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Re: Not sure that's completely true.. DomA Send a noteboard - 26/09/2012 03:02:41 PM
I still find far more likely she's referring to information she got from her own BA. Moghedien in book 4 showed a disctinct lack of knowledge and interest in what didn't concern her little domain in the south. She didn't even know Rand's name.

Beside, as we know Moghedien is still running those BA. She had no need to go to the Tower to get Alviarin to tell her what one of her own pet BA could tell her. Notice she doesn't even wonder if Hessalam could be Sharina. She simply has no idea Sharina exists. She must have thought an instant Hessalam was BA - perhaps even that she was their leader or something.

I don't think the new scene tells us much about strength, but I get the feeling Moghedien was probably always underestimated because of her personality.

I don't think she's much weaker than the others, probably just by something like the difference between book 4 Nynaeve and Nynaeve at full potential. I think Nynaeve at full potential is probably in the range of the levels on which Graendal, Semiraghe, Mesaana stand. She could be on a level lower for instance, or at the lower threshold of the same level, or their equal more or less. I get the feeling all those women are distributed on few levels, a few below Lanfear.

It could be significant, but in that range it's far more the combination of knowledge, training, experience, Talents and skills that would set these women apart than raw strength, and in combat it's only if they find themselves in a head-to-head confrontation strength could be a determining factor. I think only Lanfear/Cyndane has a clear raw strength advantage over the other women - which is useful only in some situtations, and even then they're all strong enough they'd probably dare attack her if they had a plan they believe would neutralize her strength advantage.. Graendal did... with a small angreal and her most potent weave she took Moghedien and Cyndane face on, both at once.

Moghedien simply overcame most of her complex of inferiority since the Cleansing. The fact she was in disgrace and humilitated still made her feel inferior to the others, but now that Graendal's joined the club Moghedien realized Graendal no longer intimidates her at all and she dared laughed at her openly. What the scene tells us about their respective strengths is more or less only that Moghedien's not weaker nearly enough to stop her from provoking Graendal. It was more a matter of complex of inferiority and lack of self-confidence that made her stood aside to an extent, made her avoid being openly challenging because she feared confronting them openly. Not anymore, not for Graendal anyway. She already seemed not to fear Cyndane much.
This message last edited by DomA on 26/09/2012 at 03:05:03 PM
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AMOL Prologue : Analysis of Forsaken section *major spoilers* - 19/09/2012 05:47:21 PM 3169 Views
You left out that Taim and Demandred have met before. - 19/09/2012 06:19:01 PM 1427 Views
Part of me keeps screaming Logain, though that can't be right... - 20/09/2012 12:14:00 PM 1385 Views
I thought of Logain as well... - 20/09/2012 06:10:58 PM 1254 Views
We have our answer as to why Cyndane and Moiraine are reduced in power. - 20/09/2012 05:14:01 AM 1309 Views
It was spelled out before. - 20/09/2012 05:25:05 AM 1189 Views
And some of us guessed that's what happened, we just didn't have evidence. *NM* - 20/09/2012 12:04:18 PM 684 Views
Nor a lot of support for the idea... - 22/09/2012 06:28:14 PM 1173 Views
Really? Seemed like the obvious series of events - 23/09/2012 02:32:35 PM 1118 Views
I know... - 23/09/2012 05:30:42 PM 1165 Views
I'm not so sure - 24/09/2012 05:32:50 PM 1153 Views
Why question it? - 25/09/2012 01:40:39 AM 1039 Views
Re: Why question it? - 25/09/2012 06:12:32 AM 993 Views
Six Chosen... - 20/09/2012 05:19:17 AM 1354 Views
It's fan fiction, but it's cannon fan fiction - 20/09/2012 06:55:18 AM 1319 Views
Demandred - the wasted Forsaken - 20/09/2012 08:14:15 PM 1216 Views
RJ's writing was bad. Sanderson's is far worse. *NM* - 21/09/2012 06:19:04 AM 687 Views
Re: Demandred - the wasted Forsaken - 22/09/2012 07:23:19 PM 1115 Views
Talmanes - 23/09/2012 12:42:27 AM 1520 Views
Re: Talmanes - 02/10/2012 03:27:05 PM 968 Views
Two interesting Forsaken issues you haven't raised - 22/09/2012 06:21:34 PM 1352 Views
Seems to me that Taim himself was behind going to Rand - 23/09/2012 02:53:32 AM 1075 Views
Re: Seems to me that Taim himself was behind going to Rand - 23/09/2012 05:50:48 PM 1122 Views
I think I rebel against this thought process because of the Taimandred Red Herring - 23/09/2012 06:35:19 PM 1049 Views
Re: I think I rebel against this thought process because of the Taimandred Red Herring - 23/09/2012 07:46:59 PM 1292 Views
The first time we hear about Transmigration is in LOC - 23/09/2012 08:50:10 PM 1300 Views
Why was Ishamael reinstantiated as Nae'blis after his death? - 02/10/2012 10:17:03 PM 1136 Views
I have to wonder at Hessalam - 23/09/2012 01:20:13 PM 1320 Views
Re: I have to wonder at Hessalam - 23/09/2012 06:52:10 PM 1375 Views
Re: I have to wonder at Hessalam - 24/09/2012 05:18:29 PM 1536 Views
I don't think she's old. Just really really really ugly! - 25/09/2012 03:22:56 AM 1020 Views
Re: I don't think she's old. Just really really really ugly! - 25/09/2012 06:13:51 AM 1076 Views
So based on this new info, what is Demandred's big game? Shara or Isle of Madmen back on the table? - 23/09/2012 08:01:03 PM 1138 Views
Re: So based on this new info, what is Demandred's big game? - 23/09/2012 08:52:48 PM 1249 Views
Interesting... - 23/09/2012 09:06:18 PM 1067 Views
Re: Interesting... - 23/09/2012 11:31:31 PM 1274 Views
Just one comment.. - 23/09/2012 11:53:09 PM 1749 Views
If I had to take a guess right now I'd say he has been setting up various Shadow armies thought the - 23/09/2012 09:30:34 PM 1067 Views
I think at the very least he has recreated the One-and-Eighty male channelers from the AOL... - 23/09/2012 09:34:56 PM 1162 Views
As I said he will almost certainly have Channelers - 23/09/2012 09:47:53 PM 1310 Views
All he needed to do was train 10 guys personally.. - 23/09/2012 09:51:46 PM 971 Views
It took Taim nearly a year to train a dozen men to a place where they could teach - 23/09/2012 10:00:40 PM 940 Views
The world is 25,000 miles by 25,000 miles in size... - 23/09/2012 10:15:22 PM 1047 Views
That is just far fetched ... I think I would laugh out loud if that is the case - 23/09/2012 10:43:37 PM 1042 Views
Direct quote from Demandred refutes this... - 23/09/2012 10:49:10 PM 1020 Views
Demanded is much more like Mesaana in his ways - 23/09/2012 10:55:00 PM 1051 Views
Re: Demanded is much more like Mesaana in his ways - 23/09/2012 11:36:54 PM 1061 Views
Not really - 24/09/2012 12:31:48 AM 1099 Views
"My rule is secure." Could Demandred be ruling an entire Mirror World? - 23/09/2012 10:43:51 PM 1142 Views
I can certainly something like this happening - 23/09/2012 10:50:35 PM 940 Views
I'm not sure it's possible... - 24/09/2012 03:02:26 AM 1079 Views
I think ... - 24/09/2012 05:36:38 PM 1056 Views
The changes in Moghedien - 25/09/2012 03:29:15 AM 940 Views
I believe she commented on Graendal's strength, comparing it to Nynaeve or something? - 25/09/2012 11:07:24 PM 1086 Views
Well.. - 25/09/2012 11:15:21 PM 944 Views
Thanks for the quote, but reading that, it kind of implies the opposite, to me... - 25/09/2012 11:35:53 PM 1258 Views
Hmmm.... - 26/09/2012 12:00:33 AM 999 Views
Hehe, that old argument again. - 26/09/2012 12:09:25 AM 889 Views
Yes. - 26/09/2012 12:58:03 AM 882 Views
I agree the Forsaken are all pretty close in effective Strength - 26/09/2012 04:11:16 AM 991 Views
Re: I agree the Forsaken are all pretty close in effective Strength - 26/09/2012 08:53:02 AM 945 Views
Well... - 26/09/2012 09:09:38 AM 911 Views
Re: Well... - 26/09/2012 10:17:03 AM 1045 Views
Nice speculation. I like that type of calculation. - 26/09/2012 10:59:43 AM 978 Views
Re: Well... - 27/09/2012 03:12:06 AM 936 Views
Re: Well... - 27/09/2012 08:17:07 AM 894 Views
Re: I agree the Forsaken are all pretty close in effective Strength - 27/09/2012 03:00:04 AM 992 Views
Re: I agree the Forsaken are all pretty close in effective Strength - 27/09/2012 07:23:11 AM 984 Views
Actually...... - 26/09/2012 02:30:00 AM 1051 Views
Agree with this.. - 26/09/2012 06:12:34 AM 867 Views
Not sure that's completely true.. - 26/09/2012 06:42:51 AM 912 Views
Re: Not sure that's completely true.. - 26/09/2012 03:02:41 PM 1070 Views
This is what I've been saying for years! - 26/09/2012 05:48:01 PM 792 Views
Re: Not sure that's completely true.. - 27/09/2012 03:17:00 AM 952 Views
Probably something like this - 26/09/2012 08:36:40 AM 968 Views
Probably true, but maybe a hint from a Sanderson interview should be considered here... - 26/09/2012 08:56:32 AM 929 Views
Re: Probably true, but maybe a hint from a Sanderson interview should be considered here... - 26/09/2012 10:01:08 AM 875 Views
Graendal almost has to be Stronger than Nynaeve - 26/09/2012 05:57:35 PM 1124 Views
One thing about that... - 27/09/2012 02:58:56 AM 1012 Views
Possible, but I find it unlikely - 27/09/2012 06:16:56 AM 911 Views
The reason I think that... - 27/09/2012 06:25:48 AM 951 Views
I always assumed Nynaeve at the top was a list he later revised as he decided to bring in - 27/09/2012 06:39:35 AM 1030 Views
Of course that's the correct answer, yes. - 27/09/2012 08:12:45 AM 1088 Views
I wasn't making a Strength comparison ... I was commenting on her lack of cowardice - 26/09/2012 03:45:36 AM 991 Views
Re: I wasn't making a Strength comparison ... I was commenting on her lack of cowardice - 26/09/2012 05:30:36 PM 1061 Views
That is the question I was getting at - 26/09/2012 06:00:03 PM 1021 Views
Re: That is the question I was getting at - 26/09/2012 07:01:34 PM 1048 Views

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