Active Users:1055 Time:22/11/2024 07:18:21 AM
Re: I can agree with keeping it secret from just about everyone, BUT his father and closest friends. Cannoli Send a noteboard - 11/01/2013 02:34:16 AM
I did not like the fact that Nyn and Tam (the two who actually care the most, out of everyone who knows him) were not told. It would have made more sense if the bonds had snapped, leaving the three women to believe him dead (Min, at least, might have shed a tear or two, even if the other two are incapable of such emotion or caring), with Nynaeve aware that he was alive (perhaps via delving, she could've noted something "different" about "Moridin" and gotten Alivia to help him escape, knowing that his life may be in danger from that psycho Forotuona and others who wanted him to die, like everyone at the WT). It would've made a nice twist on Nyn healing someone "three days dead" while merging the vision that Alivia would help Rand die. It also would've freed him from his women.

He seems a. fine with them, and b. rather too free of them, IMO. I can't really see the point of wanting to be with any of them, though they range from second favorite to second least favorite of the female characters, but if that's what floats Rand's boat, he should act like it, and follow up on his end(s) of the deal. Aside from deciding which one of them he sleeps with at any given time, I really don't see what you consider so arduous or oppressive in their approach to the relationship (aside from insisting on it in the first place, but that's not really going against his will, that's blowing off bullshit excuses he makes to weasel out of paying for the cow after the fact).


Nyn would've told Tam, I'm sure - she has too much compassion not to do so - but she would've accepted that she could not tell the three stooges and, upon seeing their non-reaction, she would have confirmed it was the correct thing to do.
Their non-reaction was because they knew he was still alive. At various times in the series they've all evinced strong emotional reactions to the mere notion of him dying. If he had died for real, they'd have been showing it for sure, even if some of them might have restrained themselves in public. We see nothing of their private reactions, just the public consumption. My long-standing contention on emotional behavior (in real life as well) is that feelings are like bowel movements. Just because everybody has them, is no excuse for publicly expressing them. Also, some of them who are not Min were fairly busy with the whole "running the world" gig.

What bothers me as much as any of this is that Nynaeve, and to a lesser extent, Perrin, are the only two of that whole lot with a heart. I can get the three stooges not crying, given that they know Rand is alive, but Egwene is dead (who was supposedly Elayne and Avi's bestest friend in the whole wide world,
There was a WAR on, like five seconds ago. They've lost whole fucktons of loved ones, but their love interests are still alive, and that thing where one of them thought her babies were going to be cut out of her stomach and offered up to the Dark One didn't happen. In a situation like that, I think you're just sitting back relieved about who DIDN'T die, rather than weeping for that one really crummy friend who spent most of her time asserting that they couldn't be real friends anyway. Also, when you're crippled, that might be a bit more weighing on the brain than the two-faced liar who forced you to do your punishment runs really slowly before making your love life a living hell and then running off to the White Tower, and only having one other significant conversation where she tried to pry into your personal and professional secrets.

Seriously, I can't believe that you, of all people, are mad about people's failure to mourn Egwene.

and since everyone was supposedly enamored of her greatness, even Min should've felt something over the loss),

Gawyn is dead (did Elayne forget that he was the only brother she had that she doesn't despise??)...

Brother and sister-in-law dead, but boyfriend and kids survive, when by all rights, all five should be dead? Not to mention 2/3 of (formally or not) adopted (and thus ones she chose out of preference, rather than getting stuck with them by birth) sisters, surviving and the exception having an even happier ending than surviving. I'd call that a win, and that is assuming the maybe five total minutes of face time we saw with Elayne completely and totally encapsulated her attitudes and the totality of her emotional experiences. Hey, we didn't see any of them laugh in that portion of the book either! Does this mean they are stricken without joy for the rest of their lives? Oh, and we never saw them eat! Have they somehow gained the ability to live without food? Are they all some sort of superhuman, post-mortal being, since they no longer need food or sleep? I mean, your premise IS that if they did not do it in those post-TG scenes, they obviously have not done it off camera, nor ever will again!

Hell, Elayne lost her Warder. We KNOW that will have effects, regardless of the feelings of the individual involved, but we don't see her wracked with the grief that comes of breaking an even closer than normal bond.

yet the only person shedding tears for those lost is Nyn? I should've known she was the only one with a heart. Perrin, at least, offered her comfort and shed a few tears himself, and that shows that the man has a heart as well. But the rest of them? A bunch of cold fish. Nyn needs to extricate herself from the lot of them, save Perrin, before they end up rubbing off on her and leaving her an emotionless asshole just like them.

By the way, this book made me dislike Mat, who had been one of my favorite males for a long time. Thanks a lot, BS.
<img class=2' /> You know, all other reasons aside, you are among my favorite wotmaniacs because you make me feel SOOOO so so sane.

Come on! Egwene is DEAD! She died arguably ignominiously! Her death's big purpose was not trading her life for Rand's or some other way I was afraid if she did die (actually I never seriously considered that she might die), but rather, her death was the one to put the whole issue of death in perspective for him! It took Egwene's death to remind Rand that losing loved ones is not all that big of a deal! Even at the very end, the writers gave us this last gift of Egwene's contributions undermining her character. We should be REJOICING, not nitpicking that in the haste to wrap up 14 books over three different decades, the authors never took time to show people grieving over her! We should be taking delight in the fact that even in death, her megalomania and/or predilection for unearned honors manifests, as Egwene has to have a bigger, fancier funeral than Rand!
Cannoli
“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Inde muagdhe Aes Sedai misain ye!
Deus Vult!
*MySmiley*
Reply to message
So, is anyone else thinking that ending was a bit of a dick move.... - 10/01/2013 04:40:55 AM 3178 Views
Because, to quote the series... - 10/01/2013 05:01:51 AM 1584 Views
I had hoped a lot more people would have died. - 30/01/2013 03:28:26 PM 976 Views
Frankly, it seemed out of character. - 10/01/2013 05:08:48 AM 1286 Views
double post thanks to daughter *NM* *NM* - 10/01/2013 06:16:01 AM 506 Views
I could be wrong, but... - 10/01/2013 06:16:02 AM 1295 Views
Except... - 10/01/2013 06:54:04 AM 1291 Views
Re: Except... - 10/01/2013 06:56:43 AM 1045 Views
If the World finds out he's still alive - 10/01/2013 08:05:18 AM 1215 Views
I can agree with keeping it secret from just about everyone, BUT his father and closest friends. - 10/01/2013 10:56:58 AM 1201 Views
Re: I can agree with keeping it secret from just about everyone, BUT his father and closest friends. - 10/01/2013 04:00:57 PM 1180 Views
Why Mat in particular? - 10/01/2013 04:07:19 PM 1041 Views
Re: Why Mat in particular? - 10/01/2013 04:20:37 PM 1154 Views
This is because I tend to assume the best in Rand - 10/01/2013 04:28:20 PM 983 Views
I don't fault Rand for any of it, at the moment.... - 10/01/2013 04:49:25 PM 1122 Views
Re: I can agree with keeping it secret from just about everyone, BUT his father and closest friends. - 11/01/2013 02:34:16 AM 1048 Views
Re: I can agree with keeping it secret from just about everyone, BUT his father and closest friends. - 13/01/2013 09:01:38 PM 1004 Views
I got the impression Egwene knew releasing the Source would instantly kill her. - 14/01/2013 11:42:03 AM 1144 Views
Re: I got the impression Egwene knew she was dead the moment she released the Source. - 14/01/2013 05:59:21 PM 985 Views
Even if she would just have been burned out there was no reason to think it permanent. - 14/01/2013 06:49:00 PM 948 Views
Where do people get that only Rand was right on the Seals? - 14/01/2013 10:03:19 PM 1126 Views
One point- the DO didn't break free, Rand dragged him out into the Pattern, specifically to kill him - 15/01/2013 03:03:43 AM 826 Views
Nope.. - 15/01/2013 03:19:02 AM 917 Views
Re: Nope.. - 15/01/2013 03:33:06 AM 1188 Views
The quote Shai'tan doesn't try and deny: - 15/01/2013 09:41:24 PM 942 Views
From Egwenes insistence they NEVER be broken. - 15/01/2013 07:26:36 AM 1105 Views
Agree 100%. Tam and Nynaeve deserve to know. - 10/01/2013 05:47:04 PM 1002 Views
Re: So, is anyone else thinking that ending was a bit of a dick move.... - 10/01/2013 07:13:52 PM 1350 Views
You don't think Nakomi did it? - 10/01/2013 07:54:20 PM 1625 Views
Maybe - 10/01/2013 09:46:39 PM 1290 Views
Re: Maybe - 10/01/2013 11:08:32 PM 1129 Views
Nope.. an agent of the Wheel - 10/01/2013 11:53:54 PM 1226 Views
IDK, I thought the body switch was a side-effect of the link between them - 11/01/2013 02:38:33 AM 1088 Views
*NM* *NM* - 11/01/2013 06:51:10 PM 498 Views
I've a suspiscion that the Rand scene of Epilogue was probably drafted already - 12/01/2013 12:11:13 AM 1114 Views
That makes a great deal of sense. - 15/01/2013 07:45:55 AM 1067 Views
Re: That makes a great deal of sense. - 15/01/2013 09:37:47 AM 902 Views
More the three sisters - 20/01/2013 04:55:36 PM 833 Views

Reply to Message