12/2009 05:08:04 PM 1227 Views
Re: No more liberty than you are taking assuming only a woman like Graendal could do it! - 19/12/2009 11:53:24 AM 971 Views
Re: No more liberty than you are taking assuming only a woman like Graendal could do it! - 19/12/2009 05:12:47 PM 924 Views
Meh... - 19/12/2009 06:01:56 PM 931 Views
Re: Meh... - 19/12/2009 06:43:58 PM 980 Views
Re: Meh... - 19/12/2009 06:46:03 PM 1239 Views
Re: The relative strength in the Power of Nynaeve vs Cadsuane vs Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha - 17/12/2009 05:07:28 PM 1191 Views
Re: The relative strength in the Power of Nynaeve vs Cadsuane vs Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha - 17/12/2009 06:24:12 PM 1098 Views
Let's work with your figures... - 17/12/2009 06:45:46 PM 1036 Views
Re: Let's work with your figures... - 17/12/2009 07:16:49 PM 1029 Views
You have a good point about Daigian and Semirhage. That may have been a BS mistake. *NM* - 17/12/2009 07:50:25 PM 709 Views
Re: You have a good point about Daigian and Semirhage. That may have been a BS mistake. - 17/12/2009 07:59:13 PM 1130 Views
Still, it's created more questions than it has solved. - 17/12/2009 08:13:26 PM 1160 Views
the obvious answer - 17/12/2009 10:06:33 PM 1021 Views
Re: You have a good point about Daigian and Semirhage. That may have been a BS mistake. - 17/12/2009 08:14:01 PM 1043 Views
Re: two women holding Nynaeve - 17/12/2009 08:17:10 PM 976 Views
Re: two women holding Nynaeve - 17/12/2009 08:19:34 PM 1156 Views
I personally think Nynaeve gained strength slower than most because of her block. - 17/12/2009 08:30:44 PM 1231 Views
I think all the main characters were forced - 17/12/2009 08:38:41 PM 1136 Views
agreed! - 17/12/2009 10:01:37 PM 1052 Views
but we know as late as WH that she has not reached her full potential - 17/12/2009 09:50:12 PM 1061 Views
What? Where? *NM* - 18/12/2009 04:22:36 AM 1119 Views
I'll have to dig up the quote, apologies but I'm at work and don't have the books - 18/12/2009 05:00:20 PM 1040 Views
Sorry, Path of Daggers not Winter's Heart - 20/12/2009 03:32:33 AM 1018 Views
Don't links amplify stength? - 17/12/2009 10:26:12 PM 955 Views
The opposite, actually. - 17/12/2009 10:36:51 PM 1059 Views
What do you think of the gap between Moghedien and Semirhage in relation to - 17/12/2009 05:40:41 PM 1191 Views
Re: What do you think of the gap between Moghedien and Semirhage in relation to - 17/12/2009 08:15:58 PM 1091 Views
Agreed! *NM* - 17/12/2009 08:19:08 PM 631 Views
Re: The relative strength in the Power of Nynaeve vs Cadsuane vs Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha - 17/12/2009 06:47:23 PM 1165 Views
Except tthat Egwene herself says she has no chance against Moghedien... - 17/12/2009 06:53:18 PM 1117 Views
Re: Except tthat Egwene herself says she has no chance against Moghedien... - 17/12/2009 07:26:55 PM 1343 Views
uhm.... yes she knows - 17/12/2009 08:04:08 PM 1184 Views
Re: uhm.... yes she knows - 17/12/2009 10:24:17 PM 1068 Views
yup *NM* - 17/12/2009 10:49:51 PM 587 Views
Re: Except tthat Egwene herself says she has no chance against Moghedien... - 17/12/2009 07:28:00 PM 1147 Views
Re: Except tthat Egwene herself says she has no chance against Moghedien... - 17/12/2009 08:23:01 PM 1334 Views
Ishamael told her that she would never be strong enough to face him - 17/12/2009 09:52:47 PM 1086 Views
And Ishamael was killed be a shepherd and Bel'al balefired by a "weak" Aes Sedai. - 17/12/2009 10:33:41 PM 1025 Views
I hope that's not your standard for dueling - 18/12/2009 04:24:09 AM 1054 Views
what you expect a Channeler to announce themselves and - 19/12/2009 12:47:17 AM 1061 Views
How can we be certain Egwene was at full strength when she said that? - 17/12/2009 07:58:39 PM 987 Views
agreed - 17/12/2009 08:00:40 PM 949 Views
Didn't the glossary say that Cadsuane was not far behind Eg/El? *NM* - 17/12/2009 08:05:32 PM 637 Views
I'll check *NM* - 17/12/2009 08:28:57 PM 606 Views
This thread has achieved absolutely nothing. When people don't accept quotes, what's the use... - 17/12/2009 10:22:45 PM 1114 Views
No people just interpret things differently - 17/12/2009 10:56:45 PM 921 Views
But you ignore RJ's own quotes... who're you to talk? - 17/12/2009 11:13:40 PM 863 Views
You also forget something. - 17/12/2009 11:36:50 PM 953 Views
Re: You also forget something. - 17/12/2009 11:43:50 PM 976 Views
Re: You also forget something. - 18/12/2009 02:09:08 AM 1001 Views
That has nothing to do with what I said... - 18/12/2009 12:21:06 AM 961 Views
Re: That has nothing to do with what I said... - 18/12/2009 01:28:53 PM 878 Views
Dude, prove it in a random sample, not in a skewed sample like "women who want to be Aes Sedai". - 18/12/2009 05:43:22 PM 922 Views
Show me a random sample in the series that we can use *NM* - 18/12/2009 06:45:08 PM 903 Views
I cannot. That's the point... - 18/12/2009 08:33:38 PM 929 Views
Re: I cannot. That's the point... - 19/12/2009 11:58:39 AM 933 Views
Sorry, but no... - 19/12/2009 06:23:41 PM 972 Views
The One Power Bell Curve's average strength is not 50, it is more like 15... - 17/12/2009 11:41:48 PM 1454 Views
but you are the person quantifying the actual strength levels. - 18/12/2009 12:09:08 AM 937 Views
Yes, Sidious' scale is a relative scale not an absolute one *NM* - 18/12/2009 12:23:25 AM 842 Views
In a Bell curve, mean=median=mode. I suppose that is untrue now? - 18/12/2009 12:37:47 AM 880 Views
Re: In a Bell curve, mean=median=mode. I suppose that is untrue now? - 18/12/2009 12:47:52 AM 934 Views
What do you mean, relative scale? - 18/12/2009 12:53:29 AM 898 Views
Re: What do you mean, relative scale? - 18/12/2009 01:16:53 AM 835 Views
Re: What do you mean, relative scale? - 18/12/2009 01:40:33 AM 903 Views
OK, I have no interest in OP Strength, but you comments about statistics and bell curve got me - 18/12/2009 12:20:27 AM 969 Views
1 to 100 works perfectly well as a range... - 18/12/2009 12:47:44 AM 905 Views
Here is an example with an absolute scale, converted to relative - 18/12/2009 01:03:38 AM 983 Views
The Tower is not the whole range of channeler population! - 18/12/2009 01:28:38 AM 1004 Views
Re: The Tower is not the whole range of channeler population! - 18/12/2009 02:03:00 AM 1066 Views
Re: The Tower is not the whole range of channeler population! - 18/12/2009 03:16:25 AM 1003 Views
You're right, and that proves my point - here are the calculations and the evidence... - 18/12/2009 07:51:26 AM 981 Views
Dude, read up on some statistics, then we'll continue this debate... - 18/12/2009 06:05:26 PM 908 Views
Explain one thing to me... - 18/12/2009 10:40:00 PM 925 Views
Who said she's stronger than two very strong AS? Silviana can shield her alone! *NM* - 18/12/2009 11:01:01 PM 542 Views
Aviendha said so in FoH. It is a direct quote. - 18/12/2009 11:04:21 PM 883 Views
This is why I have a hard time with anyone using too many - 19/12/2009 12:22:40 AM 935 Views
Can you provide the quote? - 19/12/2009 06:24:40 PM 844 Views
Well, I was curious so I went and found it - 26/12/2009 08:59:46 PM 1023 Views
which is also suspect - 19/12/2009 12:04:14 AM 946 Views
No it's not - 19/12/2009 12:04:21 PM 917 Views
we're in agreement - 19/12/2009 05:22:34 PM 867 Views
OK, the Tower AS don't fall into a bell-curve, then. - 18/12/2009 10:34:16 PM 948 Views
So, RJ made that statement for what reason? - 18/12/2009 11:03:30 PM 916 Views
I don't think it's a lie - 18/12/2009 11:19:41 PM 968 Views
Agreed - 18/12/2009 01:04:14 PM 922 Views
Re: But you ignore RJ's own quotes... who're you to talk? - 18/12/2009 04:31:53 AM 903 Views
Re: But you ignore RJ's own quotes... who're you to talk? - 18/12/2009 04:42:33 AM 878 Views
Re: But you ignore RJ's own quotes... who're you to talk? - 18/12/2009 01:04:39 PM 925 Views
Bell curves CANNOT be skewed! - 18/12/2009 06:06:15 PM 983 Views
I've discussed this before... - 18/12/2009 01:06:07 AM 974 Views
Re: I've discussed this before... - 18/12/2009 04:37:30 AM 950 Views
Re: I've discussed this before... - 18/12/2009 04:58:48 AM 928 Views
Egwene + Lelaine + Romanda is weaker than one male Forsaken...according to Egwene herself... - 18/12/2009 07:02:28 AM 960 Views
Why are you entertaining this? - 18/12/2009 01:19:25 PM 938 Views
Re: Egwene + Lelaine + Romanda is weaker than one male Forsaken...according to Egwene herself... - 19/12/2009 12:46:18 AM 952 Views
I can't imagine it being about skill - 19/12/2009 12:06:42 PM 954 Views
of course it's about skill - 19/12/2009 05:22:45 PM 942 Views
Not it isn't! - 19/12/2009 05:52:02 PM 972 Views
I always thought that without her angreal... - 18/12/2009 06:27:07 AM 1054 Views
Egwene, Elayne, and Aviendha are equally matched. - 18/12/2009 07:47:03 AM 1176 Views

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