I've long since accepted that Sanderson uses inaccurate terms like "powerful"
darius_sedai Send a noteboard - 29/09/2012 05:44:11 AM
Sanderson's Dialogue Sucks Trolloc balls .
I understand why TV shows have characters call each other "bro" or "sis" or "son" or "cousin" in the pilot episode. The need to establish the relationship between two characters is necessary, and for some reason, everyone is terrified of doing it any other way than a natural conversation, that sounds UNnatural with people using terms no one uses in conversation anymore. However, when two characters who were best friends in the first book of a series are talking in the fourteenth book, there is no need to use verbal cues to establish that they are friends to the casual reader who flips open the book in a store.
Sometimes when I re-read a book, I try to imagine having stopped reading the series at some arbitrary earlier part, and then try to imagine what reading, say, tPoD is like when you stopped at tDR and have no awareness of tSR through aCoS. Now I'm trying to imagine the reader who read aMoL ch 1 and was inspired to pick up EotW and his impressions thereof.
I understand why TV shows have characters call each other "bro" or "sis" or "son" or "cousin" in the pilot episode. The need to establish the relationship between two characters is necessary, and for some reason, everyone is terrified of doing it any other way than a natural conversation, that sounds UNnatural with people using terms no one uses in conversation anymore. However, when two characters who were best friends in the first book of a series are talking in the fourteenth book, there is no need to use verbal cues to establish that they are friends to the casual reader who flips open the book in a store.
Sometimes when I re-read a book, I try to imagine having stopped reading the series at some arbitrary earlier part, and then try to imagine what reading, say, tPoD is like when you stopped at tDR and have no awareness of tSR through aCoS. Now I'm trying to imagine the reader who read aMoL ch 1 and was inspired to pick up EotW and his impressions thereof.
I'm pretty tuned into the tone of all the Forsaken chapters, and this once again missed the target significantly.
Sanderson is totally out of touch with the Forsaken and their characters. Darius is looking for a reason why Moghedien laughed at Graendal - the reason is that Brandon doesn't get Moghedien, she wouldn't do such a thing. In the last book we're left with Graendal screaming in terror at the hands of SH, and in this book she's unaffected. In fact, she Travels to the meeting and tells Moridin she doesn't have time for this nonsense - something Graendal herself didn't do. Was she even punished by SH?
Reading the chapter was only made tolerable by our lust for information and the answers to the mysteries surrounding the series. As I said before we are tormented by the same mundane facts. We have been told about the mystery of Cyndane in every Forsaken tea party since WH. Demandred's damned hooked nose is back... damn the man. But even worse, Demandred is NOT handsome. He is almost handsome - that's the whole point. Of course we are further tormented by the fact that Demandred is a mystery - that is also a recurring theme in the tea parties.
The metaphors are excruciating... "Graendal sent her a glare that would have set the oceans on fire" or something similar. Compare this to how Semirhage merely used to knit to unnerve Mesaana, or how the Forsaken are silenced merely by seeing the saa in Moridin's eyes. Moridin says that Hesselam was a fool to object to Taim and then nothing happens. Some punishment. Moridin said in the last tea party that these are the last days and they must prepare themselves, and blow me down, he says it again at the end of this one. Can you say lack of plot progression? The entire chapter transpires to : Taim is Chosen, Graendal is Hesselam and Moghedien must help Demandred do heaven knows what. No one asks about Aran'gar, Semirhage or Mesaana (they used to when someone was missing). Moridin says there are too few of them but they don't bring back some of the original fallen Forsaken like Aginor.
There are also errors in the ways in which they speak. Who didn't laugh when they first read 'darkness within'? It's appeared before though. Moghedien refers to Hesselam as powerful. They don't speak like that, especially because they don't consider strength in the Power to be power. They always mention her potential, or ability but know that with their inferior training they are still children. The Forsaken don't even consider their peers to be powerful. Unless I'm mistaken its the first time a Forsaken has referred to anyone as powerful. It goes against their belief that they are the most powerful, and the statement implies superiority in another channeler.
I can even deal with that simply being stylistic most of the time. But you are correct in the missing nuance of the POV character flushing out information on both themselves and those around them. The knitting bit with Mesaana is a fabulous example of a subtle note Jordan played ... Clearly it unnerved Mesaana, who didn't realize it was precisely Semirhage's normalcy juxtaposed with her sadistic nature that was the root of what made Mesaana uncomfortable! Someone as logical and calculated as Mesaana can not understand the unpredictable nature of Semirhage. To Mesaana Semirhage should always be a sadist and is therefore compartmentalized as a monsterous person ... Thus normal behaviors disarm Mesaana.
Moghedien's lack of notice to her own lack of caution is the most surprising bit to me ... Jordan would have woven something into her thoughts about it. Sanderson did a fair job of getting the point across, but it's been long enough since we've had a Moghedien POV and she has been up to god only knows what tasks (that seemed to have earned her some credit) ... That we need some background before she simply leaps to openly mocking a person she obviously feared before and then starts thinking of herself as equal to a group of people she once feared to even be in the same room with! RJ would have woven in some juice hints about WHY.
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
If you have to call someone "my friend" three times in a couple of minutes, he isn't.
28/09/2012 11:59:13 AM
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The only people I've ever heard say "my friend" are foreign street vendors
28/09/2012 01:19:00 PM
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Sanderson's handling of character interractions is pathetic....
28/09/2012 06:43:48 PM
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Now see, here I don't fully agree, or at least think it's a matter of taste.
28/09/2012 07:21:09 PM
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Sorry, that's just not true...
28/09/2012 11:33:59 PM
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I posted something very similar at DM. Reposting...
28/09/2012 11:46:07 PM
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I complained about this regarding the Forsaken chapter
28/09/2012 07:34:25 PM
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I've long since accepted that Sanderson uses inaccurate terms like "powerful"
29/09/2012 05:44:11 AM
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To be fair, the last Moghedian PoV by RJ might have changed her a bit.
29/09/2012 03:27:31 PM
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Yes. The last time it happened to me it ended with the taxi driver fined by the NYPD.
29/09/2012 07:05:26 AM
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The burning question to me, after reading all of the comments above, is this...
29/09/2012 08:50:50 AM
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Piggybacking on someone else's established characters and near-climax-point plot?
29/09/2012 03:04:03 PM
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Both of you disgust me
29/09/2012 04:13:16 PM
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To be fair...
29/09/2012 04:36:52 PM
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True ... He may not be perfect, and he certainly made some strange choices
29/09/2012 05:37:29 PM
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B-Sand is not a ghost writer
29/09/2012 06:35:16 PM
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Didn't say he should.
29/09/2012 09:07:45 PM
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What is it you want?
29/09/2012 09:39:36 PM
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We want to bitch about an inferior product. Duh.
29/09/2012 10:00:09 PM
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Hmm that's true I guess. Sad though *NM*
29/09/2012 10:07:25 PM
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It is what it is
30/09/2012 12:52:20 AM
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You do know this isn't his series, right?
29/09/2012 04:19:00 PM
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Do you see us going to Mistborn boards to rip his series? Part of the problem is what you say.
29/09/2012 09:57:54 PM
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Apologies for not being clear: I'm only referring to WoT. Haven't read any of his other work...
30/09/2012 06:56:08 PM
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I'd agree that I like his original works more than his WoT books
01/10/2012 06:17:33 PM
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It's fairly simple....
30/09/2012 09:55:52 PM
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Thanks for that insightful response...
30/09/2012 10:37:27 PM
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Try reading something instead of judging. I recommend the Mistborn trilogy *NM*
01/10/2012 01:14:24 AM
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It's more...
01/10/2012 01:05:18 PM
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Re: The burning question to me, after reading all of the comments above, is this...
11/10/2012 08:22:27 PM
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I have an acquaintance who uses "my friend" as punctuation of every sentence.
05/10/2012 02:47:40 PM
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