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Re: Egwene said otherwise DomA,... fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 18/10/2012 01:23:48 AM

Rulers who want an advisor ask for one, or ask a sister they have met and are comfortable with to fill that role. Sisters who go to rulers and even more nobles most likely do it out of their own initiative (it's what they wish to do as Aes Sedai, be accepted somewhere as advisor) or go under incitive from their Ajah leader who sees interest for the Ajah (I'm betting this is how the Green manage to secure posts as advisors in the Borderlands).

That doesn't make much sense. It totally doesn't fit the Hall's usual MO to simply allow rulers to chose who they like. Maintaining the Tower's relationship with the nations is an extremely important job, and the Aes Sedai advisors to the rulers are some of the most influential Aes Sedai. They're the representatives of the Tower in the court of the rulers. No way is the Hall letting those jobs go without the Ajahs jostling for the influence to be gained by them.
I'm not saying it's never done for the Hall to manoeuvre for a specific sister to be sent to a ruler who lost his advisor, in the hope the ruler would find her agreeable and ask her to join his/her court, but I don't think the fact Elaida became Morgase's advisor had much of anything to do with her strength, nor would the Hall would have done anything had someone like Daigian been the one who got close to Morgase and been asked to become advisor.

I think exactly the reverse is true. I think the Hall maneuvers all the time, and issues like strength in the Power, experience, prior relationship with the rulers, etc. are major points around which the maneuvering revolves. A sister like Daigian isn't impossible as a candidate, but at the stage of her Aes Sedai career that Elaida was, a Daigian would have found things a lot harder.

In Andor in particular, it sounds likely the Queens often asked a sister she met and liked during her studies at the Tower.

Highly unlikely. Morgase was in a unique position of being raised Queen soon after her Tower training. In normal circumstances, the Daighter Heir likely already has a strong relationship with her mother's advisor, and unless a serious break in relations occurs, or the advisor is recalled to the Tower for another job, I don't see how a woman she meets in her few years in the Tower will end up exceeding the many of her formative years she'd have spent with her mother's advisor. Let's remember that unlike Elaida, many other advisors likely have warmer relationships with the monarch's families.

Elaida also had a rare gift in that she saw that Morgase was likely to be queen before the succession was finished, and the previous advisor to Andor wouldn't see her cozying up to Morgase as interference in another sister's affairs (since Gitara had been raised Keeper).

The hierarchy of AS is "secret". To the outside world, outside the Sitters and Amyrlin, a shawl is a shawl.

But of course. I'm not saying the rulers pick the strongest Aes Sedai!

I can't find your answer, the thread's too big.

Here:

"Aes Sedai, then. I wasn't raised Amyrlin because I am the strongest. The wisest women are chosen for the Hall or to be ambassadors or advisors, the most skillful anyway, not those with the most strength."


This is Egwene in aCoS, so she's still naive. But her statement that Sitters, ambassadors and advisors are chosen is pretty clear. There's no way she wouldn't know about this by this point, and no way Siuan wouldn't have corrected her on it.

Also, consider this, from the BWB:

Whether or not love was involved, Ishara knew she needed both Maravaile’s army and the White Tower’s goodwill. Marrying Souran gave her the first; sending her eldest daughter to study in the Tower gained her the second as well as an Aes Sedai advisor named Ballair. She was the first ruler to have an Aes Sedai advisor.

Its pretty clear Bellair came as part of the deal, and not someone Ishara picked.

To all outward appearances, Hawkwing eventually made a peace with the White Tower, if not one with a signed treaty, of course, for Tar Valon was not likely to admit that it had been opposing him. In FY 954, he accepted an Aes Sedai advisor, Chowin Tsao of the Green Ajah. Rulers fighting him also still had advisors from Tar Valon, of course, but the White Tower had always maintained a public stance of neutrality, and it appears that he accepted this posture at least in public.

Apparently a temporary break occurred during the Black Years. Chowin Tsao is his advisor in a fragmentary letter reliably dated in FY 962, but another letter (probably FY 967, by internal evidence) states that “after five years the High King has reconciled with Tar Valon and agreed to accept once more a counselor from among the sisters.”

Again, Hawkwing was sent an advisor, who he accepted. If the Tower would send an advisor to Hawkwing himself, do you think they'll give up that for lesser rulers?
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Misc observations from my latest re-read - 14/10/2012 08:26:37 PM 2820 Views
How does LTT know about Far Madding's history? - 14/10/2012 08:29:13 PM 1398 Views
How Stong was Gitara? - 14/10/2012 08:34:43 PM 1299 Views
So so stong. She had incredible stength. - 14/10/2012 09:04:15 PM 1369 Views
Degree of slowing is the same as how long they will live - 14/10/2012 09:22:23 PM 1169 Views
Re: Degree of slowing is the same as how long they will live - 14/10/2012 09:36:19 PM 995 Views
Not in the mood to deal with you ... Go read the Ages section of 13th Depository - 14/10/2012 09:53:14 PM 1000 Views
Not interested in Linda's private theories. - 15/10/2012 02:29:41 AM 1150 Views
And there's Sorilea... - 15/10/2012 02:53:15 AM 1207 Views
Perhaps, but Bair is in her 80s and can't channel at all - 15/10/2012 03:09:35 AM 961 Views
Problem is... - 14/10/2012 11:52:00 PM 1124 Views
Again, my point isn't about motivations for Elaida or Gitara ... that is clear - 15/10/2012 12:07:49 AM 963 Views
Show me where in the books an adviser is selected by Tower authorities! - 15/10/2012 02:58:19 AM 983 Views
Yet look what happens the minute a Stronger woman showed up - 15/10/2012 03:19:18 AM 926 Views
Re: Yet look what happens the minute a Stronger woman showed up - 15/10/2012 03:35:10 AM 1073 Views
Yet Morgase herself states she didn't consider Elaida a friend - 15/10/2012 03:45:45 AM 901 Views
How did Gareth Bryne get to stay Captain General, given his lack of respect to Aes Sedai? - 15/10/2012 04:07:07 AM 982 Views
He was banging the queen - 15/10/2012 04:19:24 AM 936 Views
And what Aes Sedai gave him permission to bang the queen? - 15/10/2012 04:30:42 AM 1184 Views
here ya go - 15/10/2012 04:39:29 AM 1046 Views
There's an awful lot for "not many" - 15/10/2012 05:07:30 AM 976 Views
When did I say I bought into Linda's theories? - 15/10/2012 05:29:27 AM 911 Views
Re: Again, my point isn't about motivations for Elaida or Gitara ... that is clear - 15/10/2012 03:15:18 AM 1026 Views
The thing is Elaida had no experience in the arena at all - 15/10/2012 03:25:10 AM 964 Views
IT IS NOT THE TOWER'S DAMNED JOB! She had more than enough credentials for ANDOR - 15/10/2012 03:45:15 AM 979 Views
Nope. Every other advisor we've seen has been sent from TV - 15/10/2012 03:50:07 AM 963 Views
Those are not official advisers, those are ambassadors! - 15/10/2012 04:17:51 AM 1018 Views
So now you are saying that Elaida was a personal advisor not an envoy of the Tower? - 15/10/2012 04:22:31 AM 936 Views
Finally! I was beginning to despair of your literacy! - 15/10/2012 04:34:18 AM 1035 Views
now I am questioning your literacy *NM* - 15/10/2012 04:40:45 AM 660 Views
She didn't "land it". She took the job for herself... - 15/10/2012 04:00:35 AM 967 Views
Actually every advisor we've seen except Elaida has been appointed - 15/10/2012 04:11:39 AM 981 Views
You can bully someone into an act, not a twenty year relationship - 15/10/2012 04:22:16 AM 1093 Views
Not arguing that Morgase had a problem with her - 15/10/2012 04:33:10 AM 913 Views
We know nothing of the sort. - 15/10/2012 05:14:54 AM 911 Views
Prove that Elaida's post was not Tower sanctioned - 15/10/2012 05:39:23 AM 1006 Views
Re: Prove that Elaida's post was not Tower sanctioned - 17/10/2012 04:15:37 AM 1033 Views
Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 17/10/2012 05:33:01 AM 992 Views
Re: Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 17/10/2012 01:01:47 PM 1075 Views
Just to be clear - 17/10/2012 03:58:58 PM 916 Views
Re: Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 18/10/2012 01:23:48 AM 1010 Views
Elayne's thoughts about this - 17/10/2012 04:16:38 PM 963 Views
And an answer to the rest of your "points" - 15/10/2012 02:48:07 AM 1168 Views
Again. I refer you to Linda's blog. The relevant quotes are there ... Enjoy - 15/10/2012 02:52:03 AM 971 Views
Oh for the love of...! Here's the relevant quote: - 15/10/2012 04:04:48 AM 1050 Views
Okay, but that's still irrelevant to the Oath Rod & its cutoff period or method, as well as lifespan - 15/10/2012 04:54:26 AM 972 Views
To quote you RTDB - 15/10/2012 05:16:56 AM 918 Views
Re: To quote you RTDB - 15/10/2012 05:27:47 AM 988 Views
Some people look young. - 15/10/2012 05:51:25 AM 880 Views
I never mentioned the OR... - 16/10/2012 01:38:48 AM 989 Views
RJ said Sharina would go back to about middle aged - 16/10/2012 02:23:21 AM 805 Views
And that is probably the ONLY quote that wasn't on Linda's page *NM* - 15/10/2012 04:55:33 AM 589 Views
Told you so. *NM* - 15/10/2012 05:21:58 AM 691 Views
I think so. - 16/11/2012 11:40:17 AM 1140 Views
Aging - 15/10/2012 06:08:47 PM 986 Views
How old was Lanfear? - 14/10/2012 08:41:35 PM 1006 Views
Re: How old was Lanfear? - 14/10/2012 11:27:12 PM 1104 Views
I couldn't find it - 15/10/2012 12:22:43 AM 999 Views
Are the Seanchan prophesies false? - 14/10/2012 08:43:55 PM 1148 Views
I've only been saying no for years. - 14/10/2012 09:21:43 PM 1204 Views
Not the same thing - 14/10/2012 09:44:43 PM 979 Views
Show me some damn PROOF already!! - 15/10/2012 03:19:18 AM 1124 Views
Re: I've only been saying no for years. - 14/10/2012 10:15:29 PM 1188 Views
Your argument is based on a faulty premise. - 15/10/2012 08:11:19 PM 844 Views
Of course there is truth... - 14/10/2012 09:42:24 PM 1072 Views
Didn't know Bsand had confirmed the corruption. Thanks for sharing - 14/10/2012 10:02:40 PM 1017 Views
Re: Didn't know Bsand had confirmed the corruption. Thanks for sharing - 14/10/2012 10:23:17 PM 1019 Views
Hmmm ...I like it! It is actually very similar to what Nynaeve does - 14/10/2012 10:31:48 PM 1108 Views
How do the Black Ajah not figure out who the others are? - 14/10/2012 08:48:14 PM 1013 Views
Who says they can't? - 14/10/2012 09:23:11 PM 1017 Views
True to a point - 14/10/2012 10:00:01 PM 908 Views
Was Sheriam ranking? Would many of them have met her? Not everyone even gets to meet the SC. - 15/10/2012 03:23:16 AM 980 Views
Perhaps not. But a woman like Sheriam would stick out - 15/10/2012 03:37:12 AM 930 Views
Re: Was Sheriam ranking? Would many of them have met her? Not everyone even gets to meet the SC. - 15/10/2012 03:52:39 AM 987 Views
But isn't it interesting that Sheriam and Galina, both young and strong are on the SC? - 15/10/2012 04:06:38 AM 881 Views
Galina isn't young. *NM* - 17/10/2012 03:24:30 AM 671 Views
Yes she is - 17/10/2012 03:46:39 PM 1029 Views
85 years being BA, 90 years as a sister does not qualify her as a "young AS" - 18/10/2012 05:35:33 PM 997 Views
She is not dissimilar to Sheriam when she made her rise IMO - 18/10/2012 06:53:54 PM 939 Views
Re: She is not dissimilar to Sheriam when she made her rise IMO - 18/10/2012 08:10:58 PM 989 Views
I think Linda is correct in this particular instance - 19/10/2012 02:14:23 AM 1053 Views
You mean the SC? - 14/10/2012 10:47:31 PM 1029 Views
No others meet as well - 14/10/2012 11:01:21 PM 1040 Views
Re: No others meet as well - 14/10/2012 11:36:50 PM 1000 Views
Yet rank and file BA have methods of communicating - 15/10/2012 12:14:36 AM 884 Views
Re: Yet rank and file BA have methods of communicating - 15/10/2012 03:26:59 AM 944 Views
I concede that the rank and file likely don't meet in large groups - 15/10/2012 04:54:04 AM 908 Views
Re: I concede that the rank and file likely don't meet in large groups - 15/10/2012 02:28:45 PM 1027 Views
I agree that RJ probably had some thing up his sleeve - 15/10/2012 03:01:20 PM 837 Views
Re: I agree that RJ probably had some thing up his sleeve - 15/10/2012 05:57:04 PM 1125 Views
I have a different opinion of Delana - 16/10/2012 01:20:32 AM 1176 Views
Re: I have a different opinion of Delana - 16/10/2012 11:51:34 PM 935 Views
Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 02:55:19 AM 989 Views
Re: Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 03:40:54 PM 867 Views
Give the sign to a woman and see how she reacts - 18/10/2012 06:57:38 PM 1009 Views
Re: Give the sign to a woman and see how she reacts - 18/10/2012 07:26:56 PM 924 Views
Not a good plan, I'll give you that - 18/10/2012 07:37:45 PM 1063 Views
*sigh* - 18/10/2012 08:25:23 PM 1007 Views
*double sigh* - 19/10/2012 04:03:00 AM 930 Views
Re: *double sigh* - 19/10/2012 05:48:25 PM 953 Views
Agreed *NM* - 20/10/2012 04:57:18 PM 569 Views
Re: Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 04:59:25 PM 1044 Views
Not conclusive ... in fact the whole bit is vague ... I wonder if RJ would have given us more detail - 18/10/2012 07:23:30 PM 1017 Views
Not conclusive? - 18/10/2012 08:49:49 PM 890 Views
Don't put words in my mouth that I never said - 19/10/2012 04:08:22 AM 884 Views
double post *NM* - 19/10/2012 04:08:22 AM 584 Views
Is there a Dark Friend WO? - 14/10/2012 08:51:16 PM 1080 Views
Re: Is there a Dark Friend WO? - 17/10/2012 08:33:27 PM 1113 Views
I'd like to see more discussion on this; I'm curious as well - 18/10/2012 12:44:35 AM 889 Views
Just a note about Bair - 18/10/2012 07:53:45 AM 1014 Views
I don't see how it could be possible - 23/10/2012 09:31:51 PM 896 Views
Galad and Gaywn ... Channlers? - 14/10/2012 10:47:55 PM 1165 Views
Re: Galad and Gaywn ... Channlers? - 14/10/2012 11:36:25 PM 1087 Views

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