Active Users:769 Time:14/11/2024 05:21:30 PM
Amadicia, and possibly the Borderlands Orlin_Artemi Send a noteboard - 13/10/2009 08:19:11 AM


So with all this in mind? What culture or nation do you see as being the most male-friendly and which one do you see as the most restrictive on women in general (as opposed to customs or laws that restrict specific groups such as female channelers - in other words, I am trying to avoid answers like "The Aiel/Sea Folk/Seanchan are the most restrictive to women because all female channelers are forced to choose the same profession." )?


It's quite a toss-up to say which of the nations is the most "male-friendly," although there are at least a few nations that come to mind right off hand. Much easier to answer which of the nations is the most restrictive on women in general, which, in my humble opinion, would be Amadicia. Hands down.

Out of every nation we've ever been introduced to, I think that the only civilization that we've seen to have any serious examples of male-dominance would be Amadicia. The land is almost exclusively overrun (prior to the Seanchan invasion, at least) by an all-male organization that bears surprising resemblance to the Catholic Church during the days of the Inquisition. The fear of "Tar Valon Witches" is rampant throughout the entirety of the kingdom, and as a result of that it is commonly suggested, if not declared outright, by many of the Childen that the first citizens of that nation to be targeted by raging lynch mobs are most commonly women who hang herbs in their windows to signify their craft as healers.

Patriarchy seems to reign supreme over just about every aspect of Amadicia, but in the same stroke of breath I think that the nation is often personified as the most inherently vile of them all. Almost every whitecloak we meet seems to have little or no compunction about slaughtering innocent people, and their wicked nature seems to be emphasized over and over again by the characters we meet throughout the books. Bornhold (while reasonably angered over the death of two of his Whitecloak Soldiers) had abaolsutely no compunctions about pronouncing Perrin as a darkfriend as a result of his connection to wolves (which must be evil), but his suspicions about Perrin serving as a spy for the Seanchan felt all but completely unwarranted.

Pedron Niall is characterized by his thirst for world domination by "allowing the Dragon to run loose" until he can be "properly put down" with the expectation that the world would be unified and subsequently conquered by his organization. If anything, Eamon Valda was twice as bad; a rapist who had absolutely no compunctions about slaughtering refugees under the notion that "The Creator will know well who is his own."

While I cannot recall whether or not Amadician customs allow for anything but a king to hold power over their lands, it hardly matters in the long run because the king is almost (if not always) depicted as a mindless puppet that dances to the strings of the Whitecloaks.

As far as the most male-friendly of the nations? Well, I think the answer to that is more difficult. Truth be told, I would probably have to go with the Borderlands. Unless I am mistaken, Kandori merchants are widely regarded as hard baragianers (if not nearly as hard as the Domani or the Seafolk), and their merchant society didn't have any suggestions of female domination that I can recall off-hand. Shienar has a King, but their soldiers are wedded to death and driven off into the Blight while their women seem to have great privelages over their men (such as the ability to "punish them" for badgering the womens quarters unduely -- even if the offending man is only trying to settle an argument with his wife.)

Saldaea seems to have some of the best examples of a "male-friendly" nation, but off-handedly I cannot recall whether or not Saldaean custom even allows for a king. Nevertheless, the attitude of Saldaean women (at least, according to Faile's mother) is that a man should always be stronger than a woman because if he is not, the woman will never be able to grow into her full potential. A Saldaean man is expected to dominate his wife when she throws tantrums and wrestle her (psychologically or physically, if necessarry) into submission.

Ontop of this, Saldaean men are widely considered honorable (if flambuoyant) for their responsibilities as a Borderlander nation, and just about everyone knows of their reputation for the best cavalry in the known world. I'd say that this, at least, earns them some serious points. Saldaean women seem to be equally strong, however, and ride out into battle with their husbands so that they might wield their man's sword if he should fall in battle. Even still, they are only permitted to do this if the venture is not into the Blight, and insofar as I can tell, the honor of the defense of the Blight seems almost exclusively male.

I tend to discount Tear because of the wide schism between nobility and commoners, but I can remember little enough about Illian. I don't believe that I can recall even one instance of an Illianer smuggler who wasn't a man, however, and I'm certain that the nation has never held a Queen. While I am almost positive that there are Tairen High Ladies as well as High Lords, I do not recall even one example of an Illianer High Lady. Nevertheless, I don't think RJ has ever given us even one Tairen High Lord who wasn't hot-headed, conniving, or downright incompetent (but I haven't done my research, so I could be wrong).

I'm hopped up on cold medicine and currently fighting a sleeping pill, so if my post is sloppy, that's why.

Reply to message
What do you consider to be the most pro-masculine culture/country in WoT? The most anti-female? - 19/09/2009 07:32:03 AM 1326 Views
I would say Tear. - 19/09/2009 08:08:18 AM 803 Views
I guess it's a toss up between Tear, Illian and Amador - 19/09/2009 12:28:24 PM 745 Views
What about male-only organizations? - 19/09/2009 02:00:55 PM 701 Views
Yeah, Aiel warrior societies. - 19/09/2009 03:44:36 PM 783 Views
Hm, you never do see a female Whitecloak. Do they ever talk about why? - 20/09/2009 04:11:30 PM 744 Views
Distrust of women because they hate channelers, IMHO. - 21/09/2009 03:47:43 AM 780 Views
Sort of the reverse of the attitudes I talked about below - 21/09/2009 07:21:05 PM 622 Views
Yeah, I'd go with the military thing. - 21/09/2009 05:45:47 AM 616 Views
The Asha'man are less prejudiced than the Tower. - 21/09/2009 05:48:43 AM 680 Views
I was taking you seriously - 19/09/2009 03:29:16 PM 689 Views
Amadicia - 19/09/2009 07:28:43 PM 784 Views
I'll go with Amadicia, as well. - 23/09/2009 07:36:10 PM 541 Views
No question. - 19/09/2009 08:43:47 PM 772 Views
The ogier all have masculine features. - 19/09/2009 09:06:14 PM 800 Views
Re: The ogier all have masculine features. - 19/09/2009 11:54:54 PM 648 Views
I'm not sure the Dark One can be called male... - 20/09/2009 12:27:56 AM 702 Views
Re: I'm not sure the Dark One can be called male... - 20/09/2009 06:43:09 AM 880 Views
Re: The ogier all have masculine features. - 25/09/2009 05:25:49 AM 536 Views
Re: The ogier all have masculine features. - 13/10/2009 09:01:27 AM 635 Views
Ahhhh wall of text! Some good points, though - 20/09/2009 04:04:48 PM 682 Views
Do you have anything against paragraphs? *NM* - 20/09/2009 10:03:48 PM 297 Views
White space is space with no words in it. Wasted. *NM* - 21/09/2009 07:10:41 AM 264 Views
Whitespaceisspacewithnowordsinit.Wasted.Thereifixeditforyou. - 01/10/2009 01:55:21 PM 598 Views
I agree, but I also think there is a purpose. - 21/09/2009 03:43:45 AM 620 Views
Oh, I wasn't criticizing this phenomenom, just noting it. - 21/09/2009 06:17:34 AM 715 Views
that's why they deserve 3 male taveren - 21/09/2009 05:10:52 PM 632 Views
Re: Oh, I wasn't criticizing this phenomenom, just noting it. - 21/09/2009 06:59:36 PM 743 Views
I think the Shienaran custom of protecting women is both patronizing and submissive ATST. *NM* - 21/09/2009 02:33:58 PM 726 Views
There's actual cultural reasons for that. - 23/09/2009 04:25:52 AM 569 Views
Far Madding, Elayne's bodyguards, and Tar Valon *NM* - 21/09/2009 07:40:09 PM 294 Views
Amadicia, and possibly the Borderlands - 13/10/2009 08:19:11 AM 714 Views

Reply to Message