I still find far more likely she's referring to information she got from her own BA. Moghedien in book 4 showed a disctinct lack of knowledge and interest in what didn't concern her little domain in the south. She didn't even know Rand's name.
Beside, as we know Moghedien is still running those BA. She had no need to go to the Tower to get Alviarin to tell her what one of her own pet BA could tell her. Notice she doesn't even wonder if Hessalam could be Sharina. She simply has no idea Sharina exists. She must have thought an instant Hessalam was BA - perhaps even that she was their leader or something.
I don't think the new scene tells us much about strength, but I get the feeling Moghedien was probably always underestimated because of her personality.
I don't think she's much weaker than the others, probably just by something like the difference between book 4 Nynaeve and Nynaeve at full potential. I think Nynaeve at full potential is probably in the range of the levels on which Graendal, Semiraghe, Mesaana stand. She could be on a level lower for instance, or at the lower threshold of the same level, or their equal more or less. I get the feeling all those women are distributed on few levels, a few below Lanfear.
It could be significant, but in that range it's far more the combination of knowledge, training, experience, Talents and skills that would set these women apart than raw strength, and in combat it's only if they find themselves in a head-to-head confrontation strength could be a determining factor. I think only Lanfear/Cyndane has a clear raw strength advantage over the other women - which is useful only in some situtations, and even then they're all strong enough they'd probably dare attack her if they had a plan they believe would neutralize her strength advantage.. Graendal did... with a small angreal and her most potent weave she took Moghedien and Cyndane face on, both at once.
Moghedien simply overcame most of her complex of inferiority since the Cleansing. The fact she was in disgrace and humilitated still made her feel inferior to the others, but now that Graendal's joined the club Moghedien realized Graendal no longer intimidates her at all and she dared laughed at her openly. What the scene tells us about their respective strengths is more or less only that Moghedien's not weaker nearly enough to stop her from provoking Graendal. It was more a matter of complex of inferiority and lack of self-confidence that made her stood aside to an extent, made her avoid being openly challenging because she feared confronting them openly. Not anymore, not for Graendal anyway. She already seemed not to fear Cyndane much.
Beside, as we know Moghedien is still running those BA. She had no need to go to the Tower to get Alviarin to tell her what one of her own pet BA could tell her. Notice she doesn't even wonder if Hessalam could be Sharina. She simply has no idea Sharina exists. She must have thought an instant Hessalam was BA - perhaps even that she was their leader or something.
I don't think the new scene tells us much about strength, but I get the feeling Moghedien was probably always underestimated because of her personality.
I don't think she's much weaker than the others, probably just by something like the difference between book 4 Nynaeve and Nynaeve at full potential. I think Nynaeve at full potential is probably in the range of the levels on which Graendal, Semiraghe, Mesaana stand. She could be on a level lower for instance, or at the lower threshold of the same level, or their equal more or less. I get the feeling all those women are distributed on few levels, a few below Lanfear.
It could be significant, but in that range it's far more the combination of knowledge, training, experience, Talents and skills that would set these women apart than raw strength, and in combat it's only if they find themselves in a head-to-head confrontation strength could be a determining factor. I think only Lanfear/Cyndane has a clear raw strength advantage over the other women - which is useful only in some situtations, and even then they're all strong enough they'd probably dare attack her if they had a plan they believe would neutralize her strength advantage.. Graendal did... with a small angreal and her most potent weave she took Moghedien and Cyndane face on, both at once.
Moghedien simply overcame most of her complex of inferiority since the Cleansing. The fact she was in disgrace and humilitated still made her feel inferior to the others, but now that Graendal's joined the club Moghedien realized Graendal no longer intimidates her at all and she dared laughed at her openly. What the scene tells us about their respective strengths is more or less only that Moghedien's not weaker nearly enough to stop her from provoking Graendal. It was more a matter of complex of inferiority and lack of self-confidence that made her stood aside to an extent, made her avoid being openly challenging because she feared confronting them openly. Not anymore, not for Graendal anyway. She already seemed not to fear Cyndane much.
This message last edited by DomA on 26/09/2012 at 03:05:03 PM
AMOL Prologue : Analysis of Forsaken section *major spoilers*
- 19/09/2012 05:47:21 PM
3372 Views
You left out that Taim and Demandred have met before.
- 19/09/2012 06:19:01 PM
1606 Views
Part of me keeps screaming Logain, though that can't be right...
- 20/09/2012 12:14:00 PM
1553 Views
We have our answer as to why Cyndane and Moiraine are reduced in power.
- 20/09/2012 05:14:01 AM
1518 Views
It was spelled out before.
- 20/09/2012 05:25:05 AM
1356 Views
And some of us guessed that's what happened, we just didn't have evidence. *NM*
- 20/09/2012 12:04:18 PM
793 Views
Nor a lot of support for the idea...
- 22/09/2012 06:28:14 PM
1346 Views
Really? Seemed like the obvious series of events
- 23/09/2012 02:32:35 PM
1314 Views
I know...
- 23/09/2012 05:30:42 PM
1365 Views
I'm not so sure
- 24/09/2012 05:32:50 PM
1347 Views
Why question it?
- 25/09/2012 01:40:39 AM
1203 Views
Re: Why question it?
- 25/09/2012 06:12:32 AM
1192 Views
No she doesn't. She focuses on Graendal's punishment being about her looks
- 25/09/2012 04:10:04 PM
1426 Views
Re: No she doesn't. She focuses on Graendal's punishment being about her looks
- 25/09/2012 06:41:13 PM
1370 Views
Re: No she doesn't. She focuses on Graendal's punishment being about her looks
- 25/09/2012 07:21:03 PM
1325 Views
Re: No she doesn't. She focuses on Graendal's punishment being about her looks
- 25/09/2012 07:53:47 PM
1110 Views
Demandred - the wasted Forsaken
- 20/09/2012 08:14:15 PM
1411 Views
Talmanes
- 23/09/2012 12:42:27 AM
1729 Views
I think you once again overestimate my appreciation of the series.
- 25/09/2012 02:33:34 PM
1278 Views
Re: Talmanes
- 02/10/2012 03:27:05 PM
1139 Views
I'm disappointed after waiting a week for a new post in the Forsaken thread, it's about Talmanes!
- 02/10/2012 09:46:48 PM
1316 Views
Two interesting Forsaken issues you haven't raised
- 22/09/2012 06:21:34 PM
1538 Views
Seems to me that Taim himself was behind going to Rand
- 23/09/2012 02:53:32 AM
1365 Views
Re: Seems to me that Taim himself was behind going to Rand
- 23/09/2012 05:50:48 PM
1344 Views
I think I rebel against this thought process because of the Taimandred Red Herring
- 23/09/2012 06:35:19 PM
1278 Views
Re: I think I rebel against this thought process because of the Taimandred Red Herring
- 23/09/2012 07:46:59 PM
1475 Views
I have to wonder at Hessalam
- 23/09/2012 01:20:13 PM
1514 Views
Re: I have to wonder at Hessalam
- 23/09/2012 06:52:10 PM
1580 Views
I agree that B-Sand seems to have inserted Graendal into the Slayer plot line in TOM
- 23/09/2012 07:17:15 PM
1249 Views
Re: I agree that B-Sand seems to have inserted Graendal into the Slayer plot line in TOM
- 23/09/2012 08:19:02 PM
1255 Views
EDIT ... Demandred has only had about 9 months (according to wotchron)
- 23/09/2012 09:13:44 PM
1376 Views
Re: I have to wonder at Hessalam
- 24/09/2012 05:18:29 PM
1711 Views
So based on this new info, what is Demandred's big game? Shara or Isle of Madmen back on the table?
- 23/09/2012 08:01:03 PM
1326 Views
Re: So based on this new info, what is Demandred's big game?
- 23/09/2012 08:52:48 PM
1418 Views
Interesting...
- 23/09/2012 09:06:18 PM
1204 Views
Re: Interesting...
- 23/09/2012 11:31:31 PM
1442 Views
I think we saw them during the attack on Maradon. The Portal Stone attack seems less likely
- 23/09/2012 11:41:42 PM
1213 Views
If I had to take a guess right now I'd say he has been setting up various Shadow armies thought the
- 23/09/2012 09:30:34 PM
1259 Views
I think at the very least he has recreated the One-and-Eighty male channelers from the AOL...
- 23/09/2012 09:34:56 PM
1328 Views
As I said he will almost certainly have Channelers
- 23/09/2012 09:47:53 PM
1507 Views
All he needed to do was train 10 guys personally..
- 23/09/2012 09:51:46 PM
1143 Views
It took Taim nearly a year to train a dozen men to a place where they could teach
- 23/09/2012 10:00:40 PM
1140 Views
The world is 25,000 miles by 25,000 miles in size...
- 23/09/2012 10:15:22 PM
1233 Views
That is just far fetched ... I think I would laugh out loud if that is the case
- 23/09/2012 10:43:37 PM
1250 Views
Direct quote from Demandred refutes this...
- 23/09/2012 10:49:10 PM
1235 Views
Demanded is much more like Mesaana in his ways
- 23/09/2012 10:55:00 PM
1216 Views
"My rule is secure." Could Demandred be ruling an entire Mirror World?
- 23/09/2012 10:43:51 PM
1313 Views
The changes in Moghedien
- 25/09/2012 03:29:15 AM
1095 Views
I believe she commented on Graendal's strength, comparing it to Nynaeve or something?
- 25/09/2012 11:07:24 PM
1245 Views
Well..
- 25/09/2012 11:15:21 PM
1125 Views
Thanks for the quote, but reading that, it kind of implies the opposite, to me...
- 25/09/2012 11:35:53 PM
1432 Views
Hmmm....
- 26/09/2012 12:00:33 AM
1162 Views
Hehe, that old argument again.
- 26/09/2012 12:09:25 AM
1092 Views
Yes.
- 26/09/2012 12:58:03 AM
1058 Views
- 26/09/2012 12:58:03 AM
1058 Views
I agree the Forsaken are all pretty close in effective Strength
- 26/09/2012 04:11:16 AM
1207 Views
Re: I agree the Forsaken are all pretty close in effective Strength
- 26/09/2012 08:53:02 AM
1123 Views
Well...
- 26/09/2012 09:09:38 AM
1082 Views
Re: Well...
- 26/09/2012 10:17:03 AM
1234 Views
Moiraine lost more than 2/3 of her strength. Siuan lost about that and Moiraine seems
- 26/09/2012 04:46:18 PM
1306 Views
Re: I agree the Forsaken are all pretty close in effective Strength
- 27/09/2012 03:00:04 AM
1150 Views
Re: I agree the Forsaken are all pretty close in effective Strength
- 27/09/2012 07:23:11 AM
1153 Views
As always you forget book 4 is more than half way through the timeline of the series
- 26/09/2012 03:58:22 AM
1224 Views
Actually......
- 26/09/2012 02:30:00 AM
1237 Views
Not sure that's completely true..
- 26/09/2012 06:42:51 AM
1086 Views
Re: Not sure that's completely true..
- 26/09/2012 03:02:41 PM
1258 Views
Probably something like this
- 26/09/2012 08:36:40 AM
1192 Views
Probably true, but maybe a hint from a Sanderson interview should be considered here...
- 26/09/2012 08:56:32 AM
1135 Views
Re: Probably true, but maybe a hint from a Sanderson interview should be considered here...
- 26/09/2012 10:01:08 AM
1055 Views
Graendal almost has to be Stronger than Nynaeve
- 26/09/2012 05:57:35 PM
1297 Views
One thing about that...
- 27/09/2012 02:58:56 AM
1171 Views
Possible, but I find it unlikely
- 27/09/2012 06:16:56 AM
1075 Views
The reason I think that...
- 27/09/2012 06:25:48 AM
1150 Views
I always assumed Nynaeve at the top was a list he later revised as he decided to bring in
- 27/09/2012 06:39:35 AM
1205 Views
I wasn't making a Strength comparison ... I was commenting on her lack of cowardice
- 26/09/2012 03:45:36 AM
1145 Views
Re: I wasn't making a Strength comparison ... I was commenting on her lack of cowardice
- 26/09/2012 05:30:36 PM
1269 Views
